Red Dawn

[Jimbo]

I thought they actually made the evil Westerner in Ip Man 2 into a near-invincible machine. They let him make the other kung fu sifus seem a bit helpless, and even Ip Man was barely able to beat him (okay, the Westerners kind of biased the match in their favor near the end, but still).

But yeah, I agree that many Chinese movies make Westerners look bad; not only Westerners but other Asians, too.

Although in a couple of the Thai movies, there's Chinese villains: Tom Yum Goong (a.k.a.,The Protector) and Raging Phoenix (the Chinese drunken kung fu guy).

Sorry, a bit off-topic...

[CLFNole]

I am cool with either being bad guys but you have to have it both ways and not cause the movie maker go back and change the movie.

[SPJ]

it is just a movie.

but PR China did learn from first gulf war in early 1990's.

such as smart bombs, cruise missiles, precision bombing, ---

and then stealth and no man flying crafts from 2nd gulf war 2000's.

--

north korea is so poor, may be invade south korea, or Japan

invade US nah--

[Zenshiite]

Yeah but it is okay for every new kung fu pic to have the evil westerner that is a bad guy and fights and losses to the hero. They always make westerners look stupid and take shots at us but they can't be a bad guy in one of our movies. I mean common on it is a movie have some thicker skin from god sake.

Let's be fair about those films though, they are set in a time period when Westerners were being ****s over there.

A movie depicting the Chinese invading the United States a whole other ball of wax. You're trying to compare a movie with a contemporary setting showing China invading the US, when there's not even a remote likelihood of that happening, to movies set in an era when Western wrestlers and boxers were going to China and saying they were the "sick men of Asia" and beating the tar out of kung fu men with biased fight rules that favored whatever fighting the European/American guys were doing. Certain figures in the kung fu world did step up and put a beat down on such people after their race and fighting styles were humiliated by these guys. Ip Man, and Huo Yuan Jia are just two such historical figures.

It makes one wonder, too, what the difference is between then and now in the martial arts world. We've got MMA commentators saying kung fu specifically and traditional martial arts generally are worthless in fights.

It's a curious little paranoia that Hollywood latches onto with movies like Red Dawn. The US, in this day an age, is the most militarily adventurous nation state on the planet and has been since the USSR fell, and even before then we probably garnered that distinction. The US is terrified of someone else doing to us just exactly what we do best. No matter how unrealistic or sensationalist it is. Juxtapose that with actual historical cases of the US and Europeans going to foreign lands and working tirelessly to humiliate them ethnically and culturally.

White people largely get their panties in a twist because we hate being confronted with our own sins and prefer to view history in a completely ahistorical way. Basing kung fu movies off of things that actually happen bothers me far less than a stupid paranoid sensationalist and outright ridiculous move like the original Red Dawn and this one. A handful of redneck teenagers are going to put a viable resistance to an occupying army my butt.

[Jimbo]

There is quite a bit of fear/anger in the U.S. about China these days. The vast majority of it is due to U.S. manufacturing transferring to China, copyright infringements, etc., etc. In that sense, a movie about an invading Chinese army could be symbolic.

One thing I do see, and I think I mentioned this way earlier in this thread(?), is that American movies of this type can often incite paranoia that may inspire already-stupid people to single out anyone they think is Chinese (i.e., anyone of Asian heritage) for racist rants or even hate crimes. America is multi-cultural, but the heroes in these films are overwhelmingly white, usually with an African-American or two for "racial balance" and maybe a token 'good Asian' (usually a sexy female in love with the white hero).

[CLFNole]

Jimbo: you raise a good point. If a movie raises anger against a race even if it is just an ignorant person that isn't good. I am a gwai lo and my wife is from Hong Kong so I am not necessarily on the side of the US film makers per say. I just don't like to see political pressure of any kind force a change to a movie. That being said movie makers do need to be sensitive to the political climate.

[SPJ]

so I was playing x-box with home front

---

single player mode has to follow the story line

kpa korea people army--

so i bought the game book to follow the story line, hidden history--

--

multi player mode is much better, with actions all the time, not so much story telling

--

it was quite a script about how KPA invaded US

--

[GeneChing]

U.S. business self-censors to keep China satisfied
David Sirota, 2011 Creators.com
March 24, 2011 04:00 AM
03/25/11

"Red Dawn," a '80s movie about Russians invading, is being remade with a few characters stripped out.

The 1984 film "Red Dawn" fantasized about a group of American teenagers called the Wolverines who repelled an invasion of foreign communists. For its mix of dystopia and hope, the movie became such an enduring cultural touchstone that U.S. military leaders honored it by naming their 2003 effort to apprehend Saddam Hussein "Operation Red Dawn." Amid the triumphalism, however, the invaders started winning - a fact that none other than "Red Dawn's" 2011 remake underscores.

That's the subtext of this week's Los Angeles Times report about MGM taking "the extraordinary step" of digitally removing fictional Chinese villains from the $60 million film "lest the leadership in Beijing be offended." Why the fear of upsetting such an odiously anti-democratic government? Because movie executives worry that a film involving a negative message about China "would harm their ability to do business" with a nation that is among the "most lucrative markets for American movies."

The studio suits are right to be concerned. China's government only allows about 20 non-Chinese movies per year into its theaters, and in the 1990s, the regime halted Walt Disney, Sony and MGM business in the country after those companies produced films deemed critical of China. Seeking to avoid a similar fate, the film industry now regularly shapes products to appease the Chinese regime. In that sense, the only thing newsworthy about the "Red Dawn" tiff is the public nature of the content revision.

Whether you are a "Red Dawn" fan or not, the episode shows that for all the theories about American cultural exports aiding democratic ferment and challenging autocracy, the dynamic is working the other way as autocracy gives orders to American culture. Indeed, China is now creating a pervasive ethos of what Times reporter Ben Fritz calls "self-censorship" - the kind in which America's media industries pre-emptively shape content to keep China's dictators happy.

The consequences are more far-reaching than just a change of bad guys in a campy '80s retread. Just ask Rupert Murdoch. In 1993, the media baron removed the BBC from his Star TV channel so as to satisfy Beijing and thus secure the station's access to China's audience. Then came Google's move in 2006 to censor its search engine in exchange for a pass through China's Great Firewall. And though Google recently said it was ending that censorship, Microsoft's Bill Gates - another powerful content gatekeeper with business in China - publicly slammed companies for questioning Beijing's demands.

In an interview this week, Fritz explained the cumulative effect: "If you think the rules and restrictions of the authoritarian government in China are a bad thing and amount to censorship, then in a global economy where products made in America are seen and consumed in China, those rules and that censorship is affecting what we here in America see."

And unfortunately, no band of Wolverines can stop it.

David Sirota is the author of "Back to Our Future: How the 1980s Explain the World We Live In Now."

I'm intrigued by Sirota's book now. Has anyone here read it?

[ngokfei]

this only proves that the USA needs to adopt the same business practices as China.

Start banning their "inferior" products on a larger scale and then we'll see what happens. ex: If china only allows a set number of foreign films into their country then we can do the same. yeah Yeah I know bad for us Kung fuers.

As an American I see how my country is slowly being eroded away by big business. In general terms its amount to Treasonous Practices that is causing us to follow the path of lets say the Roman Empire.

What China needs is a War in their own back yard. okay now I'm a hater

[GeneChing]

ngokfei, you do realize that half of the Chinese films we review on this forum have no U.S release, right? We're watching them on Chinatown discs or downloads. Chinese films have plenty of negative Western images - in fact, I've addressed that in several of my print columns and in this forum. They don't care if it makes it in America. It's us. We care. We want to sell to the Chinese.

'Red Dawn' remake to come out next year from FilmDistrict
September 26, 2011 | 12:28 pm

The new version of the Reagan-era classic will be released in the U.S. by independent studio FilmDistrict, according to people familiar with the matter but not authorized to discuss it publicly. FilmDistrict is finalizing a deal with Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer, the studio that produced the movie in 2009.

In the original "Red Dawn," a group of teenagers in a Washington town battle invading Soviet forces; in the remake, the invaders were changed to Chinese. But that decision turned the film into a hot potato.

After MGM emerged from bankruptcy in late 2009 and decided it wouldn’t release the movie, no other studio wanted to touch “Red Dawn” for fear of offending the government of China, a hugely important market in the increasingly global film business.

As a result, the movie’s producers last winter used digital technology and creative editing to change most of the invaders to North Koreans. (Staunchly communist North Korea is economically isolated and not a market for any American products.) Still, it took most of the year to find a distributor willing to take the movie on.

FilmDistrict Chief Executive Peter Schlessel declined to discuss “Red Dawn.” Given that final details are still being worked out, however, it likely won’t hit theaters until 2012.

The new “Red Dawn” cost about $60 million to produce. It stars Chris Hemsworth, who played the title character in “Thor,” and was directed by Dan Bradley, second unit director on the last two “Bourne” movies and the upcoming “Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol.”

FilmDistrict, which is backed by finance and production company GK Films, launched in April with the horror hit “Insidious." Its most recent release is the Ryan Gosling L.A. noir film, “Drive.”

[ngokfei]

wow took you 6 months to reply gene LOL

yep still can't wait to see it. I've been able to see some early promoclips when it was still us vs china.

all we have to do is get the war started between Taiwan and China to solve our economic problems.

[GeneChing]

I discussed this a little with RZA when I interviewed him a little while ago. It was off the record though. Only a little of it got into the interview.

Movie makers seek to please Chinese
Updated: 2012-08-29 07:28
By Li Xiaokun and Liu Wei in Beijing and Kelly Chung Dawson in New York (China Daily)

Not too long ago, Western movie audiences' idea of a Chinese character was Fu Manchu - an evil mastermind who plotted to take over the world in the 1969 film The Castle of Fu Manchu.

But eight decades later, Hollywood and the silver screens of the West are acknowledging the growing importance of the film market in a country that is also rising in influence on the global stage.

Most recently, the American action film Red Dawn, directed by Dan Bradley and scheduled for a November release, changed its villains in post-production from an invading Chinese army to one from the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.

The Western film industry is now aggressively pushing beyond the negative portrayals of Chinese people - and even the iconic kung fu roles of Bruce Lee, Jackie Chan and Jet Li - to tap what promises to be one of the world's most lucrative movie markets.

"True, Bruce Lee, Jackie Chan and Jet Li have freed the industry from some preconceptions, but they have made a new one - Chinese can (only) fight," said film critic Luo Jin.

But things are changing, given that Hollywood is always interested in expanding its market, said Ken Jurkiewicz, associate professor at the School of Broadcast and Cinematic Arts at Central Michigan University.

"In general, Chinese characters were either inscrutably intelligent, or they were treated like comic relief. Something mysterious and exotic, and that would be true of the female characters too," Jurkiewicz said.

But the Western film industry is now aware that "there's this sort of virgin territory in China, millions of people could be exposed to the Hollywood product. So they can't really denigrate or demean people using those old stereotypes.

"Hollywood is being very careful about how Chinese people are portrayed because they don't want to lose a potential audience", Jurkiewicz said.

Guy Aoki, founding president of Media Action Network for Asian Americans, an organization that monitors how Asian Americans are portrayed in US movies, TV and the media, said movie roles are actually being altered to avoid provoking or angering Chinese audiences.

"The most recent example is Red Dawn, where they changed the villains to be North Korean. I think that's a very big sign of how much they want to make money off of China. They don't want to offend China or Chinese audiences," Aoki said.

In June 2010, release of Red Dawn was delayed because of financial difficulties and amid growing controversy in China after excerpts of the script were leaked onto the Internet. Chinese media sharply criticized the film, with headlines such as "US reshoots Cold War movie to demonize China".

"They had to digitally alter everything after the fact. So many American movies do not make back their budget on domestic box office, and they have to rely on overseas markets. China is becoming bigger and bigger, so they really need China now," Aoki said.

"It's positive in the sense that they're less likely to cast Chinese villains ... The reality is that when they have villains from China and Japan, it still affects Asian Americans. It's positive to have less Chinese villains in Hollywood movies."

A promising market

These are indeed wise moves for an increasingly important Chinese movie-going market.

According to the Motion Picture Association of America, US domestic box office takings in 2011 fell to a 16-year low.

Ticket revenue in the world's largest movie market fell 3.5 percent to $10.2 billion, while the estimated number of tickets sold dropped 4.4 percent to 1.28 billion, the lowest figure since 1995's 1.26 billion.

On the other hand, overseas revenues of US films surged 7 percent to $22.4 billion in 2011.

In 2011, China's box-office revenue was 13.1 billion yuan ($2.06 billion), double what it was in 2009, according to China's State Administration of Radio, Film and Television.

Domestic ticket sales in 2012 reached 10 billion yuan as of Aug 16, raising expectations for the final annual figure to hit 18 billion yuan and surpass Japan to become the world's second-largest movie market.

Japanese media also noted the trend. The Tokyo Shinbun newspaper on Aug 11 quoted a local movie reporter saying that Japanese roles in US movies were prettified after the 1980s as the Japanese market rapidly expanded and became a major destination of American exports.

"Now, the same situation falls on Chinese roles in US movies," he said.

continued next post

[GeneChing]

Cloud Atlas looks cool. Should be great for Zhou Xun as she's just conquered China w/PS2.

Investment on the rise

Hollywood roles are also being taken up by Chinese actresses popular in China to lure this lucrative market.

The trailer of Cloud Atlas, a science-fiction movie directed by Lana Wachowski, was released worldwide on July 28, and Zhou Xun portrayed three roles in it.

In June, Fan Bingbing's name also appeared in the cast of The Moon and the Sun released by Bliss Media, a production company in Hollywood.

Last year, Xu Qing was invited to join Looper, a Hollywood science-fiction movie. She portrayed the wife of the protagonist, played by Bruce Willis.

Later, Yu Nan announced she will join The Expendables 2, while Li Bingbing confirmed in October that she was shooting Resident Evil: Retribution as character Ada Wong and fights zombies alongside Milla Jovovich.

"In the era of globalization, Hollywood cannot ignore Chinese actors just as major US companies cannot ignore small Chinese companies," said Wu Yulan, deputy dean of the School of Journalism and Mass Media under the Zhongnan University of Economics and Law. The school is in Wuhan, capital city of Central China's Hubei province.

US film company DreamWorks Animation SKG Inc on Aug 7 announced plans to build a $3.14 billion theme park in Shanghai and open it in 2016.

The studio's newly formed China joint venture, Oriental DreamWorks, also announced it will make the next Kung Fu Panda movie, the third installment in the series, in China for release in 2016.

One day later, Cameron Pace Group, co-founded by Avatar director James Cameron and long-time business partner Vince Pace, set up a division in the northern Chinese city of Tianjin and launched its first film project, a 3-D documentary on Beijing.

"I am making a big investment and forming partnerships here in China," Cameron told a news conference on Aug 8. "We are very excited to be part of the historic transformation of media and entertainment from 2-D to 3-D. We believe the future of entertainment is in 3-D, and the future of 3-D is in China."

Cameron's Titanic and its 3-D version both swept China's box office. When the original version was screened in 1998, it grossed 360 million yuan and was the highest-grossing film in China for 11 years until Transformers 2 broke the record in 2009. Titanic 3-D raked in an amazing 900 million yuan.

In 2010, 3-D epic Avatar brought in 1.2 billion yuan and was the best-performing film at China's box office so far.

With the box office soaring 30 percent every year since 2003, China has become the new land of temptation for Hollywood studios.

China has been making moves to further open its market. A deal hammered out in February has increased the annual quota for foreign films in theaters to 34 from the original 20, and raised the foreign share of ticket sales from 13 to 25 percent.

A long way to go

But experts say there is still some way to go before Hollywood and Western audiences are able to fully - and accurately - integrate Chinese aspects and depictions of the country and its people into their offerings.

"There is a growing awareness that things might be more complicated. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that Americans are exposed to other cultures more and more," said Jurkiewicz, from Central Michigan University.

"What I'd like to see happen is more Chinese films coming to this country, that portray contemporary Chinese life and culture. Those films are being made and shown in Asia, but very few of those films make it into the American market," he said.

Beijing-based film critic Bi Chenggong noted the golden period for Chinese films and performers in Hollywood was from 2000 to 2007.

"It was definitely related to the performance of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon," Bi said.

An American-Chinese co-production, the film was directed by Ang Lee and featured an international cast of Chinese actors, including Chow Yun-Fat, Michelle Yeoh and Zhang Ziyi.

It grossed $128 million in the US, becoming the highest-grossing foreign-language film in American history. The film won more than 40 major international awards, including the Oscar for best foreign-language film.

"At that time, Chinese culture was popular in Hollywood. China had just become a new economic engine, while the 'China Threat Theory' was not talked about that much. We had just entered the World Trade Organization and were scheduled to host the Beijing Olympics ... All these left an open-minded image of China on the world," Bi said.

But now China is no longer a fresh subject, and Bi said Chinese stars have to realize the fact that movies featuring Asian stars as the core roles usually account for only 3 percent of Hollywood products.

"Besides, the Hollywood only picks up those with excellent performing skills who can speak good English. And many Chinese stars lack the motivation to explore Hollywood, given the prosperous market at home," Bi said.

"I expect to see more Chinese players in Hollywood, the most developed movie-industry system, to show our faces and have our voice heard there."

Contact the writers at lixiaokun@chinadaily.com.cn, liuwei@chinadaily.com.cn and kdawson@chinadailyusa.com

[Jimbo]

It's been my observation that a high percentage of Asians in the U.S.who emigrated here, along with the ones in their home countries, operate under the assumption that (non-Asian) Americans are aware of the differences between the different Asian groups/nationalities. When in fact, most are not, or they couldn't care less. If you "look Chinese" (for example), then to them, you're Chinese, or whatever other group is the current target. Reminds me of when that Cho Seung-Hui shot up VA Tech, on some sites, I read posts written by some Chinese-Americans saying, "Whew! I was soooo glad when I heard he was Korean and not Chinese! I was afraid of possible anti-Chinese backlash". Well, if there had been any, it wouldn't have mattered to a racist.

In the same way, a number of Sikhs have been targeted because many Americans cannot tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. Not that any group should be scapegoated.

Right now, a lot of people politically walk on eggshells when it comes to China. Whether it's due to greater cultural awareness or not wanting to upset the financial apple cart, I don't know, but I suspect the latter.

[GeneChing]

I was tempted to post this on our GIJ2 or WW threads, but this opens tomorrow (besides I couldn't find our WW thread ).

Adrianne Palicki Talks RED DAWN, G.I. JOE 2, the WONDER WOMAN Experience & Possible FRIDAY NIGHT LIGHTS Movie
by Christina Radish Posted: November 19th, 2012 at 4:44 pm

The long-delayed re-imagining of Red Dawn is finally hitting theaters over the Thanksgiving holiday. When the citizens of a city in Washington state find themselves the prisoners under enemy occupation by North Korea, a group of young patriots become determined to fight back, and band together to protect one another and take back their freedom. From director Dan Bradley, the film stars Chris Hemsworth, Josh Peck, Josh Hutcherson, Adrianne Palicki, Isabel Lucas, Connor Cruise and Jeffrey Dean Morgan.

At the film’s press day, actress Adrianne Palicki – who plays the tough, no-nonsense Toni – spoke to Collider for this exclusive interview about how excited she is that audiences will finally have a chance to see the film, going through a similar delay with the G.I. Joe sequel, how her Red Dawn training compared to her G.I. Joe: Retaliation training, how devastating the whole Wonder Woman experience was for her (with the TV show getting ordered to series and then having the plug pulled), working with co-star Chris Hemsworth, how she related to her character, and her thoughts on the possible Friday Night Lights movie. Check out what she had to say after the jump.

Collider: Has it been frustrating for you, to have this film be so delayed, or is it just exciting that people will finally get the chance to see it?


ADRIANNE PALICKI: It’s very exciting that people are finally going to get the chance to see the film. But, as an actor, I realize that it really doesn’t come down to it being bad. It’s comes down to so many different factors that you have no control over. I’ve had a lot of things that have been delayed, in the recent past, so you’ve just gotta give it up and say, “Okay, whatever. I have no control over this. There’s a reason for it.” But, I’m so excited because there was a point in which they were talking about shelving this movie, and I’m so glad that that didn’t happen. I think it’s a really fun, good movie that people are seemingly to really enjoy.

You’re also going through the same thing with the delay for the G.I. Joe sequel. Are you just like, “Enough already!”?

PALICKI: I was like, “Really?! Oh, my god!” I felt like, “Am I a bad luck charm? I don’t understand!” But again, that movie really came down to the fact that they didn’t want to be sandwiched in between two huge blockbuster movies and get trampled. I don’t think it would have, but I understand them being safe. And they also wanted to make it 3D, genuinely. So, I was like, “Okay, I get it.” There’s a reason for everything, I guess.

Did your physical training on Red Dawn help prepare you for G.I. Joe: Retaliation and give you a better sense of what to expect?

PALICKI: For G.I. Joe, I had much more physical action because I’m playing a Navy SEAL. So, it’s not only about holding a gun. I had to do everything 100% correctly. We had Harry Humphries, who’s one of the best of the best. He’s a retired Navy SEAL, who’s one of the original Navy SEALs, and he trained us. I loved him, but that was a lot of work. But, I felt like I was two steps ahead of the game, having done all the work on Red Dawn. And then, I also did Wonder Woman and had hand-to-hand combat training for that. I felt like I was ready.

How difficult was it for you to go through what you did with the Wonder Woman TV show? Did you have one of those self-doubt moments about being in this business?


PALICKI: I have that, every day. I’m not going to lie. I’m serious. And then, I have to remind myself that I love what I do. If I get to do one job a year, or if I get to just do my job, even if people don’t get to see it, I’m doing my job and it’s making me happy. I’ve got to just keep fighting through it and do it, and hope that eventually people see what I’m doing. But, I was devastated. Believe me, I was inconsolable for a good two months. And then, I had to realize that I had a Wonder Woman costume fitted for my body. I got to play that part on film. Not many people get to say that, and that’s cool. Maybe I’ll get to do it again, in a bigger arena. Who knows?

Was part of the appeal of Red Dawn the fact that the girls really have to get in on the action with the boys?

PALICKI: I think that’s a realistic version of it. If that were actually happening, people wouldn’t slow down to be like, “Are you going to be okay handling that gun?” It’s a boy’s club, so you have to be a boy in the club, ultimately. You have to handle yourself. If you don’t, you’re going to die. I like that (director) Dan [Bradley] was totally about not making it about sexes. Everybody was the same.

Going into the training for this, did you think that you’d be able to do it with no problem and it just totally whipped your ass?

PALICKI: Yes, totally! I was like, “I’m athletic. I work out. I can do this. I’ve shot a gun.” No, it didn’t prepare me for what was there. Thankfully, I have a lot of willpower, so I was fine. I just had to keep going. Thankfully, we had a really great group of people training us, but it was hard. There were a lot of sore nights, getting into bathtubs.

Did the whole boot camp experience bond all of you guys together?

PALICKI: Yeah, because a lot of us hadn’t met each other before. We really were like the Wolverines, in real life. We were a bunch of people coming together who didn’t know each other. At that point, Chris [Hemsworth] had been through a month of training, so he was really our leader. They made it such that he had to lead us. By the end, he had to make the calls. So, we had this amazing bond, by the time we got to set, that shows in the movie.

What was it like to work with Chris Hemsworth and have the challenge of establishing a connection without much time to build a relationship?

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