Master a system first

[Drake]

Where did you get that idea?
If Kendo takes you 5 then iaijutsu well take you 10 and don't even go there with Kenjutsu !

Local opinion back when I had a stable life. And literature I owned.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Apparently things have changed. Last I checked (in 1997-ish), it took a good half a decade just to get anywhere. Apparently popular consensus is now saying two or three.

I retract my statement, since I haven't touched the stuff in over ten years.

I spent about 5 years doing Kendo, the last 2 more focused on the yagyu-shinkage system of Kenjutsu, at the Japanese Cultural Center here in Toronto.
I saw a few guys come and go at the time and most got the basics of Kendo in the first couple years.
The guys that had the hardest time were guys that had actual Blade work experience.

[MightyB]

and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with dedicating to just one style. What I'm saying is that you should give a system at least 3 years before you start jumping around. I don't like the chase the flavor of the month attitude that young MAists sometimes carry.

The "I'll do 6 months Tae Kwon Do for kicking, then I'll switch to 6 months of Judo for throwing, and then I'll do a seminar in Jiu Jitsu... and man- I'll have it. I'll start my own system 'cuz I'll have all the ranges down man. Heck- I'll even do a 6 week class on Yoga so I'll have the internal. I'll call it Rex Kwon Do... or Spetz Nas".

3 years should be sufficient to gain enough proficiency to be able to start making good choices on how you should compliment your base style.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Would anyone argue that 3 years is enough to get a "handle" on Boxing or MT?

[MightyB]

Would anyone argue that 3 years is enough to get a "handle" on Boxing or MT?

Good one Sanjuro. That is a great barometer. Seriously- why shouldn't a TMA stylist have the same expectations from their system?

[Water Dragon]

Would anyone argue that 3 years is enough to get a "handle" on Boxing or MT?

Yeah, I would agree with that.

For me, to get to the point where I could 'use' the art was about a year for Tai Chi, a year for BJJ, 2-3 for boxing/Muay Thai, and about 5 for things like Judo and Shuai Chiao.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Good one Sanjuro. That is a great barometer. Seriously- why shouldn't a TMA stylist have the same expectations from their system?

If they don't then what is wrong with THEM?

[Drake]

But this DOES beg the question... if a style takes more than 3 years to get the basics down...is it worth the investment?

[sanjuro_ronin]

But this DOES beg the question... if a style takes more than 3 years to get the basics down...is it worth the investment?

As with all things, it depends on WHY you are doing it.

NO system takes that long really, I mean, MA systems were made to train people to fight and NO ONE waited 3 years to be able to NOT get killed !

[Drake]

As with all things, it depends on WHY you are doing it.

NO system takes that long really, I mean, MA systems were made to train people to fight and NO ONE waited 3 years to be able to NOT get killed !

'After 16 years, I am still learning kata. The okuiai set, consisting, in our practice, of 18 forms (kata), is constructed in such a way as to make any weaknesses in my previous practice readily apparent. As a beginning student, I used to admire my teachers gliding though these forms, thinking they didn't look so hard. I was anxious to get through the basics and learn the cool stuff. Well, without the basics, I can't even approach the cool stuff. One lesson learned.

Another, more powerful lesson is that iaido takes so long to learn, by the time you get to the okuiai forms, you are starting to feel the toll of life on muscles and joints. Maybe my fingers ache a little, maybe my arms, due to carpal tunnel syndrome unrelated to iai practice, begin to hurt after a few hours. ****, just when I thought I was getting somewhere."

http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=207

It's on Iaido

[sanjuro_ronin]

'After 16 years, I am still learning kata. The okuiai set, consisting, in our practice, of 18 forms (kata), is constructed in such a way as to make any weaknesses in my previous practice readily apparent. As a beginning student, I used to admire my teachers gliding though these forms, thinking they didn't look so hard. I was anxious to get through the basics and learn the cool stuff. Well, without the basics, I can't even approach the cool stuff. One lesson learned.

Another, more powerful lesson is that iaido takes so long to learn, by the time you get to the okuiai forms, you are starting to feel the toll of life on muscles and joints. Maybe my fingers ache a little, maybe my arms, due to carpal tunnel syndrome unrelated to iai practice, begin to hurt after a few hours. ****, just when I thought I was getting somewhere."

http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=207

It's on Iaido

Iaido is an art, it is not a fighting system as such it is designed to focus on "unattainable perfection".

Battojutsu was learnable in months and could be effective in less than a year.
Samurai didn't have the luxury to wait longer...

[TAO YIN]

It shouldn't take three years to learn how to use a style, especially if the person has the proper time to train.

[Drake]

Iaido is an art, it is not a fighting system as such it is designed to focus on "unattainable perfection".

Battojutsu was learnable in months and could be effective in less than a year.
Samurai didn't have the luxury to wait longer...

Topic was about "systems". You didn't say nothin' 'bout fightin'

[sanjuro_ronin]

It shouldn't take three years to learn how to use a style, especially if the person has the proper time to train.

Agreed, but I think it is a good guidline as arbitrary number go.

Topic was about "systems". You didn't say nothin' 'bout fightin'

And Paul takes one in the left nut !!

[MightyB]

Topic was about "systems". You didn't say nothin' 'bout fightin'

Using THAT as a guide - then there is no end because no system can truly be mastered.