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Thread: Busted TCM practitioners

  1. #46
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    "This is exactly why I explain to people that you need to find a licensed health care practitioner rather than some unlicensed amateur who can harm you."

    The thing is that people actually can not trust any medicine based on licensure. That's only about billing and suing. If people can not sue and gain the lawyer fees that's kinda moot.
    People only have judging for their selves and their results, the chance to get a second opinion and taking more self interest. Medicine is an industry in the us and all that "my parent, my god, who understands" is mostly American imagination. More people die at the hands of state licensed people than unlicensed and in this country that exceeded 250,000 a year....10 years ago.
    I'm not sticking up for charlatans, I just felt the need to point out that generalisation, no matter how appealing, isnt accurate and relying on it alone be just as or more disastrous. There is no gauranteed safety in the habitrail for poor pilgrims and the frauds or bad calls we do see are no real justification for anything but increased self vigilance and vesture.
    Ah
    Last edited by curenado; 03-03-2015 at 09:28 AM.
    "The perfect way to do, is to be" ~ Lao Tzu

  2. #47
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    Bingo!

    Quote Originally Posted by curenado View Post
    "This is exactly why I explain to people that you need to find a licensed health care practitioner rather than some unlicensed amateur who can harm you."

    The thing is that people actually can not trust any medicine based on licensure. That's only about billing and suing. If people can not sue and gain the lawyer fees that's kinda moot.
    People only have judging for their selves and their results, the chance to get a second opinion and taking more self interest. Medicine is an industry in the us and all that "my parent, my god, who understands" is mostly American imagination. More people die at the hands of state licensed people than unlicensed and in this country that exceeded 250,000 a year....10 years ago.
    I'm not sticking up for charlatans, I just felt the need to point out that generalisation, no matter how appealing, isnt accurate and relying on it alone be just as or more disastrous. There is no gauranteed safety in the habitrail for poor pilgrims and the frauds or bad calls we do see are no real justification for anything but increased self vigilance and vesture.
    Ah
    You said it! This is exactly what is happening. The most deaths in the US per year are caused by MD and the pharmaceutical industry (who I refer to as "cartels"). Think about all the commercials you hear on TV at the end of a drug ad- side effects may include--- diarrhea, insomnia, hair loss, stomach cancer, death, etc. Well, sorry, but those aren't the "side" effects- those are possible EFFECTS of the darn c-rap, period.
    People at large need to stop relying so much on the pharmaceutical industries. I have never been injected ONCE with a vaccine or needle (well, I have some ink but that's different) and I can count on one hand the number of times I have used a pharmaceutical medicine such as cough syrup or even a tylonel. Further, I was not born in a friggin' hospital. And I am stronger than most people- I have run a marathon, train martial arts, am a hard worker, stay as positive as can be about life. People need to wake up and stop being weak. But don't take my word for it, the following is a clip from the "Fire Your MD" radio show w/ Dr. Glidden- he raps off some good statistics in the first few minutes:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmIcW_sntIw

  3. #48
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    In the US it's gotten to the point where medical people get pretty divided on some issues that are pure industry or politics.
    "The perfect way to do, is to be" ~ Lao Tzu

  4. #49
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    Xiao Hongchi

    It's a disservice to call paida 'slapping' as that really denigrates the practice. Percussive techniques exist in many forms of massage.

    At the same time, this therapist should have known that percussive massage is contraindicated for many ailments.

    Australian police probe Sydney boy Aidan Fenton's death
    1 May 2015
    From the section
    Australia


    The health centre said they had rented a room to Xiao Hongchi for a health seminar

    Australian police are investigating a seven-year-old boy's death following his attendance at a "slapping workshop" by a visiting Chinese therapist.

    Aidan Fenton from Sydney, who reportedly suffered from diabetes, was found unconscious at a hotel in a Sydney suburb on Monday.

    He and his mother had attended Xiao Hongchi's workshop on alternative therapies at a health centre in Sydney.

    Police are reportedly investigating whether he had stopped taking insulin.

    What is slapping therapy?

    Vigorously slapping various parts of the body to draw out from the body what practitioners believe are toxins
    Has significant following among Chinese communities
    Critics say it simply results in bruising

    What happens at a slapping workshop?

    Mr Xiao ran the
    workshop at the Pan Health Medical Centre
    in Hurstville, Sydney, from 22-28 April at a cost of AU$1,800 (£928, $1,420).

    'Clear the meridians'

    The therapist has been interviewed by police and has since left the country, the Sydney Morning Herald said. A spokeswoman for the New South Wales (NSW) police said this was standard procedure following any unexplained death.

    NSW police told the BBC ambulance services were called to a hotel in Hurstville after a family member found the boy unconscious.


    Traditional Chinese medicine, including cupping therapy (above). is seen as an alternative or a replacement for modern Western practices.

    "Paramedics performed CPR on the boy, but he was pronounced dead at the scene, and an investigation into the boy's death is underway," NSW police said in a statement.

    Tasly Healthpac Australia, the owner of Pan-Health Management Centre, said in a statement: "We are deeply saddened to learn the unexpected passing of this young boy... from the information that we have, the boy was not a patient of Pan-Health and had not been treated by any of our doctors.


    Xiao Hongchi advocates repeated slapping to clear the blood of toxins

    "Mr Xiao rented a room from our centre to conduct what was described to us as a series of health seminars. The boy and his mother were participants in the seminar."

    Mr Xiao, a former investment banker, advocates the practise of paida lajin, a therapy which involved slapping and stretching the body to drive out toxins.

    "The slapping and stretching work together to clear the meridians of blocks and help the body get rid of disease," he told The Hindu newspaper last month.

    He said the practice, taught to him by a Taoist monk, had "cured" several medical conditions at his workshops, including diabetes and hypertension.

    Gene Ching
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  5. #50
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    This is really a tough one - I've read a few different versions of the article but none actually states the child patient died as a result of the therapy or from injury sustained during the treatment. The child had juvenile onset diabetes and it is difficult to say whether his unfortunate death was due to the diabetes or the treatment. Maybe his parent's weren't getting him the proper treatment, which in that case, might be more fault on the parents than the practitioner.

    If a patient with a history of heart disease dies while receiving acupuncture, was it the acupuncture or the heart disease at fault?

    Just sayin'...


    herb ox

  6. #51
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    Most people don't know what a terminal deal juvenile onset diabetes is. They are the most hospitalized, hardest to stabilize and keep - I think it's so sad and hard there is not a lot of reason for constant reminder. I saw numerous nurses in my time that became nurses because they had a JOD child.

    But that kid died of diabetes from pure flat ignorant negligence. The treatment might have contributed to metabolism shock? But the lethal fail was that complete moron should have immediately ran for a controlled, high end treatment theater like an emergency room.
    A fking candy striper knows a juvey diabetic is a top risk hard to keep patient with every bell and whistle there is. When plant people do not see immediate, drastic results they are supposed to run for it too - so this was a case of "hoarding" that proved lethal.
    "The perfect way to do, is to be" ~ Lao Tzu

  7. #52
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    Right. According to http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...-1227329281935, the "pai da" practitioner encouraged participants to fast for 3 days prior to the therapy.

    3 days of fasting for anyone but the experienced would certainly render them compromised. Also, this guy seems to have been kicked out of Taiwan and fined for violating medical regulations...

    So, bad practitioner but also I feel the parents are somewhat to blame for not being diligent and doing their homework - I mean, c'mon even a bone-brain would know starving a diabetic child for 3 days is not only risky but torturous. However, it's tough being a parent and sifting through all the information and just trying to to what is best for your child, so I wouldn't necessarily be in favor of punishing the parents - they've suffered perhaps the greatest loss possible and will be imprisoned in their own sorrow and guilt for a lifetime.

    Poor little guy...

  8. #53
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    Some follow up...

    Slapping therapy death of Sydney boy aged seven appalls Chinese medicine experts
    ASHLEE MULLANY NEWS LIMITED MAY 01, 2015 4:37PM

    Boy dies after 'slapping therapy'

    EXPERTS in Chinese medicine say they have never heard of “slapping therapy’’ or the self-proclaimed healer Hongchi Xiao at the centre of a police investigation into the death of a diabetic Sydney boy this week.

    They say his practice sounds more like a cult than a legitimate procedure.

    Police are investigating the controversial practice — which involves slapping the body until it bruises in a bid to “drive out poisons’’ — after seven-year-old Aidan Fenton died while attending one of Mr Xiao’s slapping workshops in Hurstville on Monday with his parents Geoff and Lily.

    They are said to be devastated by their son’s death.


    Aidan Fenton with mother Lily and father Geoff.

    It is understood Aidan and others who attended Mr Xiao’s $1800 week-long alternative medicine course were asked to fast for three days before undertaking vigorous slapping and stretching exercises.

    Australian Acupuncture and Chinese Medicine Association acting CEO Judy James said she had never heard of Mr Xiao and confirmed he was not a member of her organisation.

    She said she was appalled when she learned of the boy’s death, which she described as horrific.

    “To my knowledge slapping therapy is not anything that we would be doing in Australia,” she told The Saturday Telegraph.

    “We would say to people that if you are going to see a practitioner make sure they are a member of an association and are accredited.’’
    “Hitting a person all over their body until they are bruised is something that I have never heard of.

    “We extend our sympathies to the family.’’

    Several academics who specialise in complementary medicines and alternative therapies contacted yesterday said they had never heard of the practice.

    Australian Traditional Medicine Society director Christine Pope said it sounded more like a “cult practice’’ than a medical procedure.

    “We have got traditional Chinese medical practitioners on our board and they say it’s not part of traditional Chinese medicine or acupuncture. It’s not a real therapy,’’ she said.


    Geoff and Lily Fenton with son Aidan in 2009. Aidan died after being treatment at a conference led by a doctor who promotes slapping therapy. Picture: Facebook

    “We would say to people that if you are going to see a practitioner make sure they are a member of an association and are accredited.’’

    NSW Health warns that complementary and alternative therapies are not considered a part of “evidence-based, conventional medicine’’.

    “Complementary and alternative therapies may not provide you with any benefit, and may actually cause harm,’’ its website warns.

    “If you are considering using complementary or alternative therapies, it is important that you discuss this with your doctor to minimise the risk of harm.”
    There's a vid too, if you follow the link.
    Gene Ching
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  9. #54
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    Randall Neustaedter

    Bay Area doctor accused of sex assault during acupuncture
    By Kale Williams Updated 3:53 pm, Wednesday, July 15, 2015


    Randall Neustaedter, 65, was arrested Monday, July 13, on suspicion of sexually assaulting one of his patients during a massage at an Oriental medicine clinic in San Mateo County. Photo: Courtesy, San Mateo County Sheriff's
    Photo: Courtesy, San Mateo County Sheriff's


    Randall Neustaedter, 65, was arrested Monday, July 13, on suspicion of sexually assaulting one of his patients during a massage at an Oriental medicine clinic in San Mateo County.

    A San Mateo County doctor was arrested for allegedly sexually assaulting one of his patients during an acupuncture session last month at his office outside Redwood City, officials said Wednesday.

    Randall Neustaedter, 65, was booked on suspicion of two felony counts of forcible sexual penetration, said the San Mateo County Sheriff’s Office.

    An unidentified 27-year-old woman told investigators she purchased a coupon through the discount website Groupon for a series of acupuncture appointments at Neustaedter’s business, Cure Guide, at 1779 Woodside Road, the sheriff’s office said.

    After a few visits, the woman told investigators Neustaedter offered her a massage, during which he deliberately touched her genitals.

    Neustaedter was arrested Monday at his office and taken to Maguire Correctional Facility in Redwood City, then was released after posting $200,000 bail, officials said. He is due in court Aug. 21 for arraignment.

    According to Neustaedter’s biography on the Cure Guide website, he has practiced homeopathy and Oriental medicine for more than 30 years and has written several books, including guides on holistic parenting.

    Neustaedter did not immediately return requests for comment Wednesday.
    Local news. Fortunately I didn't know him. It always saddens me to add to any of our 'Busted' threads, but it saddens me much more when I actually am acquainted with the perps.
    Gene Ching
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  10. #55
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    Madam Cheong Thiam Mui

    TCM doctor suspended for issuing MCs ‘liberally’
    Published: 4:16 AM, August 13, 2015

    SINGAPORE — A traditional Chinese medicine (TCM) physician has been suspended and fined for issuing as many as 122 medical certificates to 109 students of a private school, without adequately examining the patients’ medical condition.

    Madam Cheong Thiam Mui, a registered physician and acupuncturist at Cheong’s Clinic at Bencoolen Street, had given out the certificates between Dec 2, 2013, and March 12, 2014.

    The Traditional Chinese Medicine Practitioners Board in a news release yesterday said Mdm Cheong’s issuance of medical certificates was “very liberal”. Investigations found that four of Mdm Cheong’s patients, who were among the students, did not undergo proper examination and she had misrepresented the facts in the medical certificates issued to them.

    She also did not keep proper records of the four patients’ medical conditions, diagnosis, treatment and grounds for issuing medical certificates. This amounted to professional misconduct and negligence.

    Mdm Cheong’s conduct had come to light after a complaint was made to the Traditional Chinese Medicine Practitioners Board. Her registration as a TCM physician has been suspended for three months from Aug 1, and she was also fined S$2,000 and censured.

    The board also ordered Cheong to pay the costs and expenses of the investigation as well as action taken in the case.

    She is also to give a written undertaking that she will not issue medical certificates without proper TCM examination of her patients, and that she will keep proper patients’ records of all her patients in accordance with the ethical code for TCM practitioners and relevant regulations.
    The key question here now is - will they chase down all of those liberally issued MCs?
    Gene Ching
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  11. #56
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    Hongbin Liu

    Man jailed for raping woman at Belsize Park traditional Chinese medical centre
    10:05 11 January 2016 Dave Burke


    Hongbin Liu has been jailed for rape and sexual assaults

    A traditional Chinese medicine practitioner who raped a patient and sexually assaulted two others has been jailed.

    Hongbin Liu, 53, was working at the Chinese Traditional Medical Centre in Haverstock Hill, Belsize Park, when he raped and assaulted a woman in her 40s during an acupuncture and massage consultation.

    Following the attack, which happened in February last year, she went to police.

    Liu, of Vauxhall Bridge Road, admitted one count of rape, one of assault by penetration, and two of sexual assault.

    He was jailed for seven years.

    The month after the attack, two women reported further sex assaults at the Shu Jun Healthcare Centre in Wells Street, Westminster.

    One of the victims thought that whilst giving her a massage, Liu took a picture of her with his phone.

    Officers were unable to recover the photographs, however.

    Det Const Jane Tunnicliff, from the Met’s Sexual Offences, Exploitation and Child Abuse Command, said: “This is a man who betrayed the patient-doctor relationship.

    “Dr Liu prayed on the vulnerabilities of his patients. It is important that each and every one of us feel safe to seek treatment when we are ill or in pain.

    “As police officers we strive to make our community safer for everyone - even behind closed doors.”

    Det Insp Lee Davison, said: “People who abuse their position of trust damage the fabric of our society and the impact of their actions on their victims can be great.

    “We will pursue all such offenders to bring them to justice.

    “I would encourage anyone who has suffered at the hand of another to report the matter to the police in the knowledge that they will be believed and supported.”
    The patient-doctor relationship is more delicate than the student-teacher relationship.
    Gene Ching
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  12. #57
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    Fahk him and any others who perpetuate such crimes.

    Looking forward to his anus being trained in the super secret Squid Swallowing moves.

    He is going to like hot dogs, many many hotdogs...
    Dr. Dale Dugas
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  13. #58
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    Wu Liping

    That's pretty dumb. A missed period for five months? Any clinician would suspect pregnancy first and foremost.

    TCM physician suspended, fined for misdiagnosing pregnant 15-year-old
    Posted 10 Jun 2016 13:02 Updated 10 Jun 2016 13:04

    SINGAPORE: A Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) physician has been suspended for three months and fined S$5,000 for misdiagnosing a 15-year-old girl who was pregnant.

    The girl had missed her menstruation for five months when she consulted Wu Liping, a registered TCM practitioner and acupuncturist with Shenzhou Chinese Physician Clinic in Jurong East, according to a press release issued on Friday (Jun 10) by the TCM Practitioners Board.

    Wu had misdiagnosed the patient’s condition as hormonal imbalance, when in fact, the patient was five months’ pregnant.

    She then prescribed a TCM herbal medication which was meant to revitalise and strengthen blood flow, but which posed health risks to both the patient and her unborn child, the Board said.

    “The diagnosis and TCM herbal medication prescribed and dispensed by Wu to the patient … was not an appropriate and/or generally accepted TCM treatment and fell short of the standard set out in the Ethical Code,” it added.

    The physician had failed to exclude the possibility of pregnancy, or ask adequate basic questions about the patient’s condition. She had also failed to conduct an adequate clinic examination and medical history taking of the patient.

    The patient’s father later lodged a complaint against Wu.

    An investigation committee conducted an inquiry and Wu was found guilty of inter alia professional negligence.

    For breaching the TCM Practitioners Act, Wu was suspended for three months starting from Jun 1, fined S$5,000 and issued with a notice of censure. She was also ordered to pay costs and expenses of or incidental to the inquiry hearing, investigation conducted and the action taken against her by the Board.

    - CNA/cy
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  14. #59
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    Bums me out to post this...

    Acupuncturist arrested on sexual battery charges, deputies say
    Deputies: Man worked at Compassion Acupuncture and Herbal Clinic


    By Brianna Volz - ClickOrlando.com Staff
    Posted: 9:23 AM, March 18, 2017

    ORLANDO, Fla. - Orange County deputies arrested an acupuncturist on sexual battery charges Friday, deputies said.

    The acupuncturist, Min-Chung Tsai, 58, worked at Compassion Acupuncture and Herbal Clinic on South Ferncreek Avenue in Orlando, Orange County deputies said.

    Deputies said a woman went to the clinic to receive acupuncture treatment in December, and believe she was sexually battered by Tsai during the treatment.

    The victim returned to the clinic for treatment on Monday, during which time deputies believe she was sexually battered by Tsai again, the Sheriff's Office said.

    Tsai was arrested and charged with two counts of sexual battery, and is scheduled to appear before a judge Saturday morning.

    News 6 spoke to Tsai's wife by phone Saturday morning. She said her husband did not inappropriately touch the victim and claims the victim went to the clinic seeking medical help. Tsai's wife said there was no one else in the room during the session, which isn't standard procedure, and that Tsai asked for the victim's permission before touching her.

    According to Tsai's website, he has more than 20 years of experience as a physician. Tsai got his acupuncturist license in 2010 and has no disciplinary cases or complaints on file, according to the state Department of Health.

    Detectives said they believe there may be other victims and are asking them to come forward. Anyone who is aware of someone who may have been a victim is asked to call the Orange County Sheriff's Department.

    Stay with News 6 and ClickOrlando.com for updates on this story.

    Copyright 2017 by WKMG ClickOrlando - All rights reserved.
    The question I have to ask though, is "if she was inappropriately touched the first time, why did she go back a second time?"
    I personally know a massage therapist with over 30 years experience who got busted last year for inappropriate touching. This is really a tough situation as it's her word against his.

    Practitioners can learn from this though:

    • Always obtain consent before touching your client
    • Always let them know where you are going to examine/touch
    • Always drape appropriately for modesty
    • And unfortunately, if it's something involving the examination of genitals or breasts and you are a man, it's best to refer out to a female colleague.


    Despite the best practices though, sh!t can still happen

    ox, out
    Last edited by herb ox; 03-20-2017 at 02:21 PM. Reason: formatting

  15. #60
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    She was sexually assaulted and she went back, and then decided to press charges?

    Why did she not report him the first time he "touched" her.

    Umm, where theres smoke there is usually fire.

    Im glad to treat community style, no one disrobes and I do not have to touch or needle the "naughty' places...
    Dr. Dale Dugas
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