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Thread: Fatsan Bak Mei Clip

  1. #16
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    Hi Sanjuro,

    I began to wonder if we were talking about the same thing with 'machine gun' attacks. I read what you wrote, and discovered we weren't, or not exactly.

    I think 'overwhelming' attacks is probably better language for what I'm trying to describe. Those 'stand in one place and flurry your arms' demos aren't what I'm thinking of.

    First point of difference is footwork. If you're not barging over the opponent, its just show / 'demo'.

    I think of the MMA style charges with kick, punch, punch, clinch, knee, knee...

    In TCMA, you'll sometimes see a charge of straight punches that sets the opponent on their heels and smacks them backwards across the ring repeatedly.

    To me, the key technique is the pressing footwork and the taking of the opponent's space.

    So, lets put that machine gun on an APC...
    Guangzhou Pak Mei Kung Fu School, Sydney Australia,
    Sifu Leung, Yuk Seng
    Established 1989, Glebe Australia

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    A very fast combination of strikes done in a "blur"" like fashion.
    Typically done in the air or done by "tapping" a demo partner but never actually seen done in a full contact situation or with any real "power".
    Typically.
    like wing chun chain punching
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Yum Cha View Post
    To me, the key technique is the pressing footwork and the taking of the opponent's space.

    So, lets put that machine gun on an APC...

    Jik Bou.

    Sorry had to, couldn't help myself .... <slap wrist>

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Violent Designs View Post
    like wing chun chain punching
    I snickered just then, so I did.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lai See View Post
    I snickered just then, so I did.
    tell us how u really feel. dont hold back
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Violent Designs View Post
    like wing chun chain punching
    Or the things we typically see in American kenpo demos, yes.

    Here is the thing, when we actually HIT something with resistence, that thing stops ore momentum, it "throws off" our flow and it HITS back and it moves, what it never does it just stand there.
    Now, it MAY happen every blue moon that one finds a willing sucker, but we have to deal with the realities of combat and not the "hope for the best" of combat.

    Yum cha,
    If by "overwhelming attack" you mean when the striker hits and follows up based on the reaction fo the opponent then yes, I agree those work very well, but if by "overwhelming attack" you mean hitting in a predetermined sequence hoping that the target will be there, not so much.

  7. #22
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    vitor belfort vs vanderlie silva is an example of ah machine gun attack working

    he pretty much just chain punched him across the ring

    I am pork boy, the breakfast monkey.

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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by goju View Post
    vitor belfort vs vanderlie silva is an example of ah machine gun attack working

    he pretty much just chain punched him across the ring
    Not really.

    chain punch is not powerful strike. they are vertical punches suppose to be from centerline if i'm correct.

    what Vitor did was ****ing barrage power straights into Wanderlei's face. very very different mechanics.

    learn2spell
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    ... if by "overwhelming attack" you mean hitting in a predetermined sequence hoping that the target will be there, not so much.
    Hey, everybody starts with the "predetermined"sequence, any style, any art.

    That's the difference between being beginner and advanced, just how predetermined your are and how well you adapt, innovate and predict. Pretty universal concept. Do you take me for such a fool, hobbit?
    Guangzhou Pak Mei Kung Fu School, Sydney Australia,
    Sifu Leung, Yuk Seng
    Established 1989, Glebe Australia

  10. #25
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    If you really examine the systems that use "machine gun " tactics, you will find that these are openers, used to close the gap, get you in their space, inflict pain,damage, and confusion, so as to land a telling blow.
    They set up much harder finishing blows that are also found in these systems.
    Wing chun has other strikes besides chain punches, as do all the other systems.
    The problem is when people outside the system judge the entire system based on what is actually a very small portion. The problem is also that it is also what most people put out there, so who can blame them?

    As far as Kenpo goes-I think people miss the point with that. There is supposed to be complete connection with these strikes-shifting, sinking,etc. When they do demos, the strikes are faster and do not posess the power that they do when they are done correctly.
    The other thing, is sure, they are based on the opponent's body reaction to the strikes. If I hit you to the groin, your body bends forward which sets me up for the next shot, etc.
    Good Kenpo players are always in contact with their uki, controlling their bodies with grabs and checks.
    Bad Kempo players perform their dance of death, while their uki stands there with the lock-out punch.

    Why is it that the people who are the most prolific, write the most articles, are out there the most,have the biggest names...
    are usually some of the worst examples of their art?
    "My Gung-Fu may not be Your Gung-Fu.
    Gwok-Si, Gwok-Faht"

    "I will not be part of the generation
    that killed Kung-Fu."

    ....step.

  11. #26
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    Hi All

    To get back to the original topic of Bak Mei, I have seen the "machine gun" approach work very effectively. Master Zhong Luo often explains it as a quick combination of punches that are always launched from different angles (unlike chain punching). I think it is similar to combinations in western boxing, however you always alternate arms when striking in order to link the power of the strike with the recoil. This type of striking is completely linked to the ever moving bak mei foot work. You don't just stand there and flail your arms about. However, this type of punching is not typically used as an entry in bak mei. Like most martial arts it begins with a bridge or most often, with feinting and slipping to avoid the opponent's initial attack. This type of footwork and body movement is emphasized in bak mei forms and drills, however rarely shown in partner demonstrations. As TennTigers pointed out the combinations are often linked to their intended outcome on the opponent. This is where the principles of sinking, spitting, etc. of bak mei come into play. However, I can only speak for the lineage of Fushan Bak Mei, of which the gentleman in the video and Master Zhong Luo are part of. I have watched many of the videos of CLC bak mei forms and I think they are quite different.

    take care
    acuboy

  12. #27
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    Love this guys speed, power, and fluidity. For those of you who are arguing the 'machine gun' approach, one often assumes you know the the attack is coming much like an MMA match but in real world type applications, violence of action in a random encounter can make all the difference.

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