what would you do

[CFT]

Ok knifefighter ill bite. So are you saying that its OK to train for a little bit of time then claim to know the whole system. Oh wait up. Isn't that what happen to the people that invented the brazilian judo stuff you have a black belt in. They learnt off meada (sp?) for less then a year before he left brazil and complete made up the style latter calling it jujitsu even though the were doing judo. So I guess I should ask you. How does it feel to have someone that didnt learn the whole judo system then create a style and make you pay to learn it.

That is a whole different kettle of fish.

1) BJJ/GJJ is not technically lacking, unlike this former student if your assertions are correct.
2) BJJ/GJJ is using a different name, not calling itself Maeda Judo. They're not using someone else's reputation.

If anyone should have a beef about it, it should be Barry Lee. If he wants to do anything about it there are legal means.

[YungChun]

My problem is not that he is teaching. Its that he is using our name. Especially to call himnself a barry lee school. Only 5-6 people are allowed to have Barry schools. We have other guys that are teaching but they dont lie about how long they were with us, that is the problem.

IMO this has nothing to do with you and everything to do with your teacher.. If this guy is using your teacher's name then it would appear to be a legal issue..

You might consider asking T about it..

[t_niehoff]

Lets face it Dale, you're fu/cking clueless, so how on earth would you be able to discriminate between crap and useful methods of teaching?

Your case of verbal diarrhoea is getting worse by the week.

There is a very easy way to discriminate between crap and useful method of teaching/training -- it is called fighting. Can the teacher and/or his students successfully do in fighting what they train to do (and talk about doing) as they train to do it? Simple. Look to results.

The mechanism and process for developing higher levels of athletic skill is well-understood in both sport and scientific circles. You can see the results of that understanding in the number of world-class athletes developed and how well that training works for the average bear too. The sport-model of training uses that mechanism and process, and continually tweaks itself based on the results achieved. By understanding this mechanism and process, we can evaluate any training method.

[t_niehoff]

Per Jack White:

And the message coming from my eyes
Says leave it alone

You can't do anything about this that will have a good outcome. This has happened several times with both my WC and BJJ instructors.

Living and training well is the best revenge.



Personally I think the is TMA propaganda used to stop students training with other instructors and perhaps a better teacher, or at least learning to think for themselves. Not saying that the situation doesn't suck.

Sound advice on every level.

[Knifefighter]

Hey glen. Both bill and anthony are good. Bill still in china but comes over every year atleast once for some months.
My problem is not that he is teaching. Its that he is using our name. Especially to call himnself a barry lee school. Only 5-6 people are allowed to have Barry schools. We have other guys that are teaching but they dont lie about how long they were with us, that is the problem.
Ok knifefighter ill bite. So are you saying that its OK to train for a little bit of time then claim to know the whole system. Oh wait up. Isn't that what happen to the people that invented the brazilian judo stuff you have a black belt in. They learnt off meada (sp?) for less then a year before he left brazil and complete made up the style latter calling it jujitsu even though the were doing judo. So I guess I should ask you. How does it feel to have someone that didnt learn the whole judo system then create a style and make you pay to learn it.

Feels great. You know why? Because my "unfinished system" continually proves its worth by testing itself in open competitions... everything from BJJ tourneys, to wrestling competitions, to MMA.That's what has made it as least as good as, and probably better, than most of the judo out there... unlike your rip-off system in which 99% of the practitioners DON'T test themselves.

BTW, if you think the guy is ripping off your system and you want to do something about it, simply show up to his school with a video recorder, take him on in a challenge match, and post the results on the net. That will let everyone know what's what in terms of his skill level.

It really not a big deal. Just a simple little match should put things to rest. If you guys actually did an fighting, this would have been a no-brainer to start with.

[Lindley]

Hello,

Please ignore any advice about challenging this person or sending any kind of threatening message to him. Instead, if you are adament about visiting him, go and bring him a gift. Depending on your relationship, sit down and discuss this lke two adults. You can express your opinion to him, with sincerity and calmness. Then, at least, he has heard you. This is only if you truly wish to help him. Otherwise, if any of his students are good and become serious it will get to a point he can take them no further.

If he does not acknowledge you or his relationship with the Sifu, then he will just be "a legend in his own mind". Don't be surprised if he turns around and returns to the Sifu for forgivenss.

Good luck with your Kung Fu !

[RedJunkRebel]

BTW, if you think the guy is ripping off your system and you want to do something about it, simply show up to his school with a video recorder, take him on in a challenge match, and post the results on the net. That will let everyone know what's what in terms of his skill level.

It really not a big deal. Just a simple little match should put things to rest. If you guys actually did an fighting, this would have been a no-brainer to start with.

Horrible advice. This would only show your lack of character. Be content in yourself and your own worth. You have nothing to prove to anyone.

[RedJunkRebel]

If my CMA brother is teaching, I'll try to help him as much as I can. I will never think about pulling his leg and make him look bad in front of his students.

pop along to his class and explain that your sifu would like to invite him back to the fold of the family, to complete his training...

Both of these sound like great advice.

Building bridges and helping is the only way to show true respect to our art, our individual lineages and ourselves.

[Wu Wei Wu]

"building bridges and helping..." The cornerstone to great archaic, dogma filled quasi-religious traditional martial arts everywhere.

[shawchemical]

There is a very easy way to discriminate between crap and useful method of teaching/training -- it is called fighting. Can the teacher and/or his students successfully do in fighting what they train to do (and talk about doing) as they train to do it? Simple. Look to results.

The mechanism and process for developing higher levels of athletic skill is well-understood in both sport and scientific circles. You can see the results of that understanding in the number of world-class athletes developed and how well that training works for the average bear too. The sport-model of training uses that mechanism and process, and continually tweaks itself based on the results achieved. By understanding this mechanism and process, we can evaluate any training method.

Actually, it's not. The quality of the teaching has little to do with how an individual student performs. That much is down to the individual, not the teacher.

You're as bad as dale, T. Except for the fact that you clearly have some semblance of intellectual ability, this makes your affliction worse.

[Knifefighter]

Actually, it's not. The quality of the teaching has little to do with how an individual student performs. That much is down to the individual, not the teacher.

You're as bad as dale, T. Except for the fact that you clearly have some semblance of intellectual ability, this makes your affliction worse.

Oh, speaking of completely clueless, theoretical, fantasy, non-fighters... look who's making his nightly appearance.

[YungChun]

Actually, it's not. The quality of the teaching has little to do with how an individual student performs. That much is down to the individual, not the teacher.

Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever..

So coach Joe the mechanic who has watched a tape on Olympic Boxing Vs an actual qualified Olympic Boxing coach won't impact the results a boxing trainee gets?

Obviously it's a combination of the teacher and the student.. Plus the training environment.. It's all about the synergy of the overall training package including the trainee.

[t_niehoff]

Actually, it's not. The quality of the teaching has little to do with how an individual student performs. That much is down to the individual, not the teacher.

THINK about that for a minute. If what you said was true, then anyone could open a BJJ school, anyone could coach Olympic athletes, anyone could teach wrestling or anything for that matter -- after all, their quality really doesn't matter.

What a good coach/teacher does is greatly reduce the time it takes an athlete to develop. Why? Because if you want to learn some skill, certainly you can work it out yourself through lots of practice (that's how many of these skills were developed in the first place) or have someone who already has that skill teach it to you. The former takes lots of time, effort, and hard work with much of that being wasted; the latter is a much more efficient, quicker, and reliable way of learning. And a good coach/teacher can share his/her experience (don't do this, try to do that, etc.), again greatly reducing the time it takes for an athlete to develop.

If you wanted to develop a good ground game, you could just start rolling around on the ground and trying to work things out for yourself. Or, you could go to a school with a proven, skilled groundfighter and have them teach you. IOWs, you could spend your time trying to reinvent the wheel or have someone who knows how to make wheels, show you.

[bennyvt]

not all olympic coaches ever made it to the olympics let alone won gold.

[anerlich]

Benny,

while your thread descended into the usual morass of "oh yeah well you're an even bigger idiot than me" mudslinging, you are sort of arguing against yourself.

If BJJ was developed by guys who only trained under a "master" for a year, then surely your guy is at least as qualified as Carlos Snr and Helio were to teach MA.

Ditto if as you say you don't have to be an Olympian to develop Olympians.

Not pointing this out to put you in a bad light, just to show the issue ain't that clear cut.

One difference, is of course that the Gracies didn't claim to have learned the complete "Maeda" system, unlike your guy allegedly has with your instructor's WC. Then again they get slippery with the truth on some other issues, e.g. what they say in "The Gracie Way" about their four losses to Sakuraba.

Then again, where do we draw the line between lies and what's good marketing? Let he who is without sin...