Physics in training

[Brazil Mantis]

Dear members,

I would like to know about this issue in your country, since each part of world has own rules... A lot of brazilian instructors of martial arts are so worry about future of these arts in our country.

We have in Brazil, since 1998 a federal law that says about physics education profissional rules. Since that, they created council for teachers that works with physics education activities.

In 2002, this physics education council wrote a resolution which all martial arts instructors, dancing people, yoga and a lot of others diferent areas has to get graduate degree in physic education to teach their arts.

Unfornately physic education universities in Brazil did not teach martial arts or did not "form" students to teach these arts. As we know, at least in Brazil, and I would like to know about others countrys that to "form" a new instructor of martial arts, student will need several years to be ready and it is not commun to have oficial permission to teach from traditional schools in a short time.

Then, what is it the problem? The problem is that with physics education studies, anyone who finish this course will be "able" to teach all martial art, as gongfu, karate, jiu jitsu, judo and so far... I believe this is a big mistake and we will have a lot of problems with quality of martial arts teaching.

Thanks to share how your country organize this question, if possible for you...

Sincerely,

Samuel Mendonça, Brazil

[mantis108]

Well, That's the western overcertification mindset for ya.

I smell a conspirarcy thing going...

The funny thing is the "marriage" of Phys Ed and MA would seem like the perfect match. The only problem is no marriage is ever going to be perfect. It is those so called educated educators/scholars idotic ideals that dream up these stuff. Good intentions from the "scholars" but coming into the hands of politicans, you are going to get a load of carpola for sure.

Martial arts at the very core is not about academic pursuit. Martial arts at the very core is to educate a person to become a true human being which isn't something the politicans know or capable of. It is the art of being human and being human IS the art. The true identity and the entirety of knowledge is not or can not be represented by a mere piece of paper. Do I need a piece of paper to tell me that I am a good person worthy of others to listen to? Hell, no! Martial arts survived thousands of years before any form of certification. The real certification is alive and growing within the bossoms of the living teachers whom we are fortunate enough to have studied with. This certification process is much like the communist Chinese government whipping up the Wushu thing. It is about control and balance of power, period.

It does nothing more than to tear apart the communities (Kung Fu, Yoga, etc...). But that's politicians wicked minds for ya. Oh well... I suppose if you believe in pedigrees (pun intended), it would be a great thing.

Sincerely,

Mantis108

[Brazil Mantis]

Dear Mantis108,

in fact this is a political decision ofr my country and I do agree about "It is the art of being human and being human IS the art", as you told. Then, Physics Education (as we have in Brazil) have nothing to "controll" about martial arts. Specially traditional gongfu that we have few instructors...

Thank you for your reply...

Samuel Mendonça

[mantisben]

Originally posted by Brazil Mantis
...
...
In 2002, this physics education council wrote a resolution which all martial arts instructors, dancing people, yoga and a lot of others diferent areas has to get graduate degree in physic education to teach their arts.
...

Your government wants you to be "certified" to teach art? I can't find the WORDS to tell you what an atrocity that is. That is BAD, and it says alot about the people who approved of such a decree. Get those people removed from the positions of authority they hold, if you can.

It is one thing to allow people to be certified to teach martial arts or other arts (dancing, yoga, etc.), but for a GOVERNMENT to make it MANDATORY, is a crime.

I'm from the USA, and I'd like to think that if a law like this was passed here, there would be rioting in the streets. No only because of the attempt of the government to control "art", but the things they're planning to control in the future.

In my country, we had our government-decreed control issues also. For example, in the past, dark-colored people couldn't sh!t in the same toilet as white people, or drink from the same "public" water-fountain. Yeah, we had our issues in the past, and still do.

I wish I could offer some type of advice on how to combat that government art-control nonsense.

My prayers go out to everyone affected by this oppresive law.

[Brazil Mantis]

Dear Mantisben,

Yes, we have a federal law in Brazil number 9696/98 that statment that physics education is recognizing as a profission and to set up council. After this law, physics education people organized their council (CONFEF) to "controll" who got phys ed diploma.

In 2002 this CONFEF (Physics Education Federal Council) created some internal rules, as resolution and one of them talks about what they have to controll: it is funny because they defin as all physics activities will need a phys ed instructor, and then, they says: all martial arts, yoga, dancing, chess (...).

When supervisor from Confef came to my school and told me that I would need a Phys ed instructor to continous teaching praying mantis, then, I asked him: could you tell me what is correct in my sets? Could you give me supervision of my training? In fact, could you teach me praying mantis? He told no, I do not know gongfu, then, I told him okay, if you have no qualification for instruct me or my students, then, no make sense you come here...

We of San Paulo Wushu Federation and Brazilian Wushu Confederation are looking for our rights and looking for justice.

I really believe, as you told, that this is a crime. But I do not say this is a government crime but a CONFEF one, because wrong thing came from CONFEF internal rules...

Thanks to tell me about your country and for your support...

Sincerely,

Samuel Mendonça

[mantisben]

Originally posted by Brazil Mantis
...
In 2002 this CONFEF (Physics Education Federal Council) created some internal rules, as resolution and one of them talks about what they have to controll: it is funny because they defin as all physics activities will need a phys ed instructor, and then, they says: all martial arts, yoga, dancing, chess (...).

Chess? They want to require certification for "Chess"? They're out to control more than just Physics Education, this Federal Council.

When supervisor from Confef came to my school and told me that I would need a Phys ed instructor to continous teaching praying mantis, then, I asked him: could you tell me what is correct in my sets? Could you give me supervision of my training? In fact, could you teach me praying mantis? He told no, I do not know gongfu, then, I told him okay, if you have no qualification for instruct me or my students, then, no make sense you come here...

Excellent choice of words!! You telling him like this, exposes the craziness and utter nonsense of such a law.

We of San Paulo Wushu Federation and Brazilian Wushu Confederation are looking for our rights and looking for justice.

Maybe the art institutions that will be affected by this law can get a petition going as a show of dissatisfaction with the rulings of this Physic Education federation.

I really believe, as you told, that this is a crime. But I do not say this is a government crime but a CONFEF one, because wrong thing came from CONFEF internal rules...

Since you said it was a "Federal" law, I concluded the Brazilian government had something to do with approving this law. Maybe I was totally wrong. Still, if the government knows that the majority of people are against such a law, maybe they could do something to help you get the law changed.

Thanks to tell me about your country and for your support...

Sincerely,

Samuel Mendonça

You are very welcome. I hope things turn out for the best in this very serious situation.

In the USA, I think if there was a similar being passed, everybody in the ART community would oppose it. This would include musicians, painters, singers, sculptors (?), actors, dancers, etc.. I would go as far as saying that people OUTSIDE of the art community would oppose it also, out of fear that they would be next. It would be viewed as an attack on "Freedom of expression".

Then again, I could be wrong about this...

Sincerely,

Herminio Alvarez, Jr.

[EarthDragon]

Hello guys, hope all is well
Question.......... I have found that I am constantly refferring to physics when I teach. It seems that when I was learing it wasnt so predominate, or maybe it was and I just didnt see it, but whatever the case it seems that no matter what part of a technique you are trying to explian or train you must delve deeper into its origin in order to grasp the full understanding.

So I am asking if anyone has anything to add or pays as much attention to this as I do, without the obivious physics mind you, i.e force, mass, etc etc but more on a deeper level.

[Ego_Extrodinaire]

I just had this discussion with BL who ran it by her new " chinese cop friend' and we decided that really , almost all educated and/ or half intelligent adults, generally speaking have some interest in science and their world around them. I guess it's just growing into your humanity. happens to the best of us

[Hua Lin Laoshi]

Physics will always determine the outcome of any interaction between 2 or more physical bodies. Anatomy is what tells you how to apply the physics.

I think eventually everyone that studies MA long enough will reduce it to these levels. It's all about body movement (how it moves, how it doesn't, and how it breaks). Specific techniques are for beginners and intermediate. Advanced deals with concepts (physics) and isn't confined to specific responses.

I think that's where Bruce Lee ended up with his JKD which makes me chuckle when I see people learning it. It's like skipping the basics and going right to the advanced. That road doesn't exist. The only way to get there is over time and through training.

That's why Masters can just pull moves out of the thin air to match any situation. They know how, where and why to move.

[Hua Lin Laoshi]

After thinking a little on it I think the pattern is concept -> technique -> concept. I think it's a circle. Concepts create techniques and techniques define the concepts. You go in circles back and forth until your understanding transcends techniques.

Just my guess.

Anyhow, on the physics thing take a look at this:

E = MC2

energy = mass * acceleration

Now if I wanted to increase the energy imparted into my opponent (force of strike) I need to either increase the mass of my hand or increase the speed of the strike. Since I can't grow my hand bigger I'm left with training to hit faster. Simple physics.

[Ego_Extrodinaire]

and finally some scientific sense!!!

[-N-]

Anyhow, on the physics thing take a look at this:
E = MC2

energy = mass * acceleration

That should be:

energy = mass * speed of light squared

This one is for conversion of mass to energy. I've not be able to achieve this myself

Now if I wanted to increase the energy imparted into my opponent (force of strike) I need to either increase the mass of my hand or increase the speed of the strike.

The equation that applies here is:

KE = 1/2(MV2)

kinetic energy = 1/2 * mass * velocity squared

Since I can't grow my hand bigger I'm left with training to hit faster. Simple physics.

Also a reason why people train to hit with whole body power instead of only arm power.

Sinking increases the mass used for striking. Waist torque converts rotational momentum to linear momentum, increasing the velocity of the strike. Advancing footwork also increases velocity of the strike.

N.

[Three Harmonies]

When you get right down to it, physics is all that is happening with any martial situation. Both of my teachers are constantly talking about body dynamics. The techniques themselves are simple to apply, but it is the set up that is a real b!tch.
Hate to send biased, but I am, but if you want to read two of the very best books that deal with these issues I highly suggest "Effortless Combat Throws" by Tim Cartmell, and "Practical Chin Na" by Zhao Da Yuan, translated by Tim Cartmell. Tim's videos on the Chin Na and Throws are excellent companions. I have yet to see anything better (but I have heard Su Dong Chen's video series is similar in scope and detail!)

Jake

[Quick step]

Does anyone have statistics on hand speed for martial artists in comparison with boxers?

It's my understanding that welterweights have the highest hand speed. According to my high school physics teacher, the momentum is mass x velocity and the kinetic energy is 0.5 x m x v^2. These equations are supposed to mean that a welterweight can do as much damage with a fast punch as a heavyweight can do with a slower, power punch.

But I know that it doesn't work. Can someone explain the physics of it? It has something to do with the body weight.

[SevenStar]

I am reading a VERY unothodox christian novel currently. it is about a special forces soldier that was recruited to a black ops program. anyway, in the story, the man is told that the spaces between atoms are waves of energy. waves can be manipulated, particles cannot, which they explain to him is why many things considered preposterous by regular physics is feasible in quantum physics.

he runs with the idea and finds he is able to manipulate the temperature in his immediate vicinity and other things, like the flight path of a bullet. I know this isn't real, but quantum theory is. do you think it lends itself to proving the existence of qi?

on an interesting side note, I saw a quote by the founder of quantum theory stating something to the effect of all energy or matter that is created must be willed into existence by something else. so, can quantum theory explain god?