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Thread: Wrestling

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    well no kidding, theyd have to train wrestling if theyre good at it...
    ..............................


    Exactly.

  2. #17
    hate to break it to you guys but shuai jiao doesnt have ground work, if anyone read my article in last months issue they would know modern fighters with shuai jiao background are crosstraining in bjj, any shuai jiao style that has some ground work come from some other source and was added in recently.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiz cool c View Post
    shuai jiao doesnt have ground work,
    Very true. The momenent that "ground game" is integrated into SC, the moment that we won't be able to see throw like this any more.

    http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/7...leglifting.jpg

    It's not easy to contine this throw with ground work. On the other hand, if you always consider the ground work, you will lost your mobility. It's a trade off.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 08-30-2010 at 12:14 PM.

  4. #19
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    judo, freestyle and greco-roman wrestling all allow ground work and yet still some how manage to pull off high level throws

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    chinese kung fu doesnt have ground fighting because its boring to watch.
    SC became sport in the past several hundreds years. Chinese sport audience liked to watch "clean throw - remain standing after throw".

    I'm sure if Chinese sport audience loved to watch "ground game", The "ground game" would be invented sometime in the Chinese history. I have to say it's just the culture thing.

    I think American also has this kind of culture. When your opponent is down, you wait for him to get back up. If he gets back up, the fight continue. If he stays on the ground, the fight is over, and you walk away.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 08-30-2010 at 12:21 PM.

  6. #21
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    Main goal in KF when on the ground is to get off the ground...Outside of the sport environment ground fighting is to be avoided...unless your on a soft surface, with no rocks, broken glass, dog sh*t, etc., fighting only one guy, who definitely has no knife, no friends coming to help, no steel-toe boots, who's not going to attack your groin or bite you or...

    I'll probably get a lot of flak for saying that but...

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShaolinDan View Post
    Main goal in KF when on the ground is to get off the ground...Outside of the sport environment ground fighting is to be avoided...unless your on a soft surface, with no rocks, broken glass, dog sh*t, etc., fighting only one guy, who definitely has no knife, no friends coming to help, no steel-toe boots, who's not going to attack your groin or bite you or...

    I'll probably get a lot of flak for saying that but...
    to be fair you will only get flak because its a half as$ed stupidly thought out point that has been discredited over and over........

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    judo, freestyle and greco-roman wrestling all allow ground work and yet still some how manage to pull off high level throws
    Judo has "ippon" and also rules against just "dragging a person to the mat", this encourages the throw. The more current rules also discourage the mat work

    Sambo has similar format, including "total victory" throw

    Greco's above the waist format encourages a certain style, so does free style's format

    The reality is, just do BJJ and you will not be a good thrower. The good throwers in BJJ cross train in Judo and wrestling.

    THe Judoka with good mat work, will cross train BJJ.

    This is the "problem" with doing only one type of competition

    The average MMA fighter has weak standing striking. The average Muay Thai guy has no wrestling base.

    If you want to "win your sport" you stick to your sport and it's format. If you want to be "well rounded FIGHTER" you cross train and do many formats
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

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    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
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    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
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    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  9. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Very true. The momenent that "ground game" is integrated into SC, the moment that we won't be able to see throw like this any more.

    http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/7...leglifting.jpg

    It's not easy to contine this throw with ground work with leg lifting throw. On the other hand, if you always consider the ground work connection, you will lost your mobility. It's a trade off.
    thats such a jump in logic man... im starting to think your just letting your bias speak for you... to practice ground means you wont throw anymore??? if i study math will my science suffer??? will i all the sudden not want to know about physics???

    being well rounded means you can either choose where the fight takes place or atleast be able to handle yourself wherever it happens to go...

    look, just because you know ground doesnt mean you have to take it there... its about giving yourself more options, not taking them away...




    Quote Originally Posted by SanHeChuan View Post
    The only reason to learn ground fighting is to fight ground fighters, China didn't have those so,...
    yeah and you see this regional style problem all over... you train against boxing styles for generations all it takes is some highschool wrestler with a brick for a head to put you down and manhandle the hell outta ya... and in order to counter a bit of wrestling experience with boxing you need ALOT of boxing experience... assuming your previous boxing experience didnt cover all ways of getting a guy down... and i havent seen that in CMA... im open to somebody showing me tho... by all means, bring it on, show me the money...

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    look, just because you know ground doesnt mean you have to take it there... its about giving yourself more options, not taking them away...
    Agree! That's why I train ground game too.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 08-30-2010 at 12:30 PM.

  11. #26
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    In my school we learn strike and stand-up combos from the ground and we learn techniques to control someone on the ground from our feet, but we don't really learn much else ground-wise. (Except when one of my teachers who also studies BJJ runs a seminar with us.--Even then, ground-fighting for sport and for street are distinctly different[of course there's much overlap]).

    Sport fighting is critical to becoming a competenet fighter!!!!

    That said...sport fighting IS NOT fighting and the techniques are not necessarily the same.

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    SC became sport in the past several hundreds years. Chinese sport audience liked to watch "clean throw - remain standing after throw".

    I'm sure if Chinese sport audience loved to watch "ground game", The "ground game" would be invented sometime in the Chinese history. I have to say it's just the culture thing.

    I think American also has this kind of culture. When your opponent is down, you wait for him to get back up. If he gets back up, the fight continue. If he stays on the ground, the fight is over, and you walk away.
    ok so how does doing a spectator sport make you a great FIGHTER that can handle any situation??? its the boxing trap... i'd say the same thing to anyone who said all they needed to learn to fight was judo, or wrestling, or bjj, or.....

  13. #28
    wait wait wait... we are talking about FIGHTING here right??? not sports and not pleasing other eyes...


    how can cma help you against a beast of a wrestler in a backalley just you two are alone... if youve never even seen a low double, you are F U C K E D !!!

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Very true. The momenent that "ground game" is integrated into SC, the moment that we won't be able to see throw like this any more.

    http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/7...leglifting.jpg

    It's not easy to contine this throw with ground work. On the other hand, if you always consider the ground work, you will lost your mobility. It's a trade off.
    No one's saying that ground work must originate from a sacrifice throw and if they are, I disagree. A standing throw followed by a rush/shoot onto the downed opponent is feasible and not infrequent.
    "It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own." -Cicero

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    ok so how does doing a spectator sport make you a great FIGHTER that can handle any situation???
    MMA, BJJ, Judo, Sanshou/Sanda. boxing, kickboxing, ... are all sport with different rules. Sport is a tool for training. Combat training is beyond sport.

    BJJ guys will learn their ground skill first and then add their boxing skill later. The rule of BJJ will not stop them from adding boxing. That's what cross training is for.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 08-30-2010 at 12:39 PM.

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