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Thread: Bajiquan

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    lol, after getting taken to the shed, son, it's a little late to fess up...
    Not really, I do admit my baiji is not any master grade, at first already. At least I don't shout out things I don't know about and kept chasing a bigMac around, don't you get that big cat picture?
    (Mak Jo Si, Tin Yat Lineage Taoism) A Taoism Master with 16yrs+ of experience in Taoism and as a career. Exorcism is my profession.

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  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    Yes, I agreed already that his movements were precise his stances
    Well, that is part of the reason I posted it in this thread. It just looked good for what it was.


    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    however, were, from a classical Baji perspective, garbage.
    Perhaps, as a Baji practitioner, you are better qualified to make comments and criticisms than I am.

    All I can say at this point is that sometimes a movement may not look "right" on a form, until someone hits you with it.

    Also, no matter the details of the form in the way it was performed for camera, the same sifu may do it differently in a class, so it may not be fair to be to vocal about the criticisms.


    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    I can't tell on the opening stance without a side view but the "horse" stance on the initial elbow strike (0:25) is comically wide. It's not even possible to land that elbow when it doesn't even reach past your lead foot. The knees are splayed outwards in violation of the quanpu and he has zero power being delivered to the elbow. The way he plays it, the elbow is placed in position and then the hand whips around. That's not an elbow strike. The next move (0:28) is supposed to be a big sweeping forearm smash or at least something like a Choi Li Fut sau choi. Again, he's crisp but there's not wait power in the movement. It's crisp like a breakdancer. The punch at (0:31) is a pet peeve of mine because I see even "traditional" Baji players often do it this way....the rear elbow is raised really high behind him but that's just for show. It's a stupid modern Wushu convention that has slipped into even many traditionalists's forms. It robs power and serves no tactical purpose. The rear hand should be pulled back near the waist or ribs, not held at head level and the trajectory on this guys punching hand is like some sort of weird sideways hammerfist. He's not even punching with it. He does a big flowery sweep into position. At (0:35) another bit of classic modern Wushu nonsense as he draws a big circle in the air with his left hand before slowly chambering it at his waist? ???
    Thank you for taking time to explain the details. Again, some of what you say makes sense, other stuff may have made sense, either way, if I was Baji pracitioner.

    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    I could go on like this through the whole video. There's no martial applicability to the majority of the moves the way he's doing them, no waist power, no full body fa-jin, his stances are too wide and too low, no rounded back/waist. etc.
    Again, I saw some moves that seemed to exert power. Others may have been lacking fajing, but again, sometimes in kung fu, you don't see the fajing, you feel it on contact. That is why I am "careful".

    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    No such thing as "Shaanxi" style of Baji. You mispelled it btw. It's only important because Shaanxi/陕西 needs to be distinguished from Shanxi/山西.
    Well, have a look at the description of that video clip and you will see Shanxi written in that exact manner.


    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish
    I didn't see his teaching clips and couldn't tell what school he is affiliated. If you point me to some of those clips then I could probably comment more specifically.
    Here, I believe that this is the same sifu.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXglA...eature=related


    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    Sure thing:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8G9FW5hM3U
    My form is a hell of a lot uglier and not nearly as precise as his but the power is much better and the body requirements are, for the most part, being met. Most importantly, my movements pretty much all work in a scrap. I threw up a couple samples you can see here:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APqBOL3Sn04
    Thank you for posting. To be honest, this is the first time I see shouting in a Baji clip. Is this how your lineage practices this particular form or was this just to enhance the form during a public performance?

    From my readings and research, Grand Master Liu Yun Qiao seems to have been the real deal in the same wain as CTS of Lama Pai and Chee Kim Thong of Five Ancestor Fist (and other styles), so if someone asks to put up a video clips of what I consider authentic Baji, these would be a couple of them:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9-jg...eature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHiRq...eature=related

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    TGY, why do you chastise one moron and placate another?
    He is being kind to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    oop sorry,
    You should be. Now run back to your glorified Tae Kwon Do dojang and hop around until you get happy, thank you....


    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    forgot "Winning Taoism!"
    I believe that even the word "Taoism" is way above your (knuckle) head. So, don't waste our time with trying to come across as smart....run along now to your "kung fu-ist" Tae Kwon Do brothers are waiting for you.....

  4. #124
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    It's like a bad joke for anyone to be criticizing practitioners from Li Shu Wen's lineage.
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by CYMac View Post
    Not really, I do admit my baiji is not any master grade, at first already.
    lol, yet you critique someone with far more expertise in it than you, having no clue what you are talking about at all;

    Quote Originally Posted by CYMac View Post
    At least I don't shout out things I don't know about
    srsly? ur entire existence on the forum is to shout out things you don't know about;

    Quote Originally Posted by CYMac View Post
    and kept chasing a bigMac around, don't you get that big cat picture?
    consider it part of my civic duty; I am like the town crier announcing the arrival of the village idiot...

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Violent Designs View Post
    It's like a bad joke for anyone to be criticizing practitioners from Li Shu Wen's lineage.
    Just for the record. I am not criticising anyone's lineage.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    I hate to break it to you but. . . bawang nailed it. That video is pretty cool but the main thing it has going for it is decent editing and a really cool setting for the filming. As actual traditional gongfu goes....lol. He's doing a pretty standard wushu version. The clip is labeled "Shaanxi Bajiquan". I live in Shaanxi. I'm pretty familiar with who's doing what out here.

    I can go into specifics on what he's doing wrong from a practical perspective if you want. His movements are crisp and clean but mostly useless.
    what is your first language?
    where's my beer?

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    I know a thing or two about kung fu.
    Not enough to know wushu when you see it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R. Brown View Post
    This is not a veiled request for compliments

    The short story is I did 325# for one set of 1 rep.

    1) Does this sound gifted, or just lucky?

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by CYMac View Post
    Just curious, why don't you talk without using swear words? Can you talk without them? I mean... you really HAVE to use them in every replies to make your post readable or something? I can't believe how much swearing you use, as a martial artist, you are really hot headed man. Can't you relax? If you can't stop insulting and abusing or bullying, learn it, or else your kids will give you a hard time later on by doing the same thing. Be a good role model man...
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gU2ZgaQ_H-Y
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R. Brown View Post
    This is not a veiled request for compliments

    The short story is I did 325# for one set of 1 rep.

    1) Does this sound gifted, or just lucky?

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by HardWork108
    Again, I saw some moves that seemed to exert power.
    Emphasis mine. Just my eye of course and I don't like to trash performances so I'd like to emphasize again, very precise movement there, looked good. Just not seeing any Baji body-method that I recognize. IMO, no actual power.
    Well, have a look at the description of that video clip and you will see Shanxi written in that exact manner.
    Yeah, I saw that and it's a really minor side issue because technically, that's the correct pinyin for the place name but the problem is that there are 2 provinces in China which, if you eliminate the tonal inflection, are pronounced identical. So just as a linguistic convention, 陕西 usually gets an extra ďa" in the middle to try and imply the 3rd tone pronunciation where 山西 (first tone) gets only one "a". Shanxi、山西 is a major center for Xingyi in China, especially Song style. Shaanxi/陕西 is next to Sichuan and is not famous for any martial arts because it's martial arts community lives there mostly as a result of mid 20th century history. The Chinese characters at the beginning of the clip say it's Shaanxi/陕西. To an English speaker they sound the same but this is Shanxi:
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Shanxi.svg.png
    And this is Shaanxi:
    http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/4...ceplacesin.jpg
    Thank you for posting. To be honest, this is the first time I see shouting in a Baji clip. Is this how your lineage practices this particular form or was this just to enhance the form during a public performance?
    A better question is why nobody else shouts. It's in the quanpu. There are even pictures out there of Liu Yunqiao standing in front of big Chinese calligraphy that says stuff about the shouting because it's so integral to the style. Google "heng ha breathing" for more info. "heng" is a nasal growl that shows up more in the small frame set and "ha" is the shout and is basically the same idea as a kiai. There's "heng" in my video too but not as audible. I ended up using a lot more "heng" in my leitai fight because. . . . of the mouth guard of course.

    I'll look at the clips later. I know it sounds cliche but...I actually have to head out and train. It's early morning here at the moment and I was just using the board to pass the time while I drink my morning Joe.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    Just for the record. I am not criticising anyone's lineage.
    I'm referring to CYMac Taoist Master, not you.

    Cheers
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  12. #132
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    ....back again. Waiting for a DVD to finish burning. I promised I'd burn Shifu another copy of our recent Leitai event. My "elder brother" asked for one.

    The Liu Yunqiao clips are not my taste but they are undeniably good. Notice how, in contrast to the "MTV Baji" guy, his punches are actual punches. They stab out really sharp. His whole body snaps into place rather than planting his feet first and then whipping the hands around into place. Notice how his knees are slightly turned in on the "horse stance".

    The Baji I like looks more like this:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UA9a9...eature=related

    Those guys are doing excellent, classic Bajiquan.

    More Baji that I find absolutely top flight:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lli7E...eature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUYxK9oIhHI

    Compare those clips I just posted with the MTV clip. Look at how narrow their horse is. Look at the angle that the elbow comes in. Follow the trajectory of the punches. They are all very practical.

  13. #133
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    Omar what do you think about Zhou Jingxuan's Bajiquan? What lineage is he from also?

    Just sheer curiosity.

    Cheers,

    -V
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by omarthefish View Post
    Emphasis mine. Just my eye of course and I don't like to trash performances so I'd like to emphasize again, very precise movement there, looked good. Just not seeing any Baji body-method that I recognize. IMO, no actual power.

    Yeah, I saw that and it's a really minor side issue because technically, that's the correct pinyin for the place name but the problem is that there are 2 provinces in China which, if you eliminate the tonal inflection, are pronounced identical. So just as a linguistic convention, 陕西 usually gets an extra ďa" in the middle to try and imply the 3rd tone pronunciation where 山西 (first tone) gets only one "a". Shanxi、山西 is a major center for Xingyi in China, especially Song style. Shaanxi/陕西 is next to Sichuan and is not famous for any martial arts because it's martial arts community lives there mostly as a result of mid 20th century history. The Chinese characters at the beginning of the clip say it's Shaanxi/陕西. To an English speaker they sound the same but this is Shanxi:
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Shanxi.svg.png
    And this is Shaanxi:
    http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/4...ceplacesin.jpg

    A better question is why nobody else shouts. It's in the quanpu. There are even pictures out there of Liu Yunqiao standing in front of big Chinese calligraphy that says stuff about the shouting because it's so integral to the style. Google "heng ha breathing" for more info. "heng" is a nasal growl that shows up more in the small frame set and "ha" is the shout and is basically the same idea as a kiai. There's "heng" in my video too but not as audible. I ended up using a lot more "heng" in my leitai fight because. . . . of the mouth guard of course.
    Best post of the entire forum in a while.

    What do you mean by nobody else shouts? Do you mean in Baji or a more broader context?
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R. Brown View Post
    This is not a veiled request for compliments

    The short story is I did 325# for one set of 1 rep.

    1) Does this sound gifted, or just lucky?

  15. #135
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    I suppose it's like kiai within the Japanese schools of thought. He means within Bajiquan, since it is stated within the quanpu as part of the system's fundamental theories.
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

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