Ng chan wing chun

[YungChun]

Please be specific.

Don't hold your breath Victor..

[bennyvt]

wow thats a new one. He was the only person to learn proper VT. So leung shueng, lok yiu, wong sun leung, tsui sun tin, yip bo ching (who I have heard was his best guy but doesn't teach) all were not taught properly. So he let people teach a ****ty version of VT using his good name.
I think a few people have already claimed the "I was the one who learnt real ving tsun and no one else did" I think details would be helpfull to see if this just another, master of almightyness complex.

[hunt1]

Benny Yip Bo Ching has been dead for a long time. Died before Yip Man. He did and didn't teach depending on your pov. He had a few friends he trained as workout partners and to help improve his wing chun but no he never had a school or officially had students.

[MOSHE]

hello,

i have to tell you that first im in this forum because i try to be in contact with a member who said that his father was a student of ng chan.so ive been catched by the interest to inform who practise wing chun about some that i know

anyway the more important is that people enjoy what they are doing and after to be abble to appreciate themselves ,honestly if what they are practising is answering to their expectations

to do this ,you have two ways ,
to test yourself with others and to check if technicly speaking (certainly not with physic strength) you drive the situation
or to meet more sifus and to see if they have something special

you asked me about william cheung
the difference between his wing chun and the one of ng chan is big ,very far

the position of the basics movements ,we can say can look close but in fact in the insight of wing chun are quite far
the stance is different
and the know how totally different
i have no time to start a description of all the movements

but i will try to explain in general and if you have a good mastering (sensation) of your body and some experience you will understand the point

i recall you first that the strength and energy that you have to provide in wing chun has to be the one that we are expecting from a women (who doesnt try to look like a man)

plus in wing chun when the hand launch an attack ,it has to come back only one the opponent is down and this in one movement
but one movement in wing chun is not like boxing where your punch and the hand step back each time for the following to attack

in wing chun the hand doents step back but when your arm meet an obstacle ,than you circulate by the shortest way (and this, as often you need) to strike the point you decide to strike
this is called one movement because during this your sensation and strengh move on differents locations of your forearm and hand and this never stop ,if its sopped your become dead in the way of wing chun because at this moment you are not anymore driving the situation (an empty moment)
if between each movement you stop your flow even a micro sec in you arm (like for exemple physical style of fighting when there is a break or a contraction between 2 movements ) you are not anymore practising what is making the specificty of wing chun
so knowing that a women created this style and is abble to provide a very particular strength ,and is abble to use the opponent force as well ;she organised differents movements which ones help to create a leverage in order to deflect attacks ,to control all kind of energy in the opponent arm and to allow you to circulate without any break or stop in the flow of your movements
this said should help anyone to keep in mind the purpose of wing chun

simple exemple ;you do bon sao followed by tan sao like you learned ,you must feel that the transition between both kill your flow of continuous sensation and stength to control continusly an other arm
that is not a good leverage

i hope i have answered to your expectation ,and sorry for my english (being french)
regards

[MOSHE]

not sure if i sent to right thread

[LoneTiger108]

let me add something ,i have been during a while the only student of ki ping pun ,i neither paid anything ,because himself when he was leaving at ng chan house didnt pay anything.the only price that i have to provide was only to show motivation and to train serously but i receive an very classic teaching ,i neither practise repeating the same sequence of movement 20 times that an different sequence. i had to get familiar with a concept attached to each movement and that to be free of the movement and this is already the base of wing chun because if you train several time the same sequence ,its already not anymore wing chun

This is interesting to me because it sounds like we have had a similar experience in our learning of Wing Chun. I guess the term toedai may be familar to you?

It would be good to hear more from you. Share some more ideas of what Ng Chans Wing Chun was like and how you practise today. You have forms? Concepts? Curriculums?

[Ultimatewingchun]

You sent it to the right thread.

[stonecrusher69]

***BUT THIS PART OF YOUR STATEMENT IS UNCLEAR? What is the reason for the differences between William Cheung's movements and those of Yip man and Ng Chan?

if you are not teached the best way ,or for the time you need to accomplished youself;
so ,if you were too young and not enough mature to undestand the system
or if you are missing some technics ,you will try to substitute one way or another.
Your physic as well will influence your technics ;
if you tall ,short ,or slim or fat ,with muscles ...
See what happened with people who have implemented wing chun with ,grabbling ,fighting on the ground ,chi kong,shina ...
they go far from the authentic W C
BUT at the same time if when ,fighting against another style and as a result you see that you are not doing more than kick boxing ,you can tell yourself that you have not been teached wing chun
and please this is not a way to offend people who train serously and honnestly ,but just to try to give you an true picture of the reality of a style that not everybody can have access to authentic one
but this can help you to question yourselves ,to ask you question about you training and the way to improve it
let me add something ,i have been during a while the only student of ki ping pun ,i neither paid anything ,because himself when he was leaving at ng chan house didnt pay anything.the only price that i have to provide was only to show motivation and to train serously but i receive an very classic teaching ,i neither practise repeating the same sequence of movement 20 times that an different sequence.
i had to get familiar with a concept attached to each movement and that to be free of the movement
and this is already the base of wing chun because if you train several time the same sequence ,its already not anymore wing chun
wing chun try to teach to ready for any kind of situation that you will try to drive yourself but if you plane something too precise during the training you become dead and your technic is mechanic not alife like it should be
there is neither the two same situations in fighting
i understand that people who live from the teaching has to be abble to provide something to motivate their student but training in a mechanical way kill the system and the ability to improve above the movements[/QUOTE]

Just flow!!

[MOSHE]

i dont have this term in mind

[Phil Redmond]

@ moshe Are you saying that the only good WC student was Ng Chan and that the only good WC is from Yip Man?
Yip Man had seniors you know.
What about the WC that Leung Jan taught when he went back to his native village of Gu Lo? Of course you know who Leung Jan was.

[MOSHE]

i dont make any judment about what is good or not
i just say that regarding what was the style at the begining ,the one from yip man that he received from the son of leung chan is the closest to
speaking about the way it is practised in china for example ,the wing chun of sung sun (i dont remember the exact name) ,i knew his daughter in france and practised at this time with her husband ,its is quite physical and not the same approach of the one of yip man which one is more feminine.ome reason was that sha wa chan had very strong arms ,so in this system they use a lot the larp sao
concerning ng chan ,perhaps there is others who received the same as him ,i dont know.
what i can tell you ,is that what they show up to their students or on their website is out of the roots and authentaticity of wing chun.

[LoneTiger108]

I'm trying to understand your posts MOSHE but it is quite difficult!

If I've picked up what I think I've picked up from this last one then I can see where you're coming from and can (almost) agree! If I were you I wouldn't concern yourself too much with what is available online and what is authentic.

Wing Chun has grown far more than ANYONE expected and this does mean that it will develop in it's own way. Some for good and some not. At least you now have that scope to choose from and it sounds like you have a good grounding anyway.

[Bully]

Where abouts in France are you Moshe?

[yellow aster]

It is very interesting to learn about another student of Yip Man. I had never heard of this individual before. Merci.

[Vajramusti]

It is very interesting to learn about another student of Yip Man. I had never heard of this individual before. Merci.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ditto for sure. I ignore the comments on the uniqueness of that lineage pending more information.

joy chaudhuri