Ng chan wing chun

[MOSHE]

Is "lat sau jik chung" manual or automatic? (In other words, is it the result of your seeing a gap and intentionally attacking, or is it the result of a mistake the opponent makes which causes themselves to get hit, like loading and releasing a spring into themselves?)

Hello

To answer simple ,quick and to give the whole meaning of our wing chun
We are always deciding how to open the space to enter and how to hit in an active way
We don't wait for errors or detection of the next move from the opponent like most of people are practising the chi Sao in a passive way

We just want to drive the situation and with a movement ahead

the ability is how to develop the special strength and know how to achieve it

[LFJ]

Of course chi-sau doesn't have to be only passive, but the reaction of lat sau jik chung is not simply an intentional strike when a gap is seen by the eyes, whether created by yourself or by the opponent's error.

That kind of fighting I would consider even more passive because you're relying on sight alone rather than feeling. So you're acting upon what you see. It's a slow and manual way of finding and striking targets.

That's why blindfolded chi-sau is thought of as being mystical by you lot, because you have no use for sensitivity or concept of lat sau jik chung. (There's apparently two of you playing on the same team, and neither can explain the concept.) That is also why the chi-sau videos on your website show structureless slap fests, because it's two guys just trying to hit each other not caring what the other does.

http://www.wingchunkyn.com/videos/students-practices
http://www.wingchunkyn.com/videos/li-shou

[Vajramusti]

Of course chi-sau doesn't have to be only passive, but the reaction of lat sau jik chung is not simply an intentional strike when a gap is seen by the eyes, whether created by yourself or by the opponent's error.

That kind of fighting I would consider even more passive because you're relying on sight alone rather than feeling. So you're acting upon what you see. It's a slow and manual way of finding and striking targets.

That's why blindfolded chi-sau is thought of as being mystical by you lot, because you have no use for sensitivity or concept of lat sau jik chung. (There's apparently two of you playing on the same team, and neither can explain the concept.) That is also why the chi-sau videos on your website show structureless slap fests, because it's two guys just trying to hit each other not caring what the other does.

http://www.wingchunkyn.com/videos/students-practices
http://www.wingchunkyn.com/videos/li-shou

-----------------------------------------------You (plural) appear to talk past each other.I am not from either one of your groups but Moshe did not deny the importance of sensitivity. .. can be a vague word-- sensitivity to what? In the last video you cited one guy seems to hold his structure in going forward- one step ahead of the other. Blindfold chi sao is more for show- not necessary for development imo.

[LFJ]

Blindfold chi sao is more for show- not necessary for development imo.

Yup, of course. But it is showing something. It's a demonstration, not of magic but of skill apparently unheard of by these guys who need to see the target to find and hit it.

[k gledhill]

Hello

To answer simple ,quick and to give the whole meaning of our wing chun
We are always deciding how to open the space to enter and how to hit in an active way
We don't wait for errors or detection of the next move from the opponent like most of people are practising the chi Sao in a passive way

We just want to drive the situation and with a movement ahead

the ability is how to develop the special strength and know how to achieve it

Thanks, can you post a clip ?

[wtxs]

I feel very sorry for you. When you watch a foreign movie, through 2hours all the things will leave in your mind are just those subtitles……

Thank you for your kindness, I felt sorry for me also, for I've made the mistake of viewing some of the videos on your site.

I'm also very impressed with you non-WC related come back.

When are you going to address the question which I've posted? How do you track two targets (high and low) and attack them at the same time?

You can only "actively see" one target at a time ... some may call it the "primary focus". The second target is sensed or "see", if you want to use that term, by your peripheral vision, which lots of WC'er would lump it under sensitivity.

[Ali. R]

Yup, of course. But it is showing something. It's a demonstration, not of magic but of skill apparently unheard of by these guys who need to see the target to find and hit it.

Now that’s a whole lot of common sense right there.

[andysken]

Thank you for your kindness, I felt sorry for me also, for I've made the mistake of viewing some of the videos on your site.

I'm also very impressed with you non-WC related come back.

When are you going to address the question which I've posted? How do you track two targets (high and low) and attack them at the same time?

You can only "actively see" one target at a time ... some may call it the "primary focus". The second target is sensed or "see", if you want to use that term, by your peripheral vision, which lots of WC'er would lump it under sensitivity.

Well you still didn't understand. When you watch a movie with subtitles, you can watch the subtitles with the videos, right? That's the same in Wing Chun. Because, every attack you give to others is in a second, all you have to do is, see where to hit first, then you can hit on them.

[andysken]

Thank you for your kindness, I felt sorry for me also, for I've made the mistake of viewing some of the videos on your site.

I'm also very impressed with you non-WC related come back.

When are you going to address the question which I've posted? How do you track two targets (high and low) and attack them at the same time?

You can only "actively see" one target at a time ... some may call it the "primary focus". The second target is sensed or "see", if you want to use that term, by your peripheral vision, which lots of WC'er would lump it under sensitivity.

And about the sense. I didn't say Wing Chun doesn't need to sense the opponent's power to decide which skill to use. What did I say is: Chi-Sau with eyes closing is not the right way for training, as it can't be used in the real fight. If I made you guys confused, then I'm sorry, I didn't have learnt English for years.

[Vajramusti]

And about the sense. I didn't say Wing Chun doesn't need to sense the opponent's power to decide which skill to use. What did I say is: Chi-Sau with eyes closing is not the right way for training, as it can't be used in the real fight. If I made you guys confused, then I'm sorry, I didn't have learnt English for years.

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Andy- English id not my first language. You have the name "Andy"- what is your language background?
Your language use appears to get in the way of explaining Ng Chan Wing chun. Too bad.

[LFJ]

And about the sense. I didn't say Wing Chun doesn't need to sense the opponent's power to decide which skill to use. What did I say is: Chi-Sau with eyes closing is not the right way for training, as it can't be used in the real fight. If I made you guys confused, then I'm sorry, I didn't have learnt English for years.

Of course you wouldn't close your eyes in fighting, but are you or are you not saying that you need to see the target in order to hit it? So your kryptonite is an attack from the rear.

Eyes closed or blindfolded chi-sau is not used for training, at least not as I do it. It's a demonstration to show that we are not relying on eyesight to find open targets and strike them. When sensitivity and lat sau jik chung are well developed it happens automatically. This is a skill. If you can't perform blindfolded chi-sau your skill is still underdeveloped.

[andysken]

Of course you wouldn't close your eyes in fighting, but are you or are you not saying that you need to see the target in order to hit it? So your kryptonite is an attack from the rear.

Eyes closed or blindfolded chi-sau is not used for training, at least not as I do it. It's a demonstration to show that we are not relying on eyesight to find open targets and strike them. When sensitivity and lat sau jik chung are well developed it happens automatically. This is a skill. If you can't perform blindfolded chi-sau your skill is still underdeveloped.

Now I understood what you said. As you are a Chinese, you are familiar with acupuncture point(穴位). And in the essay, there's a punch called “phoenix-staring punch”. This kind of punch is aiming the acupuncture point, with one hit, letting the opponent lose control of his/her arms. That's the reason why we do not train to do the blindfolded one. And that's why within 3 movement, Wing Chun can kill people.

[andysken]

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Andy- English id not my first language. You have the name "Andy"- what is your language background?
Your language use appears to get in the way of explaining Ng Chan Wing chun. Too bad.

Well, I'm a Chinese, now I'm not studying English. And there are too many words I can't translate in Wing Chun field. That makes Translation more difficult.

[LFJ]

Now I understood what you said. As you are a Chinese, you are familiar with acupuncture point(穴位). And in the essay, there's a punch called “phoenix-staring punch”. This kind of punch is aiming the acupuncture point, with one hit, letting the opponent lose control of his/her arms. That's the reason why we do not train to do the blindfolded one. And that's why within 3 movement, Wing Chun can kill people.

I'm actually not Chinese and I'm still familiar with 穴位. Being Chinese doesn't grant you special knowledge or ability.

You haven't understood, we don't do blindfolded chi-sau for training. It is only a demonstration of a skill to find and strike targets without relying on eyesight. We never train to kill each other in chi-sau anyway. It's a drill for mutual improvement.

Eyes alone are too slow. That's why Wing Chun also uses sensitivity and lat sau jik chung to instinctively strike when a weakness is sensed, not just when an opening is seen.

You also can't trust your eyes. As you are Chinese, you should be familiar with "杯弓蛇影". What you see as an open target may not be a weakness at all. Your eyes can lie to you, but feeling is honest.

[wtxs]

And about the sense. I didn't say Wing Chun doesn't need to sense the opponent's power to decide which skill to use. What did I say is: Chi-Sau with eyes closing is not the right way for training, as it can't be used in the real fight. If I made you guys confused, then I'm sorry, I didn't have learnt English for years.

Chi Sao in itself is an training tool, to develop fighting attributes, with or without eyes open, stationary or mobile. If Chi Sao with eyes closed is not the correct way of training, then going with your assumption it would also be wrong way of training with eyes open?

I am confused, I wasn't aware of that Chi Sao is for fighting ... thanks for the enlightenment.

By the way, your English and expression are fine, however. some of your reasoning is up in the cloud, so don't use that as an excuse.