Training for Speed

[sanjuro_ronin]

The only time I have ever read frost being less than cordial is when he was giving BACK what he was getting.
Even though he is wrong about Tabatas.

[goju]

i think that lack of being coridial here can come at times because the majority of the posters here are older fellows who have been at it for along time so when there beliefs or views are questioned its insulting to them because they think " ive been training for so and so years how dare you!"

and when you put a bunch of guys like this in the same room....

[EarthDragon]

goju

i think that lack of being coridial here can come at times because the majority of the posters here are older fellows who have been at it for along time so when there beliefs or views are questioned its insulting to them because they think " ive been training for so and so years how dare you!"

very true, I for one have found myself guilty of the old..... "well it worked for our training back in my day syndrome"

When anyone does something for a long time they want to feel like they have the wisdom and the knowledge only one can have by expereince, and for alot of things this is true, but when people dont want to hear (there s a better way to build a mousetrap now a days for example), whats wrong with the one built in the 60"s goes thorugh thier heads.

Its only the ones who wish to continue catching mice that will listen and try to understand.

[Yum Cha]

Who's Frost??

[Yum Cha]

Active recovery is the best way to go that’s true, for me active recovery is a HR between 130 and 150bpm and this is what they suggest for most people, the younger you are the higher your working HR should be, the older the lower it should go, even as lower as 120bpm (this is working in the aerobic zone, filling the muscles and heart with oxygen rich blood and helping flush the system and recover for the next effort)

If you are older than me (im 35) then I’d suggest working towards the lower end of the above HR, 130bpm or maybe as low as 120bpm, it should feel easy it should not be too much of an effort

Normally the suggestion is to get HR down to 120bpm before going for the next set (this range will still be working the aerobic system especially in us older athletes)

So for me a workout like this will start with 10 minutes to get the HR up and the blood flowing in the range 130-150bpm, then I’ll do my first explosive set, usually weighted jumps, cleans or box jumps for between 5 and 10 seconds in length, then actively rest 3 min’s between sets doing lower heart rate stuff in the zone 130-150bpm(shadow boxing, jogging, walking, lunges, etc), ill keep repeating this cycle for the required number of sets (usually 6 – 8) before moving on to my next exercise. Keep in mind the more sets you do the longer the rest should be, so if I start at 3 minutes active rest I might move to 4 or even 5 minutes by the end of the work out, I want to be fresh for the later sets if I am working on speed and explosiveness. My last workout lasted 50 minutes and my average HR was 141bpm, which for me means I worked my aerobic capacity at the same time as I worked my alactic power.

Usual guide lines is 3 – 5 minutes between each set, but for me as long as I am actively recovering and keeping HR im my aerobic zone I don’t worry about the rest being too long, I just go after 3 minutes when I feel fresh

Recovery wise I have been told that fighters in shap should be able to get their HR down after a 5minute hard sparring round to 130bpm within a minute of finishing, personally I always test my 1 minute HR recovery after any conditioning session and write it down, if it comes down when I repeat or increase the length of a hard session I know I’m on the right track

quick calc, 220-53=167 max heart rate
x.75=125 So I always consider aerobic to start hard at 75%. I do a bike sometimes and mix sprint and rest over 45 minute run, working on keeping the pusle at 75% during the rest, then shooting to whatever on the sprint.

Same is kind of true with our forms, we do them like windsprints, then stretch and breathe down, then onto the next.

What I'm hearing from a practical level, in a way that applies to my training, is that there could certainly be a 'third' phase, and a 'complete' recovery between?

Boxers train 3x3, minute rest. Minute won't bring you to rest, so I'm thinking 10 minutes between full rests isn't a weak benchmark.

[PalmStriker]

very good point i like to do short explosive work 10 seconds or less with three minutes of much lower work in the 130-150bpm range, this way you work both alactic and aerobic, the lower workout between also helps recovery

yes, breathing time, like walking off a run.

[PalmStriker]

Speed is so essential in generating power. I like using three successive double strikes ending in this one shown in video. Power increases with momentum, you feel it and someone watching you demonstrate it will sense it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofr2oWT7KCc

[KC Elbows]

I think one of the problems many have with speed is they can have some on some preset series, but since fighting requires being able to alter plans, many don't work efficient transitions between the many methods in their style, so they drag on the transitions, and everything slows down accordingly. Strikes seem the easiest to work speed on, but overall fighting, phasing between strikes and throws and all, require a good amount of sparring drills.

I don't put enormous faith in exercises that just have you doing an unrelated task fast. I'm pretty sure Yngwie Malmsteen does not punch any faster than any other untrained fighter.

[Yum Cha]

I think one of the problems many have with speed is they can have some on some preset series, but since fighting requires being able to alter plans, many don't work efficient transitions between the many methods in their style, so they drag on the transitions, and everything slows down accordingly. Strikes seem the easiest to work speed on, but overall fighting, phasing between strikes and throws and all, require a good amount of sparring drills.

I don't put enormous faith in exercises that just have you doing an unrelated task fast. I'm pretty sure Yngwie Malmsteen does not punch any faster than any other untrained fighter.

I think people often mistake speed for position. When you step into a trap, the other person always seems faster. Likewise, predictability. If someone knows what you are planning, their counters seem a lot faster than you expect.