Shaolin confused

[Hendrik]

It is about capable to get out of the prison and free instead of ALL TALK NO ACTION ZEN.


Who cares about using other's or using others' story to approve one's view? those got nothing to do with to be free.



A Ch'an anecdotal story:

"When he was young the Ch'an Master Ma-tzu was known for his hard practicing. One day Huai-jang, came upon Ma-tzu meditating. Having heard of his reputation, Huai-jang decided to test Ma-tzu. Huai-jang asked Ma-tzu what is the purpose of his meditation. Ma-tzu replied that he was practicing to become an enlightened being, a Buddha.

Huai-jang then picked up a brick and started rubbing it with a rock. After some time observing Huai-jang's actions, Ma-tzu asked "Why are you rubbing the brick with a rock?" he asked.

Huai-jang answered, "I'm polishing it into a mirror."

Ma-tzu said, "How can you make a mirror by polishing a brick?"

Huai-jang's said, "How can you become a Buddha by practicing meditation?" Hearing these words, Ma-tzu had a realization."[/QUOTE]

[Hendrik]

Just because you are trapped within your own prison cell does not justify trapping others in there with you! Shame on you!

The above statement is an evidence of attachement to one's view and when it is not approved, attempting to control via any means.

That is the prison, the survival prison wall. and until one could get out of these one knows not freedom or how to get there.

That is Because deep inside this person is the desire of Wanting to be approve or else will do anything to get it including personal attack ; just to keep the illusive ego survive and not threaten by its un approval view.


Thus, one can has an experience of have a glimse of the Buddha nature, however, as soon as one still control by the desire such as the desire of need to be approved above. One has never been free . similar to the person within the prison who sees the outside but trap within the walls.

[Scott R. Brown]

until one can get out of the prison and has done it. the rest are just talks.

Then why are you still talking?

It is about capable to get out of the prison and free instead of ALL TALK NO ACTION ZEN.

Then why are you still talking?

Since there is no prison from the start there is nothing to get out of. You are trapped within a prison of your own making. Free yourself first, then worry about others.

Who cares about using other's or using others' story to approve one's view? those got nothing to do with to be free.

Then why are you still talking?

Because anecdotes illustrate a point. How about address the point or follow your own advice by not saying anything from the first?

The above statement is an evidence of attachement to one's view and when it is not approved, attempting to control via any means.

That is the prison, the survival prison wall. and until one could get out of these one knows not freedom or how to get there.

That is Because deep inside this person is the desire of Wanting to be approve or else to do anything including personal attack just to keep the illusive ego survive and not threaten by its un approval view.

Thus, one can has an experience of have a glimse of the Buddha nature, however, as soon as one still control by the desire such as the desire of approval above. One has never been free as the person within the prison who sees the outside but trap within the walls.

When you start from a false premise you end up with a false conclusion! Work on discovering you own false premises rather than imposing them onto others!

or

Why are you projecting your own prison around someone not in your prison? Address your own prison before you concern yourself you trapping others within your own delusion!

[Hendrik]

Speak about you speak about me, what is the different?

As soon as one still wanting that control, approval, and survival to protect one's ego which one recognized and oneself, one is in prison, disregards of if one could see the mountain or rivers through the window of the prison.

Can one do it? to get out of the prison?
that needs lots of Undo dharma and practice or cultivation to undo the desire of control, approval, and survival of the ego.

Until then, it doesnt matter who said what or what Hui Neng said or What Matzu said or logical or reasoning or arguing.....etc.

Those stuffs do nothing to undo the desire or set one free.

PS. dont you notice your post always full of " You You and me me" which is an indication of taking your ego so seriously and keep discriminating and make seperation instead of being in non dual which the enlightenment beings support to dwel in?



What good is a few prison cell mates argue about who is free within a prison cell?

Then why are you still talking?



Then why are you still talking?

Since there is no prison from the start there is nothing to get out of. You are trapped within a prison of your own making. Free yourself first, then worry about others.




Then why are you still talking?

Because anecdotes illustrate a point. How about address the point or follow your own advice by not saying anything from the first?



When you start from a false premise you end up with a false conclusion! Work on discovering you own false premises rather than imposing them onto others!

or

Why are you projecting your own prison around someone not in your prison? Address your own prison before you concern yourself you trapping others within your own delusion!

[Scott R. Brown]

Speak about you speak about me, what is the different?

As soon as one still wanting that control, approval, and survival to protect one's ego which one recognized and oneself, one is in prison, disregards of if one could see the mountain or rivers through the window of the prison.

If you are so concerned about, "Speak about you speak about me, what is the different?", then why do you keep speaking yourself? If what others (myself in particular) say is so meaningless, why is what you say more meaningful? Is this not a projection of your own ego and should you not be more concerned with your own ego projections rather than what you think is an ego projection of others?

Why are you concerned about the prison you project onto others when you have yet to address the prison of your own making?

Can one do it? to get out of the prison?
that needs lots of Undo dharma and practice or cultivation to undo the desire of control, approval, and survival of the ego.

If you are so concerned if others and can do it, why do you not first address your own ability to "do it" instead of projecting your own inability onto others?

Until then, it doesnt matter who said what or what Hui Neng said or What Matzu said or logical or reasoning or arguing.....etc.

If it does not matter to you what Hui-Neng or Ma-tzu said that is fine, but then why should anyone care about anything you say? Are not these two more recognized and influential as teachers than you? When in doubt who should one listen to, you or Hui-Neng and Ma-tzu? Who is promoting their own ego here?

If logic, reasoning, and arguing do not matter to you, then why do you constantly attempt to use logic, reason and argue yourself?

Those stuffs do nothing to undo the desire or set one free.

They have provided a greater benefit to others down through the ages than your own words have, so why should others ignore them, but listen to you?

Everyone is responsible for their own realization, why do you spend so much time criticizing others for not living up to your own arbitrary standards when you don't live up to them yourself?

PS. dont you notice your post always full of " You You and me me" which is an indication of taking your ego so seriously and keep discriminating and make seperation instead of being in non dual which the enlightenment beings support to dwel in?

Don't you notice that YOU always post full of "You You and me me" which is an indication of taking your ego so seriously and keep discriminating and make separation instead of being in non-dual in which enlightened beings are supposed to dwell?

In other words, instead of creating in your own mind flaws and then projecting them onto others, why don't you apply the arbitrary standards you impose onto others to yourself first?

What good is a few prison cell mates argue about who is free within a prison cell?

If you are in prison how can you judge accurately who is in prison and who is not, since the view from your prison is so poor?

Why do you create arbitrary standards out of thin air, project them onto to others, but not apply them to yourself first?

What good is imposing your prison onto others when you cannot even get out of, much less see, the prison of your own making?

When you start from a false premise and cherish that false premise it colors all of your other judgments.

Since you live within a prison of your own making, why do you not perceive and rectify the errors that have trapped your own mind rather than project your errors onto to those whom you do not understand?

Why do you cherish your prison so? Free yourself first, then presume to correct others!

[Hendrik]

If you are in prison how can you judge accurately who is in prison and who is not, since the view from your prison is so poor?

just simply use one's eyes to see who is in front of one within the same prison cell.

Dont waste time on all the theory, instead using the time to UNDO one's trap is a better investment. We all are still stuck in the prison.