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Thread: The Hidden History of the Chinese Internal Martial Arts

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    The Hidden History of the Chinese Internal Martial Arts

    The Hidden History of the Chinese Internal Martial Arts

    Exploring the Mysterious Connections between Long Fist Boxing and the Origins and Roots of Bagua, Taiji, Xingyi, and More

    By Salvatore Canzonieri



    TABLE OF CONTENTS

    THE HIDDEN HISTORY OF THE CHINESE INTERNAL MARTIAL ARTS EXPLORING THE MYSTERIOUS CONNECTIONS BETWEEN LONG FIST BOXING AND THE ORIGINS AND ROOTS OF BAGUA, TAIJI, XINGYI, AND MORE 1

    PREFACE 5
    METHODOLOGY USED FOR INFORMATION GATHERING 5
    INTRODUCTION 8
    INTERNAL EXERCISES: NEIGONG PRACTICE AND THE CHINESE MARTIAL ARTS 8

    SECTION 1 – THE MYSTERY OF BAGUA ZHANG’S ORIGINS AND ROOTS IN LONG FIST 16
    1A. INTRODUCTION 16
    1B. BAGUA ZHANG BACKGROUND 16
    1C. DONG HAICHUAN’S CONNECTION TO BA FAN QUAN AND SHAOLIN QUAN 18
    Ba Fan Quan Background Information 19
    1D. CONNECTION BETWEEN BAGUA ZHANG AND BA FAN SHOU 22
    1E. BA FAN QUAN / CHUOJIAO > GENERAL ZHAO CANYI CONNECTION 24
    Chuojiao Background 26
    1F. BAGUA ZHANG CONNECTION TO CHUOJIAO 29
    1G. BAGUA ZHANG’S CONNECTION TO SHAOLIN LUOHAN QUAN 31
    1H. BAGUA QUAN BACKGROUND 34
    1I. MEIHUA ZHUANG SYSTEM CONNECTION 35
    General Zhao Canyi and the original Feng Keshan 40
    1J. DONG HAICHUAN’S CIRCLE WALKING CONNECTION 40
    1K. YINYANG BAGUA ZHANG CONNECTION 41
    Dong Haichuan’s Connection to Yinyang Bagua Zhang 44
    1M. LATER DEVELOPMENT OF BAGUA ZHANG IN BEIJING 47
    1N. SHUAI JIAO CONNECTION 48
    SUMMARY 48

    SECTION 2 – THE MYSTERY OF XIN YI LIUHE / XINGYI QUAN ORIGINS AND ROOTS IN LONG FIST 50
    2A. INTRODUCTION 50
    Xinyi Liuhe Quan and Xingyi Quan Background 50
    Ancient Martial Arts Connection 51
    2B. YUE SHI BA FAN SHOU CONNECTION 52
    Origin of the Ba Fan Shou set 53
    2C. YING ZHUA - EAGLE CLAW STYLE CONNECTION 55
    Liuhe Men Background 56
    2D. GENERAL YUE FEI CONNECTION 58
    Yuejia Quan Background 60
    2E. BA FAN MEN/ YUEJIA QUAN/ XINYI-XINGYI QUAN CONNECTION 61
    2F. BA FAN QUAN, CHUOJIAO, XINYI LIUHE/XINGYI QUAN, AND BAGUA ZHANG CONNECTION 63
    2G. JI LONGFENG’S CREATION OF XINYI QUAN 66
    2H. JI LONGFENG’S CONNECTION TO SHAOLIN AND QIANZAI TEMPLES 66
    2I. TONGBEI QUAN CONNECTION 67
    2J. TAOIST 13 POSTURES CONNECTION 69
    2K. LIUHE SPEAR CONNECTION 70
    Ji Longfeng Develops Liuhe Quan from Spear Techniques 72
    2L. HENAN LIUHE XINYI QUAN DEVELOPMENT 73
    Luoyang Connection 74
    2M. HUA QUAN 18 LOUHAN HANDS CONNECTION 75
    2N. TONGBEI AND HEBEI XINGYI QUAN CONNECTION 76
    2O. SHUAI JIAO CONNECTION 76
    SUMMARY 78

    SECTION 3 – MYSTERY OF TAI JI QUAN’S ORIGINS AND ROOTS IN LONG FIST 80
    3A. INTRODUCTION 80
    3B. TAIJI QUAN THEORY AND XINYI LIUHE QUAN MANUALS CONNECTION 81
    3C. TAOIST ORIGIN OF THE 13 POSTURES 84
    3D. TAIJI QUAN AND GENERAL QI JIGUANG 85
    3E. CHEN TAIJI QUAN AND SHAOLIN QUAN CONNECTION 88
    3F. TAIJI QUAN AND SHAOLIN STAFF CONNECTION 97
    3G. SHAOLIN AND GENERAL QI’S BOOK CONNECTION 98
    3H. TAIJI QUAN AND TONGBEI QUAN / 13 POSTURES CONNECTION 102
    3I. CHEN WANGTING’S ORIGINAL TAIJI CONNECTION 105
    3J. CHANGES TO THE ORIGINAL CHEN TAIJI 107
    3K. WANG ZONGYUE AND JIANG FA CONTROVERSY 108
    3L. WHO WAS MING ERA JIANG’S AND QING ERA JIANG FA’S TEACHER? 111
    3M. YANG LUCHAN CONNECTION 115
    SUMMARY 131

    SECTION 4 – THE MYSTERY OF TONGBEI QUAN’S ROOTS AND ORIGINS IN LONG FIST 132
    4A. INTRODUCTION 132
    4B. TONGBI / TONGBEI QUAN BACKGROUND 132
    4C. TONGBEI QUAN MAIN TECHNIQUES 134
    4D. LEGENDARY BAI YUAN ORIGIN OF TONGBI QUAN 136
    4E. ORIGIN OF OTHER TONGBI QUAN STYLES 137
    4F. TONGBEI QUAN HISTORY 139
    4G. OTHER STYLES KNOWN AS TONGBI OR TONGBEI QUAN 144
    4H. HONG QUAN INFLUENCE ON TONGBI QUAN DEVELOPMENT 145
    Hong Quan Background 145
    Vast Boxing – Da Hong Quan 147
    Wensheng Quan Background 148
    Folk Hong Quan Development 149
    Taoist Martial Arts Influence on Southern Song Military Arts 152
    Hakka Influence on Southern Song Dynasty 153
    Red Turban’s Hong Quan influence 154
    Da Hong Quan Connection 155
    Shaanxi Red Hong Quan Background 156
    Wudang Hong Quan Background 159
    Other Hong Quan Styles 160
    Shaolin Hong Quan Background 160
    Other Shaolin Derived Hong Quan Styles 162
    Unrelated Hong Quan Styles 162
    Denfeng Area Shaolin Lao Hong Quan of Zhao Kuangyin 163
    Muslim Chinese Martial Arts Connection 165
    4I. TAIZU CHANG QUAN INFLUENCE ON TONGBI QUAN DEVELOPMENT 167
    Origin of Shaolin Song Taizu Chang Quan 168
    Other Taizu Quan Styles 172
    Non-Related Taizu Quan Styles 175
    4J. SHAOLIN WU QUAN INFLUENCE ON TONGBI QUAN DEVELOPMENT 176
    Shaolin Staff Fighting Connection 184
    4K. TAOIST 13 POSTURES INFLUENCE ON TONGBEI QUAN DEVELOPMENT 185
    Taoist Sword Fighting Connection 187
    SUMMARY 192

    SECTION 5 – THE MYSTERY OF SHAOLIN LONG FIST ORIGINS AND ROOTS 193
    INTRODUCTION 193
    5A. BODHIDHARMA (DAMO) DID NOT CREATE SHAOLIN MARTIAL ARTS 193
    5B. SHAOLIN TEMPLE AND ITS MARTIAL MONKS BACKGROUND 195
    5C. SHAOLIN AND TAOIST INTERACTION 198
    5D. VAJRA WARRIORS – JINGANG CONNECTION 199
    5E. SHUAI JIAO CONNECTION 201
    5F. DESTRUCTION OF SHAOLIN MONASTERY DURING YUAN DYNASTY 201
    5G. SHAOLIN REVIVAL IN MING DYNASTY – DA HONG QUAN, WU QUAN, AND LUOHAN QUAN 202
    5H. SHAOLIN QUAN EXTENDS BEYOND THE MONASTERY 204
    5I. SHAOLIN LUOHAN QUAN BACKGROUND 205
    5J. SHAOLIN AND OUTSIDE MARTIAL ARTS CONNECTION 207
    5K. SHAOLIN AND MIZONG QUAN CONNECTION 209
    5L. DESTRUCTION OF SHAOLIN AREAS IN 1640 AND 1735 211
    5M. SHAOLIN MARTIAL MONK AND ANTI-QING REBEL EXODUS IN 1735 213
    5N. SHAOLIN KANJIA QUAN 214
    Gan Fengshi Hua Quan 216
    Shaolin Fohan Quan Background 217
    Shaolin and Ming Zhu Family Connection 219
    5O. TANG LANG QUAN CONNECTION 222
    SUMMARY 226

    SECTION 6 – THE MYSTERY OF SHAOLIN NEIGONG AND INTERNAL MARTIAL ARTS ORIGINS AND ROOTS 227
    INTRODUCTION 227
    6A. SHAOLIN XINYI QUAN AND XINYI BA CONNECTION 227
    Shaolin Xinyi Quan 228
    Shaolin Xinyi Ba 229
    4B. SHAOLIN APE-MONKEY BOXING CONNECTION 231
    6C. SHAOLIN NEIGONG CONNECTION 232
    Shaolin Yi Jin Jing 235
    6D. SHAOLIN ROU GONG AND ROU QUAN CONNECTION 236
    The Liuhe Gong set 242
    The Chan Yuan Gong set 243
    The Luohan 13 Gong set 245
    Shaolin Rou Quan sets 247
    Shaolin Material Related to the Internal Martial Arts 248

    SECTION 7. THE ORIGIN AND ROOTS OF SHUAI JIAO, THE ORIGINAL CHINESE MARTIAL ART 250
    7A. INTRODUCTION 250
    7B. SHUAI JIAO BACKGROUND 250
    7C. SHUAI JIAO CONCEPTS AND SKILLS 251
    7D. SHUAI JIAO INTERNAL MARTIAL ART CONNECTION 253
    SUMMARY 253
    SECTION 8. CONCLUSION 254
    BIBLIOGRAPHY 259

  2. #2
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    Impressive!

    When do you publish?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fei Li View Post
    When do you publish?
    Don't know, right now Dr. Kenneth Fish is reading it and editing the text.
    Then I have to add all the graphics and do the layouts of the page.

    I haven't decided if I want to self publish or go to a known publisher.

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    AWESOME

    I HAVE to get that book.

  5. #5
    Greetings Sal,

    Talk about ambitious!!!

    I want to buy it already. Keep us updated. It looks it will encourage much discussion.

    Congratulations


    mickey

  6. #6
    Its going to a great read.. very interesting.. I hope you will post when its available

  7. #7
    you got my nickel;

    in re: to publisher - perhaps the same folks that did Brian Kennedy's latest book? isn't he on this forum as well?

    maybe try Shambala? they did my teacher's book, they are reputable;

    just some ideas - I hope this sees print, it clarifies some important things...

  8. #8
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    hay man i hope u can sell it on amazon, i never buy martial arts books but ill buy one to support your work

    Honorary African American
    grandmaster instructor of Wombat Combat The Lost Art of Anal Destruction™®LLC .
    Senior Business Director at TEAM ASSHAMMER consulting services ™®LLC

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Canzonieri View Post
    The Hidden History of the Chinese Internal Martial Arts

    TABLE OF CONTENTS

    1G. BAGUA ZHANG’S CONNECTION TO SHAOLIN LUOHAN QUAN 31
    Sal, I love to hear a bit about this.
    r.

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    Quote Originally Posted by r.(shaolin) View Post
    Sal, I love to hear a bit about this.
    r.
    Well, in that section I go into detail on how there are various Luohan sets that overlap with much of the bagua seen in both Yin Fu and Cheng styles.
    I talk about the 18 Luohan Hands sets, what overlaps. I talk about other sets from Shaolin luohan too. About stepping patterns, and how the unique animal postures used in Bagua (for instance, bear and unicorn) are only found in the Shaolin 18 Luohan Hands sets. All the animals found in bagua are also in this Luohan set, and not found in any other Shaolin sets. I also discuss the overlapping postures, techniques, movements, names for things, hand and arm movements, kicks, stepping, etc that are in common. There is quiet a lot of overlap. Plus, there is evidence of the early founders of bagua (and many of the later practitioners) have a Shaolin Luohan background in their youth.

    Then, in a later chapter I discuss that there is the Luohan 18 Hands that is practiced in Luoyang (a two man set) that was brought there from Shandong, which was once part of Hua Quan style.
    But that set is more like Xing Yi Five Elements.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    hay man i hope u can sell it on amazon, i never buy martial arts books but ill buy one to support your work
    Amazon might publish it, they said they are interested.

    This isn't your typical martial art book, this is a like a detective line of reasoning, spelling out a case step by step, you'll like it, it is very educational, you will learn the history of how one style developed into another over time, from on area to another.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Canzonieri View Post
    Well, in that section I go into detail on how there are various Luohan sets that overlap with much of the bagua seen in both Yin Fu and Cheng styles.
    I talk about the 18 Luohan Hands sets, what overlaps. I talk about other sets from Shaolin luohan too. About stepping patterns, and how the unique animal postures used in Bagua (for instance, bear and unicorn) are only found in the Shaolin 18 Luohan Hands sets. All the animals found in bagua are also in this Luohan set, and not found in any other Shaolin sets. I also discuss the overlapping postures, techniques, movements, names for things, hand and arm movements, kicks, stepping, etc that are in common. There is quiet a lot of overlap. Plus, there is evidence of the early founders of bagua (and many of the later practitioners) have a Shaolin Luohan background in their youth.

    Then, in a later chapter I discuss that there is the Luohan 18 Hands that is practiced in Luoyang (a two man set) that was brought there from Shandong, which was once part of Hua Quan style.
    But that set is more like Xing Yi Five Elements.
    When Gong Bao Zhai's senior student, He Jin Han, was asked if there was a Lohan Shaolin influence in Yin Fu's Ba Gua, he relied, "Lohan Shaolin is in Ba Gua."

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Canzonieri View Post
    When Gong Bao Zhai's senior student, He Jin Han, was asked if there was a Lohan Shaolin influence in Yin Fu's Ba Gua, he relied, "Lohan Shaolin is in Ba Gua."
    Hi Sal,
    A friend directed me to a site called "rum soaked fist" to a discussion you had with a
    teacher called Dr. Yan on the Connection Between YY BGZ, BGZ and XYLHQ.
    It well take me a week to read that thing:-))))
    Is his basic point that there was no martial arts at Shaolin before the late Ming?
    I gather the basis of his research is, like a lot of what's come out of China, "village/folk manuals."

    On Dr. Yan's web site he states that his conclusion is that there is a connection between Yinyang Baguazhang and Xingyi. If I'm reading his articles on Bagua correctly, he is suggesting that Dong's Bagua was based on an older style called 'yinyang Bagua".

    I found that interesting because in my tradition of Shaolin we have a number of Bagua sets and one is called Bagua Xingyi (八卦形義)
    r.

    ps
    One of Dr. Yan's teachers was Shifu Ji JinShan. This person became an instructor at the Henan Shaolin Association in Shanghai sometime in the 30's I believe. My teacher left there shortly before Ji came there. However when Ji JinShan was in New York the late 80's he came by to see my teacher. It is possible that Ji JinShan was the same generation as my Grandmaster and Granduncle. because of the 'Shan 山' generational name.
    Last edited by r.(shaolin); 10-12-2009 at 09:13 AM.

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    if it is so hidden how do you know it?? regardless, it's nice to know people such as yourself are freely bringing hidden things to light.

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    does your tai ji history in anyway mentions tai ji connection to shaolin art of wu ji quan......... ???

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