Qigong and/Vs Modern Strength training

[YouKnowWho]

The difference between the modern strength training (MST) and the traditional strength training (TST) is the MST separate the strength training and combat skill training. The TST combines both strength training and combat skill training into one. In TST, you decide what skill that you want to develop, you then decide what kind of training that will be needed to enhance your skill. In MST, when you build your big muscle, you are not thinking about combat skill at that moment. The difference is "indirect (for MST)" vs. "direct (for TST)".

[uki]

The difference between the modern strength training (MST) and the traditional strength training (TST) is the MST separate the strength training and combat skill training. The TST combines both strength training and combat skill training into one. In TST, you decide what skill that you want to develop, you then decide what kind of training that will be needed to enhance your skill. In MST, when you build your big muscle, you are not thinking about combat skill at that moment. The difference is "indirect (for MST)" vs. "direct (for TST)".

now that is some true sh!t right there. well said.

[Hendrik]

IMHO,


1, the issue here is lots people including the so called grandmaster writting books without even has attainment. Thus, they are speculating instead of going to their train body and just describe what it is when it comes to Qigong. If we follow this type of stuffs we are actually getting ourself into trouble.


2, Big muscle got nothing to do with Qi Stagnation. look at our body, take the arm, there is the Yin path which has less muscle and Yan part which has more muscle. and the Qi flow perfectly well with both conditions.


3, The reason Qigong needs to totally let go of applying one more ounce of strenght while practicing it is not about against strenght; but while open up the path/part of the body, one needs to really loose up that area/path and let it expand.

If strenght are use in approprietly then the part/path needs to be "open up" end up become a "close" blind spot. This will hinderance the training of that area and it will not going in deep into the body/internal organs but limit its penetration; and to the worse the area got stuck or latch or hold on which cause Qi stagnation.

Thus, Qigong training needs to be as lite as possible to avoid any unneccesary issue.


4, as for using Strenght, walking is using strenght, kicking is using strenght. The key is after the Qigong training the way of how to use strenght has been transform.



5, also while practicing without using strenght and the heart beat is at relax state, the body Qi is almost non dissipative or even preserve and growing. This is very different then the practice which is dissipative or using strenght in a more rigid way in general.




6, as a comparison, say the ibuki and the Six healing sound. Ibuki is using strenght and force the body in a holding and discharging way to exercise the body. and based on the exercising, one strenghting the body.

While six healing sound training is to loose and expand everything and let the nature taking its own path, lead the qi to flow , balance, and grow, and nuture deep into the internal organs, while whispering the sound with no voice to directly triggle different internal organs.

One certainly can do Ibuki to strenghten one's body, provided the body is healty and the qi is adequate.

However, if the person got heavier internal injury such as in liver, heart, kidney....etc due to improper training or injury in fighting or stress or food.

Then Ibuki is no longer a good thing to practice because it will contribute to more damage due to forcing the body which already in an imbalance and lack of qi state.

So, six healing sound is used here to rebuild the body. The ancient include those in Shao Lin, actually use the six healing sound to clear out the body internal injury.



So, one needs to know what is one doing. Again, the best thing is get a sifu who knows the stuffs. Reading books are just problematic.

Good books from the ancient masters are good only for those who already have the attainment and need further direction. that is not everyone's piece of cake.





An analogy is watching a hiking movie and actually going hiking. those who mistakenly thinking they know how to hike because they watches some hiking movies is problematic.

In those cases, the movie watching expert might turn around asking why do one needs walking sticks? Just hike. (according to the movies he watches)

Well, sitting in the sofa watching movie is a different thing when one needs to use one's legs to hike. while in real life, one's legs might needs some aid due to it is not in the good condition to hike....etc. and the movie watching expert dont have a clue on real life.

So, dont get yourself into trouble, avoid those movies watcher or books reader experts
Sure some movies watcher expert will claim --- according to their direct experience you are wrong.

Well, what the movie watcher dont know is their so called direct experience comes from sitting on their a$$ and fantasy. and those type of experience is the worse to mislead people. But sure, those who has hike before right the way avoid these experts because these experts are talking nonsense.



Just 2 cents to share.

[Frost]

The difference between the modern strength training (MST) and the traditional strength training (TST) is the MST separate the strength training and combat skill training. The TST combines both strength training and combat skill training into one. In TST, you decide what skill that you want to develop, you then decide what kind of training that will be needed to enhance your skill. In MST, when you build your big muscle, you are not thinking about combat skill at that moment. The difference is "indirect (for MST)" vs. "direct (for TST)".

not really the functional guys like to develop strength specifically for the skills invloved (SAID principle), JC santana using the big bands for throws for example, or using heavy dummies for throwing practise, or using cables for punching practise...the list goes on and on

other coaches prefer to develop general strength first and then make that sports specific (afterall you can get alot stronger deadlifting and powercleaning than you can do simply mimicing a sports performace movement with added resistance). No modern strength coach just goes out to develop big muscles you are developing the CNS and the muscle fibers to make them lift more weight with an eye to being able to throw someone more explosively or hit them harder, you then convert this new found strength into sports specific strength through sparring and actually doing your sport

[David Jamieson]

I think the difference between body building and strength training needs to be clearly understood.

modern strength training is not all body building and body building is not about functional strength development but rather it is about sculpting the body to suit a particular look.

so, mst can be fully compatible with ones martial arts development. Especially those regimens that focus on total body strength and task specific strength development.

[Scott R. Brown]

It might even be fair to say that those of us on this board who perform adjunct strength training know more about Qigong than those here who do strictly Qigong know about modern strength training methods!

[TAO YIN]

Strength training won't make you as fast as Qi Gong will usually...

Both are awesome; both are strength training!

[Scott R. Brown]

Strength training won't make you as fast as Qi Gong will usually...

Both are awesome; both are strength training!

Anyone who trains seriously knows that speed training is NOT strength training. Although there is also speed-strength training!

[uki]

Anyone who trains seriously knows that speed training is NOT strength training. Although there is also speed-strength training!

iron ball juggling is an excellent way to develop speed while weight training at the same time.

[Frost]

Strength training won't make you as fast as Qi Gong will usually...

Both are awesome; both are strength training!

yes it will, it will make you faster, hence most sprinetrs do strength training along with technique training and not qi gong

[uki]

yes it will, it will make you faster, hence most sprinetrs do strength training along with technique training and not qi gong

perhaps, but sprinters don't have the lung gom either.

[Scott R. Brown]

iron ball juggling is an excellent way to develop speed while weight training at the same time.

I get the feeling you are biased towards juggling!

[sanjuro_ronin]

The difference between the modern strength training (MST) and the traditional strength training (TST) is the MST separate the strength training and combat skill training. The TST combines both strength training and combat skill training into one. In TST, you decide what skill that you want to develop, you then decide what kind of training that will be needed to enhance your skill. In MST, when you build your big muscle, you are not thinking about combat skill at that moment. The difference is "indirect (for MST)" vs. "direct (for TST)".

Actually, that is not correct.
Sport specific strength building is used by every athelete.
The difference is that it has been shown that DOING sport specific movements with weights is NOT as benefitial as doing a general strengthening regime to strenght the bodys muscles and THEN doing sport specific moves after those muscles have been strengthened.
And building big muscles is only ONE very small part of ST and not one that most athletes use anyway.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Strong muscles = strong muscles which = faster muscles and muscles that are less suceptible to injury also.

There really is NO reason NOT to do both Qigong and MST, truly.

[Frost]

Actually, that is not correct.
Sport specific strength building is used by every athelete.
The difference is that it has been shown that DOING sport specific movements with weights is NOT as benefitial as doing a general strengthening regime to strenght the bodys muscles and THEN doing sport specific moves after those muscles have been strengthened.
And building big muscles is only ONE very small part of ST and not one that most athletes use anyway.

i said this!