Yiquan

[sanjuro_ronin]

He makes some very valid points and states well know facts.
But, this, if true, worries me:

he foundational practice of the style is standing and Wang supposedly would have students do standing, in front of him, for 8 hours straight as a "test" of their mastery (this is based on, AFAIK, 3rd hand report, I believe); after standing practice there is some solo movement practice, but much of the style is dedicated to live partner work: close quarter bridging work that looks like a hybrid of push hands and chi sao; then they do a lot of non-contact sparring work as well;

[bawang]

well bro, at least u r willing to look at things w/out fooling urself - that's more than most are willing to do; "be the change that u want to see", or sumthing like that

if training kung fu is ur entire life how can u do nothing
dood

[taai gihk yahn]

He makes some very valid points and states well know facts.
But, this, if true, worries me:

well, I heard it from a student of a student of a student, so, you know...

but what specifically worries you about it?

addendum:
oh - when I say "non-contact", sorry, I meant as in starting without being in contact with each other to start with, like when you train chi sao / trapping, not as in not hitting each other...LOL, that WOULD be a problem!

[sanjuro_ronin]

well, I heard it from a student of a student of a student, so, you know...

but what specifically worries you about it?


oh - when I say "non-contact", sorry, I meant as in starting without being in contact with each other like when you train chi sao / trapping, not as in not hitting each other...LOL, that WOULD be a problem!

Someone advocating a more practical approach to MA, advocating fighting and yet, not fighting.

[bawang]

probably just a story

more realistically would be holding a 200 pound barbell in horse stance or a 50 pound stone ball in standing post or tying a giant mill to ur testicles and dragging it

[sanjuro_ronin]

probably just a story

Well, I once stood in a horse stance for a whole freaking hour !
Why?
Do some masters daughter and find out for yourself !

[taai gihk yahn]

Someone advocating a more practical approach to MA, advocating fighting and yet, not fighting.

wel, the guy wasn't just going to chuk his entire culture out the window; standing practice, IMPE, is about developing increased awareness of your body in space in as non-contextually complex a situation as possible: it's about feeling how your body changes in gravity when you are standing still, in order to have more acute awareness when you start moving; it also helps release excess tension, it teaches you to feel how ground reaction force moves up through your structure to give you that "floating" effect, it teaches you about calming the discursive mind, etc., etc.; it's not a bad thing to do in general, although i agree that the contribution to fighting is incidental as opposed to prerequisite

but again, AFAIK, they also put on the gloves and banged away at each other - I think Ross posted some vids of them training heavy bag, footwork, etc. at one point (although I understand that there are some peeps out there doing yiquan who reverted back to the "I touch you and you go sailing through the air" silliness as well...)

[taai gihk yahn]

Well, I once stood in a horse stance for a whole freaking hour !
Why?
Do some masters daughter and find out for yourself !

She made you stand in horse for an hour? was that before or after she let you in the Jade Gate?

[CFT]

She made you stand in horse for an hour? was that before or after she let you in the Jade Gate?

Or during? You da man S_R!

[sanjuro_ronin]

wel, the guy wasn't just going to chuk his entire culture out the window; standing practice, IMPE, is about developing increased awareness of your body in space in as non-contextually complex a situation as possible: it's about feeling how your body changes in gravity when you are standing still, in order to have more acute awareness when you start moving; it also helps release excess tension, it teaches you to feel how ground reaction force moves up through your structure to give you that "floating" effect, it teaches you about calming the discursive mind, etc., etc.; it's not a bad thing to do in general, although i agree that the contribution to fighting is incidental as opposed to prerequisite

but again, AFAIK, they also put on the gloves and banged away at each other - I think Ross posted some vids of them training heavy bag, footwork, etc. at one point (although I understand that there are some peeps out there doing yiquan who reverted back to the "I touch you and you go sailing through the air" silliness as well...)

Excellent !
Hey, I do standing qigong too, its good stuff.

[sanjuro_ronin]

She made you stand in horse for an hour? was that before or after she let you in the Jade Gate?

Yeah, that Jade gate is what got me in trouble in the first place !!

[Frost]

without having read the wiki article, my understanding is that the whole "idea" behind yiquan was that Wang Xiangzhai was of the opinion that a) practicing forms was an artifact and a waste of time () and b) that because of the emphasis on forms practice as opposed to live drilling, TCMA had lost its capacity for practical application (); and this from a man whose base system was xingyi, mind you, hardly a system known for "flowery" hands!

the foundational practice of the style is standing and Wang supposedly would have students do standing, in front of him, for 8 hours straight as a "test" of their mastery (this is based on, AFAIK, 3rd hand report, I believe); after standing practice there is some solo movement practice, but much of the style is dedicated to live partner work: close quarter bridging work that looks like a hybrid of push hands and chi sao; then they do a lot of non-contact sparring work as well;

in regards to the standing, Wang's purpose for this was to create fluidity in movement; personally, I can attest to how practicing standing worked for me in this regard; whether it makes me a better fighter, I don't know, but qualitatively my taiji movement has continued to be less disjointed over the years; I attribute this to standing because I have experimented by not practicing taiji for periods of time and focusing on standing alone, and then doing taiji and seeing the differences, as well as having it verified by my teacher watching me; just a subjective perspective, of course, I am unable to generalize this phenomenon;

the interesting thing is that when u see yiquan guys fight, it looks more like boxing / kickboxing than it does TCMA "fighting" (whatever that really may be); suggesting that, if Wang was looking for a "natural" stye of fighting, that us silly, external westerners might actually be onto something!

rumor has it that no one cared to fu(k w/Wang, and he supposedly had a running add in a Beijing newspaper inviting all comers, and despite many challengers, was undefeated; of course, I have no proof of this, so it's hard to say for certain;

what a teacher advocating sparring over forms and taking on challengers in actual fights.... never!

the sad was (as you pointed out later) some of his students did revert back to the no touch flying about crap

[lkfmdc]

If he was a forum member, posting that here, someone would insist he had never learned real CMA and didn't understand how "internal" works!

[kfson]

If he was a forum member, posting that here, someone would insist he had never learned real CMA and didn't understand how "internal" works!

[taai gihk yahn]

Excellent !
Hey, I do standing qigong too, its good stuff.

[insert standard HW108 comment regarding your lack of authentic TCMA experience here]

what a teacher advocating sparring over forms and taking on challengers in actual fights.... never!
the sad was (as you pointed out later) some of his students did revert back to the no touch flying about crap

it just goes to show you that even when someone is given a diamond they can still refuse it for cubic zirconium...

If he was a forum member, posting that here, someone would insist he had never learned real CMA and didn't understand how "internal" works!

perhaps he already has Dave, perhaps he already has...