Monica Duran - Wing Chun and Qi Gong Helped her

[shawchemical]

the world is a causal system , Qi is as real as Gold.

When one can quiet the mind, let the body relax, and breathing naturally deep and fine. It got to surface.


The problem is most never know it, never cultivate in it, never get that far.
So, they end up with nothing and using that nothing to make all kind of absurd claim. Similar to those who boil water upto 40C and making claim water cant boil and there is no such thing as water vapor.

DOn't try ot use scientific evidence to back your fanciful points up hendrik, you only make yourself appear dumber. There is no Qi, unless you can document it, and prove its existence which would probably earn a nobel prize, you have to accept that just like the concept of god, the concept of qi is entertaining, but entirely separate to reality.

[Hendrik]

100% utter bull****. There are no scientific studies which support trivial nonsense like faith healing, because if there were, it would not be called faith healing but called medicine.

Only morons believe in faith healing, because they're the only ones dumb enough.

If you want to refute it, you need to produce the citations for the papers and studies which support faith healing actually working in peer reviewed studies. Without that, you have anecdotal bull**** like that hendrik always vomits forth.

Perhaps you are right
Only morons believe in faith healing, because they're the only ones dumb enough.

Or

Perhaps you are wrong
because only morons object to something they are clueless.

[Hendrik]

DOn't try ot use scientific evidence to back your fanciful points up hendrik, you only make yourself appear dumber.

There is no Qi, unless you can document it, and prove its existence which would probably earn a nobel prize, you have to accept that just like the concept of god, the concept of qi is entertaining, but entirely separate to reality.

Your 2cents are no different then others 2 cents right?

[shawchemical]

Your 2cents are no different then others 2 cents right?

Wrong. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary levels of proof. I'm not the one claiming that nonsensical ideas like Qi exist, while you are. YOU are required to justify the assertion, I need not disprove it.

There is no evidence to justify a conclusion that Qi exists.

[shawchemical]

Perhaps you are right
Only morons believe in faith healing, because they're the only ones dumb enough.

Or

Perhaps you are wrong
because only morons object to something they are clueless.

Non-sequitur.

[LSWCTN1]

100% utter bull****. There are no scientific studies which support trivial nonsense like faith healing, because if there were, it would not be called faith healing but called medicine.
Only morons believe in faith healing, because they're the only ones dumb enough. If you want to refute it, you need to produce the citations for the papers and studies which support faith healing actually working in peer reviewed studies. Without that, you have anecdotal bull**** like that hendrik always vomits forth.

well, seeing as you asked for it...

http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=...1999-11094-001

http://www.chelationtherapyonline.com/technical/p58.htm

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...91b8214ee7d82c

http://rheumatology.oxfordjournals.o...g&pmid=2417648

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa013259

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...9d887f953bb6ee



Plus, homeopathy is licensed treatment that the NHS in the UK still (I believe?) pay for.

Plus, TCM has rarely been cited in medical studies but millions of people who choose to use it cant be wrong.

The truth is, if something works then it works. Faith healing wont work for you by its pure nature. You have no faith in it.

Just sayin', it has worked for me to help relax me and make ME feel better

[Hendrik]

Wrong. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary levels of proof. I'm not the one claiming that nonsensical ideas like Qi exist, while you are. YOU are required to justify the assertion, I need not disprove it.

There is no evidence to justify a conclusion that Qi exists.

Dont forget
you can have your opinions but no one needs your approval.

[Jim Roselando]

For those who are interested:

www.qigonginstitute.org/html/papers.php


Also see The Scientific Basis of Qigong and Energy Medicine page on the Qigong Institute website:

http://www.qigonginstitute.org/html/...GeneExpression


Scientific Papers:


A Comprehensive Review of Health Benefits of Qigong and Tai Chi Jahnke R, Larkey L, Rogers C and Etnier J

Table of Qigong and Tai Chi Literature Reviews Roger Jahnke OMD, Institute of Integral Qigong and Tai Chi & Linda Larkey PhD, Arizona State University

Qigong and Tai Chi: Traditional Chinese Health Promotion Practices – the Prevention and Treatment of Chronic Disease Roger Jahnke, OMD. The Institute of Integral Qigong and Tai Chi.

Researching the Benefits of Mind-Body Practice by Investigating Genetic Expression Roger Jahnke, OMD. The Institute of Integral Qigong and Tai Chi.

A Pilot Study of External Qigong Therapy for Patients with Fibromyalgia(PDF 181KB) Kevin Chen, et. al. Originally published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2006) Vol 12, No. 9

Qigong - Energy Medicine for the New Millennium(PDF 72KB) Tom Rogers, President of the Qigong Institute. Originally published in Qi Magazine.

Multifaceted Health Benefits of Medical Qigong (PDF 69KB) - Kenneth M. Sancier PhD and Devatara Holman MS. MA. LAc Originally Published in: Journal of
Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2004) Vol 10, No. 1

Electrodermal Measurements for Monitoring the Effects of a Qigong Workshop (PDF 574KB)- by Kenneth M. Sancier PhD. Originally Published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2003) Vol 9, No. 2

Anti-Aging Benefits of Qigong - by Kenneth M. Sancier PhD. Originally Published in: Journal of the International Society of Life Information Science,14 (1) 12-21 (1996). Integrative Tumor Board: Advanced Breast Cancer (PDF 124KB) Kevin papers Ph.D. and Binhui He

Review of Qigong Therapy for Cancer Treatment (PDF 531KB) Kevin Chen Ph.D. and Raphael Yeung Originally Published in: Journal of the International Society of Life Information Science,20 (2) 2002.

A Preliminary Study of the Effect of External Qigong on Lymphoma Growth in Mice (PDF 1,381KB) by Kevin Chen Ph.D., Samuel C. Shiflett, Nicholas M. Ponzio, Binhui He, Deborah K. Elliott and Steven E. Keller. Originally Published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2002) Vol 8, No. 5, pp. 615-621.

The Wonders and Mysteries of Qi (PDF 138KB) A book Review by Kevin Chen Ph.D. Originally Published in: Journal of Scientific Exploration. 2002;16(3)

External Qigong Therapy for Chronic Orofacial Pain (PDF 134KB) Kevin Chen Ph.D., Joseph J. Marbach D.D.S., Robert Wood Johnson Medical School. Originally Published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2002) Vol 8, No. 5, pp. 532-534.

Use of Qigong Therapy in the Detoxification of Heroin Addicts (PDF 153KB) Kevin Chen Ph.D., Ming Li, Zhixian Mo M.D. Originally Published in: Alternative Therapies, Jan/Feb 2002, Vol. 8, No. 1.

Exploratory Studies of External Qi in China (PDF 227KB) by Kevin Chen Ph.D. and Zhongpeng Lin Originally Published in: Journal of the International Society of Life Information Science,20 (2) 2002.

THE EFFECT OF QIGONG ON THERAPEUTIC BALANCING MEASURED BY ELECTROACUPUNCTURE ACCORDING TO VOLL (EAV): A PRELIMINARY STUDY (PDF 595KB) Kenneth M. Sancier PhD. Originally Published in: Acupuncture & Electro-Therapeutics Research, International Journal. 1994; vol.19

Medical Applications of Qigong and Emitted Qi on Humans, Animals, Cell Cultures and Plants: Review of Selected Scientific Research (PDF 905KB) Kenneth M. Sancier PhD. and Bingkun Hu PhD.; Published in The American Journal of Acupuncture Vol. 19, No. 4, 1991

Qigong and Neurological Illness (PDF 150KB) Kenneth M. Sancier; Published in Alternative and Complementary Treatments in Neurologic Illness. By Michael I. Weintraub,, Chapter 15, pp 197-220 (2001), and reprinted with the permission from Elsevier.

Search for Medical Applications of Qigong With the Computerized Qigong Database? (PDF 84KB) by Kenneth M. Sancier PhD.; Published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2001) vol. 7, No. 1, pp. 93-95.

Therapeutic Benefits of Qigong Exercises in Combination with Drugs (PDF 149KB) Kenneth M. Sancier PhD. Originally Published in: Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (1999) Vol 5, No. 4, pp. 383-389.

How to Select Qigong Healers in Scientific Research of Qigong Kenneth M. Sancier PhD.

Medical Applications of Qigong (PDF 661KB) Kenneth M. Sancier PhD.; published in "Alternative Therapies January, 1996, Vol 2. No.1.

A Criticism of Qigong with Pseudoscience Method PDF Version (PDF 124KB) Book Review of "Qigong: Chinese Medicine or Pseudoscience?" Kevin Chen, Ph.D. MPH

An Analytic Review of Studies on Measuring Effects of External Qi in China (PDF 169KB) Kevin Chen, Ph.D. MPH; Originally Published in Alternative Therapies. July/Aug 2004, VOL. 10. No.4.

A Case Study of Simultaneous Recovery From Multiple Physical Symptoms with Medical Qigong Therapy Kevin Chen, Ph.D. MPH; Originally Published in Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine (2004) Vol 10, No. 1.

[t_niehoff]

Scientific papers?

Hardly.

I don't think we get genuinely scientific papers (papers that are peer-reviewed by recognized and distinguished scientists, for example) from such "interesting" journals as the Institute of Integral Qigong and Tai Chi, the Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine, Qi Magazine, the Journal of the International Society of Life Information Science, and Alternative Therapies.

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/

http://scienceblogs.com/channel/medi...tm_medium=link

[shawchemical]

well, seeing as you asked for it...

http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=...1999-11094-001

http://www.chelationtherapyonline.com/technical/p58.htm

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...91b8214ee7d82c

http://rheumatology.oxfordjournals.o...g&pmid=2417648

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa013259

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...9d887f953bb6ee



Plus, homeopathy is licensed treatment that the NHS in the UK still (I believe?) pay for.

Plus, TCM has rarely been cited in medical studies but millions of people who choose to use it cant be wrong.

The truth is, if something works then it works. Faith healing wont work for you by its pure nature. You have no faith in it.

Just sayin', it has worked for me to help relax me and make ME feel better

Homeopathy is bull****. ,Faith healing doesn't work for anyone. The fact that homeopathy is licensed in the UK says something about how ridiculous that country has become in recent years. Yes, millions of people CAN be wrong, just look at the amounto f people who believe in a god. They are all wrong, despite how vehemently and vociferously they claim that it exists.

Noone claims that the placebo effect doesn't exist, it's proven to. But that does not mean that it is a valid therapy. Alternative medicine is bull****. If it were real, it would just be called medicine.

[shawchemical]

Scientific papers?

Hardly.

I don't think we get genuinely scientific papers (papers that are peer-reviewed by recognized and distinguished scientists, for example) from such "interesting" journals as the Institute of Integral Qigong and Tai Chi, the Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine, Qi Magazine, the Journal of the International Society of Life Information Science, and Alternative Therapies.

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/

http://scienceblogs.com/channel/medi...tm_medium=link

We agree on some things. None of these journals are of good repute in scientific circles.

[Hendrik]

Yes, millions of people CAN be wrong, just look at the amounto f people who believe in a god. They are all wrong, despite how vehemently and vociferously they claim that it exists.


you could be right
or
you could be blind by your own mind.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=499Ed...eature=related

the vampire think he is all mighty but look for God in a wrong place.
end up it got kill by another vampire. That is Karma. hahaha movie. hope that human is smarter then that.

[shawchemical]

Yes, millions of people CAN be wrong, just look at the amounto f people who believe in a god. They are all wrong, despite how vehemently and vociferously they claim that it exists.


you could be right
or
you could be blind by your own mind.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=499Ed...eature=related

the vampire think he is all mighty but look for God in a wrong place.
end up it got kill by another vampire. That is Karma. hahaha movie. hope that human is smarter then that.

Unfortunately, most humans are dumb enough to believe in imaginary friends into adulthood.

You can't make bull**** claims without offering evidence of their voracity.

Qi doesn't exist.

[LSWCTN1]

Homeopathy is bull****. ,Faith healing doesn't work for anyone. The fact that homeopathy is licensed in the UK says something about how ridiculous that country has become in recent years. Yes, millions of people CAN be wrong, just look at the amounto f people who believe in a god. They are all wrong, despite how vehemently and vociferously they claim that it exists.

Homeopathy may well be, i never claimed anything different. Im not necessarily disagreeing with you. My point was solely about this mention of Qi and how it related to another, similar, practice i had encountered that seemed to help ME.

Noone claims that the placebo effect doesn't exist, it's proven to. But that does not mean that it is a valid therapy. Alternative medicine is bull****. If it were real, it would just be called medicine.

if something exists and it works, then its valid. what would your definition of valid be, if not that?

dont forget that western medicine often gets things wrong too, and changes up and switches around to change what it was doing. a major one that springs to mind is Thalidomide (sp?)... they didnt half f-up on that one...

not trying to get into a mad one with you here. in a situation like this neither of us is going to change our standpoint.

[bennyvt]

saying qi gong and tai chi are good for you is obvious. Any exercise is good for you and will give the all the same benfits without resorting to chi. I like the studies they do and say "wow when he does this exercise or form you can see his chi in the thermal imaging." like any movement of the body won't produce heat. I remember doing my SLT (I was doing hour forms at the time. five min out five min in) in the morning in the mountains and it was so freezing that I had steam coming off me. my friend took a photo it looked cool.