Qigong as Medicine

[SoCo KungFu]

In clinical research (big pharma) it is the statistician who does final analyses. Despite the often rigorous attention to detail, statistical 'sleight; of hand' sometimes allows for creative use of data, which allows for bad drugs to reach the market. It is obvious that all research makes assumptions but the extent of it (clinical and statistical significance) can and is obscured by the profit and unholy alliances that exist despite the Hippocratic oath or the objectivity of data. I recall in a recent study I participated in there were a bunch of people (small sample, that is???) who were experiencing some adverse events and it was significant as they were serious adverse events but I, the lowly Data Analyst was called out for not minding my own beezness. At that point, the statistician did take a look at my finding but according to his observations, these were not statistically significant ENOUGH. Fast forward to a few years later, the class of drugs that cause COX 2 inhibition were deemed dangerous and labelling information had to be updated to conform to new updated requirements. The bottom line seems to be that profit is the only motive (and that is not representative of the Hippocratic oath) while negating the safety of those who would otherwise benefit from it.

Qigong tends to get away with basic concepts and methodology (name of system is not mentioned, days to some effect to be shown, etc) or the beneficial results tends to be extrapolated to ALL Qigong, which is a serious mistake. There is no doubt that the "teacher effect" accounts for a benefit or just the social component of someone caring the indivudal in question. Actually much criteria is lacking in qigong research though a recent study with falungong (yes, of all methods out there) does show that qigong has the potential to change DNA expression but that extent was not conclusively shown but the findings are exemplary since the modern tools of research (HPLA and opther chromatograpic tools) were part of the modern scientific community.
You can check out the Cochrane review pertaining to taijiquan and qigong to see what I am implying! They do have pdf files for download and give a far more wider and systematic exposition of faults within complementary methods of health!

Statisticians don't do the analyses. They do the stats. There is far more to interpretation than simply running numbers. No one is saying you can't lie with stats. Although I'd say a great majority of what people call that "sleight of hand" is really people just not understanding statistical procedure. Do you know how many different forms of a t-test there are and that each one is robust in different ways? That's rhetorical, I'm assuming you do if you were/are a data analyst. But its outside of your specialty to determine if those numbers are meaningful.

Beyond the rest of your 1st paragraph, tu quoque. Arguing that pharmaceuticals are interested in profit doesn't excuse the shoddy research that is going on in alt med (which is every bit as much a profit seeking industry, mind you). As for the study you were part of, practical significance vs statistical significance. If your sample was too small, the statistician was right to say it wasn't significant enough. He/she was following the parameters of their tools. Its up to the clinicians to determine if that statistical significance is or isn't practically significant. Which goes back to my first statement, statisticians don't do the analyses. They do the stats. The researcher has to determine what that means in the context of biological function. And this doesn't end at the point of sale. Everyone down the line makes a decision based on what evidence is available, right down to the consumer (if they are intelligent enough).

There's a difference in a p-value of 0.05 (although we'd be hoping they would be using a bit more stringent of a mark, but just for sake of example) when looking at increased incidence of say, headache vs MI (since I'm assuming by your mention of COX 2 that you are talking about cardiac function and stroke risk). Neither of those examples in this case would be statistically significant, they're teetering either way. But that would be quite practically significant in case of MI. That's where the clinicians have to be involved, statisticians don't make that decision, its not their science.

As for qigong, you are jumping too far ahead. If the data being presented is legitimate, then it doesn't matter what qigong you are using. In fact, it doesn't matter that they are doing qigong at all. The only significant finding is that people will stick with qigong classes longer and attend more frequently than standard phys therapy, probably due to novelty. You know what that tells me? That it doesn't matter what they are doing, so long as they are doing something to be active and decrease stress. And I'm not even going to bother going into figuring out how someone can separate falun gong with epigenetic effects, which are not very well understood in humans.

[SoCo KungFu]

The bottom line seems to be that profit is the only motive (and that is not representative of the Hippocratic oath) while negating the safety of those who would otherwise benefit from it.

I'm addressing this separately because its off topic. This fear mongering is getting out of hand. Are profits important? Yeah of course. Look this is capitalism. But these notions of evil alliances and conspiracies are getting ridiculous. Nothing is covert, corporations seek profit. But that doesn't mean everyone checks their ethics at the door. Most people are like you and I. They just want to do a good job and create something to help people. People don't spend a decade learning pharmaceuticals so they can make bank, there's no bank to be made for the researcher. Most are struggling with job security while trying to maintain their ethical integrity. Many are there because they had some personal motivator to drive them that far. Say what you want about corporations, but the people within that corporation are far more important to what goes on than some simple notion of profit margin. And its only slightly hypocritical when the alt med industry is stoking up these flames because this paranoia is what feeds their profit margin.

[Syn7]

The individuals ethics may not be checked at the door, but when you look at the whole spectrum of the corporate world, you do see a detachment of sorts. They trend. And people who live in certain bubbles lose sight of the greater impact of their social and economic policies. That isn't just pharma, that goes for all of these massive entities. They aren't all the same, but if we laid it out bare, it wouldn't be equal to something like a smaller tight knit group who goes out of their way to help people while still making profit. The further removed from the consequences, the less likely they are to deal with the negative impacts. A lot of these people with actual power are just carpet baggers, for sure, but many are just small cogs in a giant machine. They don't feel as if their morality is relevant in the larger context. And to a large extent, they're right. It can be quite apathetic.

[GeneChing]

Hypertension Treated With Qigong
Added by Nick Ng on March 30, 2014.



Hypertension can be treated with an ancient Chinese meditative exercise called qigong (pronounced “chi-gong” without the lips puckered up in “chi), which involves a series of slow and repetitive movements and breathing awareness. This bodes good news for those who cannot physically withstand regular exercise, such as walking or running, because of joint, muscle, or neural problems. According to the National Qigong Association in St. Paul, Minnesota, qigong — meaning “breath work” literally — involves specific breathing techniques, mental focus, and moving or stationary posture. It is an umbrella term for other styles of Chinese martial arts, such as tai chi and vigorous styles of kung fu. Thus, anyone practicing these subcategories of martial arts can be considered as qigong practitioners. Although it is not a cure-all for diseases and disorders, qigong complements existing Western and Chinese medicine practices to improve cardiovascular, respiratory, and mental functions and to reduce hypertension-related symptoms, such as anxiety and stress.

A recent Chinese study showed the benefits of tai chi in reducing anxiety that can raise blood pressure was published in the March 2014 issue of International Journal of Physiology, Pathophysiology, and Pharmacology. Thirty-two elderly patients who were suffering from anxiety disorder were randomly placed into an experimental group that received tai chi exercise with drug therapy and a control group that only had drug therapy. After 45 days of treatment, the cured patients stopped the drug therapy yet those who were in the experimental group continued to do tai chi. Two months later, researchers evaluated both groups to determine if the disease came back. What they discovered was somewhat surprising.

The control group had a near-43 percent recurrence rate while the experimental group had a recurrence rate of slightly over nine percent. Although a larger sample population may be needed to confirm this finding, tai chi — and maybe — classical qigong could treat anxiety and decrease hypertension levels with some drug therapy. However, the study did not measure blood pressure. Had it done so, the data could be compared with other past studies that used blood pressure readings to make better conclusions about the effects of qigong exercises and hypertension.

On a larger scale, however, the results may be a little different from the Chinese study. A meta-analysis of nine studies of qigong and hypertension from Guangzhou University of Traditional Chinese Medicine in China showed that the average decrease in systolic blood pressure in those who practiced qigong was 17.03 millimeters of mercury (mm Hg) lower than the control group that did not receive any hypertensive interventions. However, the reduction rate wasn’t better than those in drug controls or conventional exercise controls. Likewise, the average diastolic blood pressure decrease was almost 10 mm Hg, which was better than the control group but not so much compared to the drug and conventional exercise groups. Overall, the researchers concluded that practicing qigong for less than one year is better in decreasing blood pressure than with no practice at all.

Physicians and other Western medical professionals may eventually be more likely to recommend their patients to practice qigong to treat hypertension and related illnesses. Given the rising popularity and awareness of its benefits, qigong may be more prevalent in mainstream health care systems across the United States. Qigong requires just the body and no equipment, and it can be done anywhere in a group setting or privately at home. Those who have been practicing qigong for a year or more may say to themselves, “I know kung fu.”

By Nick Ng

My qigong has done nothing to lower my blood pressure. Nothing at all.

[mawali]

Statisticians don't do the analyses. They do the stats. There is far more to interpretation than simply running numbers. No one is saying you can't lie with stats. Although I'd say a great majority of what people call that "sleight of hand" is really people just not understanding. Do you know how many different forms of a t-test there are and that each one is robust in different ways? That's rhetorical, I'm assuming you do if you were/are a data analyst. But its outside of your specialty to determine if those numbers are meaningful.

Beyond the rest of your 1st paragraph, tu quoque. Arguing that pharmaceuticals are interested in profit doesn't excuse the shoddy research that is going on in alt med (which is every bit as much a profit seeking industry, mind you). As for the study you were part of, practical significance vs statistical significance. If your sample was too small, the statistician was right to say it wasn't significant enough. He/she was following the parameters of their tools. Its up to the clinicians to determine if that statistical significance is or isn't practically significant. Which goes back to my first statement, statisticians don't do the analyses. They do the stats. The researcher has to determine what that means in the context of biological function. And this doesn't end at the point of sale. Everyone down the line makes a decision based on what evidence is available, right down to the consumer (if they are intelligent enough).

There's a difference in a p-value of 0.05 (although we'd be hoping they would be using a bit more stringent of a mark, but just for sake of example) when looking at increased incidence of say, headache vs MI (since I'm assuming by your mention of COX 2 that you are talking about cardiac function and stroke risk). Neither of those examples in this case would be statistically significant, they're teetering either way. But that would be quite practically significant in case of MI. That's where the clinicians have to be involved, statisticians don't make that decision, its not their science..

Q. What do I mean by "sleight of hand"
When I use the term, I am aware that there are some in clinical statistics groups get away with substituting certain tests when other statistical test are far fore important in determining efficacy, significance or both. Clinical significance vs statistical significance is under the purview of the statistician but it is a joint effort when adverse events categorization (frequency and severity) since the MD sponsor has to be the main point of selling the good numbers to the development team. The consumer can only rely on what is told to him (truth in advertising) through this process. As you ar aware, recent trials found to be misleading involved a concerted attempt (on the part of the pharmaceutical company) to prevent the consumer from accessing or evwn being aware of malfeasance. In my local area, there is even a site or a group of lawyers capitalizing on this; sound familiar 1.800 BAD-DRUG. Statisticians provide the background on which clinicians are supposed to shpw a coprresponding beneficial effect!, generally as it is rare to find an MD, who has a statistical background. They do exist, though.

Per COX-2, the primary indication was relief of pain but as you know when you have the adverse events exceeding the beneficial effects of a specific compound, then you have a problem. As I noted, there is nothing wrong with profits but when you deceive and hide elements of drug labeling thinking no one will find out, then that is always bad. Isn't the goal of ethical conduct more important than deceit, which appears to sell if you can confuse stuff.

In Alt. Med, things are worse because there is less of a scientific knowledge based and most tend to say their system of Chee Gung is the BEst in the Universe, while lacking the tools in explaining why and under what conditions. I reference Falun Gong because of its "Evil Association" whereby despite one's feeling about it, the scientific process as explained can be duplicated (the knowledge base) thougj it would be expensive based on the equipment used. Obviously, more simpler strategies and monitoring equipment can make qigong and taijiquan more adaptable under all conditions.

[GeneChing]

This is obvious really. I'm ttt-ing it because our qigong forum needs a little luv.

Bee Healthy: Qi Gong shown to benefit COPD patients
BY JESSICA JACKSON
July 14, 2014

According to the National Qi Gong Association, Qi Gong is an ancient Chinese health care system that reestablishes the body/mind/soul connection. It has numerous health benefits and is practiced for spiritual enhancement, medical purposes, and even self-defense.

Qi (pronounced chee) is the Chinese word for energy or life force. Gong (pronounced gung) means skill obtained through constant practice. Qi Gong is essentially the practice of cultivating life energy through breathing techniques, postures, mental focus and movement.

There are many styles of Qi Gong and when practiced regularly the body’s stress levels decrease, endurance and energy increase and the immune system is enhanced. It also can improve functions of major organs, like the heart, lungs, liver and kidneys. Several scientific studies have shown Qi Gong’s particular impact on chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.

One study by Chun, Lee, Suen and Tam found that Qi Gong improves lung function and actually slows the progression of COPD. Participants in this study engaged in 60-minute Qi Gong sessions twice a week for several months. They were taught various breathing techniques and slow, gentle movements and after six months demonstrated a marked improvement in lung function, endurance and activity levels.

A different study by Leung, Alison, McKeough and Petus boasted similar findings. They found that participants in their study developed increased exercise capacity, improved balance and muscle strength, and enhanced quality of life.

Qi Gong is an effective, inexpensive, highly accessible and adaptable form of physical, mental and spiritual exercise. No special equipment is needed, so it can be practiced anywhere.

People of all fitness and skill levels can participate and benefit from practicing this art. It is especially beneficial for those who have chronic lung disease. It relieves anxiety/stress, increases energy levels, helps slow the progression of COPD and improves overall quality of life. There are a number of Qi Gong instructional books and DVDs available for purchase at bookstores and on the Internet. Many health and wellness centers offer classes, as well.

[Lee Chiang Po]

At great risk of being rediculed, I will tell you a true story about my experiences with qiigong. In late 2011 I was diagnosed as having very late stage abdominal cancer. I was told it was terminal, and that I didn't have a lot of time left. Such is life. Then an old doctor came to me and asked if I would let him try some new chemo and treatments on me since I really had no hope of survival anyway. I went along with it, but had no idea what I was getting myself into. The chemo started in early 2012, but it was extremely difficult. The very first treatment caused a heart attack. My 10th. On and off I was doing chemo treatments until early 2013, at which time they hollowed me out. The chemo had given them clearly defined lines for surgically removing the cancer. Something went terribly wrong, and I spent almost the entire year of 2013 in 4 different intensive care units. My family was again told I would soon die. Months went by, I was in and out of consciousness. Eventually, they sent me to a place where they care for you until you die. There was nothing more they could do for me.
I had been cut from my pelvic to my navel, and my bladder and a bunch of other stuff had been removed. I was cut right through my center of equalibriam, and I simply could not generate or focus my qi. I started by having an aid set me up in a chair. I started doing qigong exercises. It was difficult at first, and it caused pain in my belly, and I could not focus. Eventually, I was able to stand. I was generating qi and was starting to be able to focus it. I even started doing sil lim along with qigong. Then chum kil. All the doctors that worked with me were stricken with amazement that I not only survived, but I am doing very well. I am cancer free at the moment. I do qigong and my wing chun forms every day now. I can never be like I was, but I will be as good as I can be.
I can't tell you that qigong saved me from death, but it would seem that I had no other prospects at the time.

[Vajramusti]

At great risk of being rediculed, I will tell you a true story about my experiences with qiigong. In late 2011 I was diagnosed as having very late stage abdominal cancer. I was told it was terminal, and that I didn't have a lot of time left. Such is life. Then an old doctor came to me and asked if I would let him try some new chemo and treatments on me since I really had no hope of survival anyway. I went along with it, but had no idea what I was getting myself into. The chemo started in early 2012, but it was extremely difficult. The very first treatment caused a heart attack. My 10th. On and off I was doing chemo treatments until early 2013, at which time they hollowed me out. The chemo had given them clearly defined lines for surgically removing the cancer. Something went terribly wrong, and I spent almost the entire year of 2013 in 4 different intensive care units. My family was again told I would soon die. Months went by, I was in and out of consciousness. Eventually, they sent me to a place where they care for you until you die. There was nothing more they could do for me.
I had been cut from my pelvic to my navel, and my bladder and a bunch of other stuff had been removed. I was cut right through my center of equalibriam, and I simply could not generate or focus my qi. I started by having an aid set me up in a chair. I started doing qigong exercises. It was difficult at first, and it caused pain in my belly, and I could not focus. Eventually, I was able to stand. I was generating qi and was starting to be able to focus it. I even started doing sil lim along with qigong. Then chum kil. All the doctors that worked with me were stricken with amazement that I not only survived, but I am doing very well. I am cancer free at the moment. I do qigong and my wing chun forms every day now. I can never be like I was, but I will be as good as I can be.
I can't tell you that qigong saved me from death, but it would seem that I had no other prospects at the time.

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Thanks for sharing your story. What kind of qigong did you do?

[Lee Chiang Po]

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Thanks for sharing your story. What kind of qigong did you do?

I cannot give you a name for it, but I can attempt to explain it. I have several different exercises. Some are purely physical, others mostly meditation, and a couple that are both.
For healing in my abdomen I did a breathing exercise that entailed humming with a deep gutteral tone in an effort to vibrate the wounded area. I would imagine the generation of chi and mentally try to channel it upward. At first it made me feel ill and nausia. Eventually, I felt something that felt very strange, as it seemed like waves of sensation moving upward in my belly. By then I was standing. No strength, but able to stand for the first time in many months. I would place my palms over my wound as I hummed deeply, and then slowly brought my hands up my center line as high as I could reach, then brought my hands out to a 45 angle over my head and held that until I had expended all the air in my lungs. Then as I inhaled deeply and slowly I would bring my hands down and place them over the wound again. I was told that imagination was a great healer, so I would imagine pure energy flowing again from my center core. I would also sit for hours doing sil lim in my mind. I would not move except in my mind and thoughts. I would do it very slowly at first, then faster with time. This was a form of meditation, and my body responded by flowing energy through my body. This was my intention, whether or not it really happened.
If the mind can heal, this could be an example of it. I had been given up to the grim reaper, and it was said that nothing else could be done for me. I gain strength daily I feel, but due to the loss of heart I am now severely limited. But, I am also still alive for now.

[Hendrik]

Appreciate for your sharing!

I cannot give you a name for it, but I can attempt to explain it. I have several different exercises. Some are purely physical, others mostly meditation, and a couple that are both.
For healing in my abdomen I did a breathing exercise that entailed humming with a deep gutteral tone in an effort to vibrate the wounded area. I would imagine the generation of chi and mentally try to channel it upward. At first it made me feel ill and nausia. Eventually, I felt something that felt very strange, as it seemed like waves of sensation moving upward in my belly. By then I was standing. No strength, but able to stand for the first time in many months. I would place my palms over my wound as I hummed deeply, and then slowly brought my hands up my center line as high as I could reach, then brought my hands out to a 45 angle over my head and held that until I had expended all the air in my lungs. Then as I inhaled deeply and slowly I would bring my hands down and place them over the wound again. I was told that imagination was a great healer, so I would imagine pure energy flowing again from my center core. I would also sit for hours doing sil lim in my mind. I would not move except in my mind and thoughts. I would do it very slowly at first, then faster with time. This was a form of meditation, and my body responded by flowing energy through my body. This was my intention, whether or not it really happened.
If the mind can heal, this could be an example of it. I had been given up to the grim reaper, and it was said that nothing else could be done for me. I gain strength daily I feel, but due to the loss of heart I am now severely limited. But, I am also still alive for now.

[David Jamieson]

The Qigongs I practice do appear to be preventative measures against the ill effects of a sedate lifestyle, aging, etc.

My limbs are to that end limber, my joints are supple and do not crack or pop when bent in full range of motion. my breathing remains steady, deep and unfaltering an my ability to regulate force output is always gaining as I seek to use the least amount of force to get to the desired outcome.

Breathing in tandem with motion and related to output of energies and cultivation of good mind an body. This is what Qi Gong is and if that isn't preventative medicine through work, then I don't know what is.

[Syn7]

Would you agree that the specific movements are not as important as the fact that you are just moving? If you did full ranges of motion while breathing in a disciplined manner, does it really matter if your arm goes 'this way' before it goes 'that way'?

[David Jamieson]

Would you agree that the specific movements are not as important as the fact that you are just moving? If you did full ranges of motion while breathing in a disciplined manner, does it really matter if your arm goes 'this way' before it goes 'that way'?

Yes, I would agree.

I think the mystification of it is its greatest bane. There are a lot of people who really can't describe what it is and what it does.
You know what they say about an expert that can't explain something in laymens terms. They say s/he's no expert.

To that end, anything that has you using your limbs and using your breath on a regular basis will put you ahead of the person who doesn't.

In the west (North America primarily some European countries and of course, Koala bear land all tucked away down there with the kiwis.), daily exercise is getting more important, but for the longest time and even today, there are a great many people who do not exercises whatsoever and then they wonder why their body is getting fat, breaking down, aching etc.

Like any machine, if you don't use it, you will lose it. An idle engine rusts a lot faster than a used one.

As for all the reiki type stuff, I do believe that is essentially and physically nonsense. But I also believe that if it helps someone get over the psychosomatic response to their ailment, then it's ok in that instance. I also understand that there are outliers. There are some people who will claim all sorts of wondrous things to attribute to some practice or another. miracle cures and all that. But if it were a science, it would be repeatable, it's not repeatable and therefore, such claims of the purpose of the art are dubious at best and cast it into the realm of pseudo science which in turn leads others to completely trash it and lose out on the actual benefits.

In other words, don't let fake ass wannabe wizards near your health arts! they'll screw it up for sure. lol

[rett2]

Would you agree that the specific movements are not as important as the fact that you are just moving? If you did full ranges of motion while breathing in a disciplined manner, does it really matter if your arm goes 'this way' before it goes 'that way'?

I appreciate your healthy skepticism but I think you're simplifying a bit. It's not just about waving your arms around and breathing in relation to that. Just as you coordinate movement with breath, you also coordinate different parts of your body together, hips knees and arms being perhaps the most well-known example. So yeah if you reverse which hand goes which way you can really change the whole body meaning of the movement. And even an isolated movement can be done well or less well.

Someone for example whose shoulder tends to dislocate needs to pay very close attention to the shoulder-joint range of motion when moving the arms in exercise. But we actually all should have that level of attention, at least sometimes, whenever we're doing qigong. It's much better I believe to learn that from someone teaching a routine that has been thoughtfully put together than just randomly combining movements with the breath.

Another aspect is that movements can be aids for directing the attention. Our hands are very sensitive, for example, and this means it can be easier to direct caring attention to parts of the body if our hands are near that part of the body. That can be part of the meaning of certain movments. There's no hocus pocus to this. It's just how we're put together, embodied, and relate to our environment.

These kind of aspects are I believe part of the "package" of qigong routines and aren't easy to just make up or rediscover on one's own. And of course at times it can also be beneficial to forget all control and discipline and just let things go naturally.

Apologies if I've misrepresented what you meant or put words in your mouth.

[rett2]

As for all the reiki type stuff, I do believe that is essentially and physically nonsense. But I also believe that if it helps someone get over the psychosomatic response to their ailment, then it's ok in that instance.

I'm not sure how dismissive you mean to be here, but as I'm sure you know there are dozens (maybe hundreds) of muscles in our faces that are hooked up to the limbic system so that we can convey all kinds of subtle and not so subtle emotions through our faces. This is part of how we communicate as social animals. And actually the whole body is like a face, even if it's not so easy to see. Why is dance such an expressive art, and able to trigger a sympathetic emotional reaction in a viewer? We are incredibly sensitive beings and we are very embodied.

So yeah, we pretty much all are carrying things in our bodies in the forms of tensions in places like chest, throat, belly, shoulderblades and these tensions change our bodily perception. There's nothing hocus pocus about sensations and emotions arising from working with caring attention, stretching and movement with different parts of the body. And there's no point dismissing it as psychosomatic when this is the common situation most modern people find themselves in. These aspects I believe are very much a part of the meaning of qigong routines, the reiki type stuff and all that. Apart from things like buried wounds maybe it's possible also to find neglected abilities and possibilities.