Question about sparring

[Hardwork108]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6OXjtOyYlQ


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkGP0...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmPJF...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTNjxNhuS1k&NR=1


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDlJl...1&feature=fvwp


Dear all,
Some of those people were using the techniques they have learnt in their classes in those (light contact) sparring matches. However, I noticed that some people from those organisations were fighting like amateur kick boxers (on youtube), when they put on gloves and protective clothing in full contact sparring matches. They seem to have forgotten everything they had learnt.
My question is if they could apply their techniques in light contact sparring matches or against their fellow classmates in light contact sparring matches, then how come they abandoned their techniques when fighting in full contact sparring matches?
This does not make any sense.

Thank you very much

Hello Hitman,

If you see people claiming kung fu experience fighting like kickboxers then you are seeing pseudo kung fu-ists who have never really studied TCMAs.

Having said that, one must admit that under ring fighting sports rules a lot of arts will lose their "essence". Of course, that does not excuse the so called "kung fu" fighters who hop around like rabbits inside the ring, without rooting and sometimes throwing wild punches,hoping to connect.

Lastly, you are better off ignoring the trolls such as Dave Ross (Lkfmdc) and David Jamieson, as they are just legends in their own minds, even if they do have a small fan club of mostly misguided and clueless souls here in the forum.

To be honest, you are more likely to get a decent kung fu conversation and info from a mid-level to senior student at an authentic kung fu kwoon, then any of those two glorified kickboxers.

[Hardwork108]

this phrase is typical of the non-sense mindset that has been erroneously propagated in this country vis-a-vis martial arts, which is that for some strange reason, despite the fact that many people on this planet can successfully learn a vast array of disparate skill sets, for some reason when it comes to TMA (specifically Asian TMA), all of a sudden someone's capacity to learn more than one art / skill set is no longer considered possible or desireable;

personally, I see it as a sort of elitist snobbism on the part of TMA practitioners, or is used as a rationalization as to why they are correct to remain "faithful" to one art / skill set;

let's face it folks - a lot of that one-art-forever silliness is grounded in the cultural norms of CHina, Japan, Korea, where loyalty to one's family / sifu were paramount - thus, to (openly) go and study with more than one person was pretty much taboo, so u necesarilly stuck it out with what you had; OTOH, many TCMA-ists did travel extensively and picked up a lot of things from a lot of different peopl...

so here's a question: who's criteria do we apply to decided if a person is a Jack-of-all-trades? and what if he is, but can put all of what he learned into effective usage? this phrase should be eliminated, as it demonstrates an outmoded form of bias that does nothing to further any art; fighting effectively means that one needs must be skilled at kicking, punching, clinching, throwing, grappling, ground fighting and probably weapons as well; in fact, if you look at European HTH combat arts, u would see that they involved all of this - and people seemed well able to engage in disparate skill sets without too much difficulty; so to jump in w/the Jack of all trades "argument", it is a weak argument at this stage in the game;

really, people throw this phrase around with no real basis for substantiating it;

You make some fair points there, yet the concept of Jack of All Trades is real, and does exist, and not just in the world of MAs, because there are people who "bite off more than they can chew" in this life.

I know that because from personal conversations here with people who claim "decades of experience" in MAs, I have seen that in many cases their understanding of authentic kung fu was below that of a basic level, independent of how good these individuals were as fighters or how popular they were in these forums.

So, IMHO, one cannot just disgard the concept of "Jack of All Trades" description, specially in a forum where every other thread contains a "foot in the mouth" moment by one or more cross trainers, with "decades of experience".......

[SoCo KungFu]

You make some fair points there, yet the concept of Jack of All Trades is real, and does exist, and not just in the world of MAs, because there are people who "bite off more than they can chew" in this life.

I know that because from personal conversations here with people who claim "decades of experience" in MAs, I have seen that in many cases their understanding of authentic kung fu was below that of a basic level, independent of how good these individuals were as fighters or how popular they were in these forums.

So, IMHO, one cannot just disgard the concept of "Jack of All Trades" description, specially in a forum where every other thread contains a "foot in the mouth" moment by one or more cross trainers, with "decades of experience".......

You telling people their knowledge is below basic is like Paris Hilton advising people not to make sex tapes. And really, your dumb@$$ery is getting nauseating. Seriously, stfu. You're a poseur, a reject, your sifu disowned you, you been banned here once already and from other sites as well, no one here can stand you, we all think you're a joke and your knowledge of fighting and/or kung fu can't match my friend's 4 year old daughter. You're pathetic. Even more pathetic by the fact that you have no clue just how pathetic you actually are. You are the village clown. Your self proclaimed mission of saving the forum newbies from the glorified kickboxers is ludicrous. Anyone with 2 ounces of commons sense can see just how much of a joke you are. I never thought I'd say this to anybody, but go off yourself. You're one shining example for why pro-abortion is a preferred platform.

[goju]

You telling people their knowledge is below basic is like Paris Hilton advising people not to make sex tapes. And really, your dumb@$$ery is getting nauseating. Seriously, stfu. You're a poseur, a reject, your sifu disowned you, you been banned here once already and from other sites as well, no one here can stand you, we all think you're a joke and your knowledge of fighting and/or kung fu can't match my friend's 4 year old daughter. You're pathetic. Even more pathetic by the fact that you have no clue just how pathetic you actually are. You are the village clown. Your self proclaimed mission of saving the forum newbies from the glorified kickboxers is ludicrous. Anyone with 2 ounces of commons sense can see just how much of a joke you are. I never thought I'd say this to anybody, but go off yourself. You're one shining example for why pro-abortion is a preferred platform.

[Hardwork108]

You telling people their knowledge is below basic is like Paris Hilton advising people not to make sex tapes. And really, your dumb@$$ery is getting nauseating. Seriously, stfu. You're a poseur, a reject, your sifu disowned you, you been banned here once already and from other sites as well, no one here can stand you, we all think you're a joke and your knowledge of fighting and/or kung fu can't match my friend's 4 year old daughter. You're pathetic. Even more pathetic by the fact that you have no clue just how pathetic you actually are. You are the village clown. Your self proclaimed mission of saving the forum newbies from the glorified kickboxers is ludicrous. Anyone with 2 ounces of commons sense can see just how much of a joke you are. I never thought I'd say this to anybody, but go off yourself. You're one shining example for why pro-abortion is a preferred platform.

Spoken like a true kung fu-clueless glorified kickboxer. You are just insecure because you are nothing but a JACK OF ALL TRADES, pseudo kung fu-ist.

Hitman, if you are reading this then you have seen it for yourself. Not only that many of these cross trainers are clueless when it comes to authentic kung fu training, but they are also insecure. Somehow it seems that I was disowned by my sifu, without my knowledge...LOL!

Yes, these people LIE, because there is no substance to them, not as far as kung fu knowledge is concerned!

For proof read "SoCo Kung fu"'s response above,which was to a post of mine that was not even directed at him...LOL.

[Hardwork108]

LOL, if you think that was "shocking" then you should see how "SoCalled Kung fu" discusses world politics. He actually believes that it is OK for the US to mass murder in Iraq and Afghanistan because "that is how it has always been and the powerful always screw the weak"!

Now I know why he is anti-abortion. He wants them born so that him and his US military can shoot them dead!

[TenTigers]

HW108=how do you define rooting, and why is it that hopping around as you say, does ot allow for this?

[Lokhopkuen]

When choosing a martial art I think also you have to consider why you want to study wushu and what you want to get out of it. The vast majority of Martial Artists will never apply their skill to combat, so make sure you get something else out of it.

I love these gross generalizations over "what The vast majority of Martial Artists" may or may not do....

How would you know or why would you even care?

I don't care what style you practice,
If you do not internalize the basic technique of your martial art,
If you overlook the development of mobility and flexibility,
If you do not practice form and application,
If you do not develop the strength to make it all work,
YOUR MARTIAL ART IS USELESS.

Period.

All speculations and assumptions about events outside of your ability to personally observe them amount to little more than fantasy and conjecture.

Practice yourself.

[Lokhopkuen]

LOL, if you think that was "shocking" then you should see how "SoCalled Kung fu" discusses world politics. He actually believes that it is OK for the US to mass murder in Iraq and Afghanistan because "that is how it has always been and the powerful always screw the weak"!

Now I know why he is anti-abortion. He wants them born so that him and his US military can shoot them dead!

I'd like you to slow down a bit here brother;
Although you make a good point every now and again I am beginning to see why people here are so hard on you.

You are at odds with everyone on this forum man.
Don't you see something wrong with that?
As rude and annoying as ICMFC is he is a real person and a respected martial art teacher. Ten Tigers, taai gihk yahn are known and respected real teachers and practitioners.
Jamison, Sanjuro, I know these men.
They are real people with lives and families plus I respect their martial arts.
Who are you exactly bro? Where do you get off talking shi!t about our United States?

I have students, friends and family serving in both Iraq and Afganistan and the last thing we are doing is mass murdering people. No instead we are rearranging the power structure so that we can exploit the hell out of those places FYI
No one who is there wants to be there! Whatever backward as sed policies got us there the majority of the men and women of our armed forces good decent people doing a thankless job. LOL! Perhaps you need to keep your stupid opinions about our country to yourself and just plain STFU or not.
I've been all over the world and despite the many problems we have here there is more opportunity, justice and freedom than anywhere else on earth. (Well except for Canada and only as long as you are not a baby seal pup...) You are where? Columbia? <SNIF> <SNIF?>
Yea we know what contributions you guys are making to the global community speaking of mass murder...


If you have problem with EVERYBODY HERE then the problem is YOU HW108.

[Dragonzbane76]

Ban him...someone get the ban hammer.... he's an annoying pathetic human being. And that's being nice.

[Hardwork108]

I'd like you to slow down a bit here brother;
Although you make a good point every now and again I am beginning to see why people here are so hard on you.

People are "hard" on me because the truth hurts.

You are at odds with everyone on this forum man.

Not everyone, however there are many who do not get along with me, but then considering the fact that the majority who give opinions on kung fu are Jack of All Trades, cross trainers, then perhaps that is understandable.
[

Don't you see something wrong with that?

What is wrong is the same thing that is wrong with the kung fu scene in general. The majority of posters here are Mcdojo fodder and or Jack of All Trades cross trainers. This more or less reflects the kung fu scene out there in the real world. Yet, somehow they take exception to being told that you can gain valid fighting skills from solely studying TCMAs, without cross training in BJJ or Boxing, etc.

As rude and annoying as ICMFC is he is a real person

That does not say much. Everyone posting here is a real person. What is relevant in a kung fu forum is who practices genuine kung fu as opposed to who is here to sell some pseudo kung fu training/agenda!!!!!!

and a respected martial art teacher.

LOL!

Respected by whom? Glorified Kickboxers, who are not partial to rudeness, insecurity and dishonesty?

Ten Tigers, taai gihk yahn are known and respected real teachers and practitioners.

I have no problems with them!

Jamison, Sanjuro, I know these men.

I guess you like them too? That may be because they have not invented lies about you and your sifu, or referred to you as a Nazi, pediophile, or attacked you in an unprovoked manner to score with some perceived audience that they imagine they have!

They are real people with lives and families

They will have families for sure, but "lives", I would not be too sure about in regards with a couple of them.......

plus I respect their martial arts.

For the most part I respect their martial arts, it is the kung fu knowledge of a couple of them that I am not too sure about......

Who are you exactly bro? Where do you get off talking shi!t about our United States?

I believe that you misunderstood my post. My post referred to a past interaction with "SoCalled Kung fu" where he more or less stated that it was OK for more powerful countries to invade, kill and steal the natural resources of sovereign nations, because "that is how it has always been, the strong screw the weak"....Or words to that effect. I hope that you don't agree with that position!

I have students, friends and family serving in both Iraq and Afganistan and the last thing we are doing is mass murdering people.

I believe that up to (by some estimates) 1 million dead Iraqi people may disagree with you on that.

No instead we are rearranging the power structure so that we can exploit the hell out of those places FYI

The truth comes out at last!

No one who is there wants to be there! Whatever backward as sed policies got us there the majority of the men and women of our armed forces good decent people doing a thankless job. LOL!

I agree with you. I have no beef with the soldiers, only with those who are enjoying the killing spree. IMHO, soldiers are just cannon fodder that are used by a given country's elite to go and kill and die for their interests. That means, I also take issue with the innocent soldiers losing their lives for the benefit of those establishment powers who do not care how many Americans die or are maimed, as long as their political and economic agendas are fulfilled.

Perhaps you need to keep your stupid opinions about our country to yourself and just plain STFU or not.

Again, you have misuderstood my "opinions". I am not anti-American, just because criticized the people who run America and are running it into ruin as we speak.

I've been all over the world

Me too.

and despite the many problems we have here there is more opportunity, justice and freedom than anywhere else on earth.

l
That would depend on your definition of those words. Also, the very freedoms you speak of are being eroded as we speak, because of "the War on Terrorism", "The Global Warming"(a con job, if there ever was one);"War on Drugs", "Pandemic Threats" and other fantasy boggy men, that are created by the Intelligence agencies to sucker the masses out of their freedoms!!!

I just thought I would mention that.

(Well except for Canada and only as long as you are not a baby seal pup..

Don't get me started on those Canadians......Did you know that Sanjuro and David Jamieson are actually Canadians...

You are where? Columbia?

Well, actually it is COLOMBIA!

<SNIF> <SNIF?>

Hey, no need to get emotional about it. Colombia is not too far from you, so you can always come for a visit.

Yea we know what contributions you guys are making to the global community

Colombia could not make those "contributions" without the help of your CIA who are actively importing coke into the US (and Heroin from Afghanistan)!

speaking of mass murder...

Again, we could not commit mass murder without the US (presumably through the CIA) arming all sides of the conflict with US made weapons (for the most part).

If you have problem with EVERYBODY HERE then the problem is YOU HW108.

Again, I don't have a problem with everybody! I don't even think that I had problem with you.

[Hardwork108]

Ban him...someone get the ban hammer.... he's an annoying pathetic human being. And that's being nice.

[SoCo KungFu]

Spoken like a true kung fu-clueless glorified kickboxer. You are just insecure because you are nothing but a JACK OF ALL TRADES, pseudo kung fu-ist.

And I'd kick the living sh!t out of you too. So what's that say about you b!tch?

[Hardwork108]

HW108=how do you define rooting, and why is it that hopping around as you say, does ot allow for this?

Going back to kung fu....

My definition of rooting comes from my kung fu studies. The butt is tucked in; the back is kept straight; knees are lightly bent; toes are "gripping" the ground; breathing is in the dandien, and there is no hopping around. The stepping is "solid" yet smooth, hence the body is connected to the "earth" energy.

I have seen this approach in my Wing Chun and Chow Gar training, as well as having seen it in another authentic school of kung fu that practiced another style.

Of course, I am not saying that other MAs that do not use this approach are not rooted, as I am sure that most, if not all, MAs will claim some degree of rooting. My point is concerned with wether hopping around like a boxer or a TKD-ist can be considered genuine kung fu practice.

[Hardwork108]

And I'd kick the living sh!t out of you too.

They don't make Medical Practitioners like they used to......LOL!

[You are supposed to be a medical practitioner (if memory serves me correctly), aren't you?]

So what's that say about you b!tch?

It says that i am a selfless and an extremely generous person.