my visit with hendrik

[YouKnowWho]

As that picture you shows me, anyone could try it while doing it with inhale and compare it when one doing it with exhale and see which feel more nature according to the flow of motion and body handling....etc. That is the discussion. IMHO. What do you think?

When I trained my 13 Tai Bao, I concentrate more on the balance, flexibility, endurance instead of flow of motion and body handling. Since I'll try to stand as long as I can for endurance, it will include both inhale and exhale.

Others use ZZ to train their Qi flow and body posture. I train ZZ to "enhance" my combat skill. We just look at ZZ from differet angles.

[Hendrik]

When I trained my 13 Tai Bao, I concentrate more on the balance, flexibility, endurance instead of flow of motion and body handling. Since I'll try to stand as long as I can for endurance, it will include both inhale and exhal.

Others use ZZ to train their Qi flow and body posture. I train ZZ to "enhance" my combat skill. We just look at ZZ from differet angles.

Thank you for sharing. That is perfectly great.

[theo]

Again, just to be clear:
Two practitioners of a fighting system know as Wing Chun had a friendly meeting and at no point did they spar, fight or test each others MA skills?
But they were able to evaluate each others skills in a FIGHTING system by pushing against each other and doing demos of non-fighting?

That is freaking awesome !!!

sanjuro, there are different levels to be explored. what we discussed primarily was technology and some finer points of detail.

[sanjuro_ronin]

sanjuro, there are different levels to be explored. what we discussed primarily was technology and some finer points of detail.

Which is fine dude, really.
To each their own and to each their own path.
I've been in this game for over 30 years Bro and I have come to one very simple conclusion:
Your system gives YOU what YOU put into it.

[t_niehoff]

I have come to one very simple conclusion:
Your system gives YOU what YOU put into it.

I don't think that is quite accurate. Poor methods of training, no matter how much you put into it, will produce poor results. It is really the combination of method + effort that produces results.

[Scott R. Brown]

I don't think that is quite accurate. Poor methods of training, no matter how much you put into it, will produce poor results. It is really the combination of method + effort that produces results.

So, what you are saying is, even if I do 50 years of internal training, learning to empty my mind while somehow remaining opened-minded, while training in the ancient art of. "The Wet Noodlle Whip" I still won't be invincible?

What about if I change my name to Hendrik? Do you think that will help?

[Scott R. Brown]

BTW, that was nice, thank you for sharing!

[Hendrik]

Again, just to be clear:
Two practitioners of a fighting system know as Wing Chun had a friendly meeting and at no point did they spar, fight or test each others MA skills?
But they were able to evaluate each others skills in a FIGHTING system by pushing against each other and doing demos of non-fighting?

That is freaking awesome !!!

The reality is
Different action evaluate different skill of a Fighting system.
Even sparing cant tell everything and need to rely on other test. That is reality.
So, one could check on structure handling, breaking power.... out side of sparing and in sparing check for different things.

There are plenty of good sport fighter who do great in competition but freeze in real fighting.

a real example was one of the Best Lui Toi figther in SEA, after he winning the fight was in a friend home to have a healing massage on his injury limps. A gangster rush in and beat the **** out of his friend who has trouble with the friend. The figther admit he just freezed and shock for a few seconds and things is over to my siheng,and He cant do anything to help his best friend because that it is so intense action of the attack.

When I meet Mas Oyama's top class fighter decades ago, We didnt spare either, he is just playing with me. sure I could tell the world Ya, I spar with him. but what is the reality? I cant even take a single low sweep both timingly and power vice from him if he execute it according to his level of attainment. He is just play with me like a small kid. Do he needs to spar with me to know me? Do I need to spar with him to know him? Get real.


It is a complicated issue and the term fighting and sparing doesnt tell it all.

[sanjuro_ronin]

When I meet Mas Oyama's top class fighter decades ago, We didnt spare either, he is just playing with me. sure I could tell the world Ya, I spar with him. but what is the reality? I cant even take a single low sweep both timingly and power vice from him if he execute it according to his level of attainment. He is just play with me like a small kid. Do he needs to spar with me to know me? Do I need to spar with him to know him? Get real.

Dude, if reality came up and kicked you in the nads, you'd probably say it didn't do it right because it's pinky toe was out of alignment.

[Hendrik]

Dude, if reality came up and kicked you in the nads, you'd probably say it didn't do it right because it's pinky toe was out of alignment.

hahaha... you know spar with a top Kyokushin when I was a teen is great story in high school to impress the teen girls right? hahaha.

[horserider]

Hi horserider,

If you re-read your first post, there is a heavy implication of no movement.

Not mis-communication. You made your own additions to what was written. I implied nothing. You added your own meanings and then went on to semantic hairsplitting for your own purposes.

I would expect an adult to tell me they did not understand what i said and could I explain further.

To review. Your agreement was that a demonstration of wing chun inch force consisted of the following.
A. twisting if the waist. My reply. No,no waist twisting.
B. Stepping into the target. My reply No,no stepping.
C. pulling back of left shoulder to propel right. My reply No,no pulling back of one shoulder to generate momentum for the other.

This is all I am talking about . Nothing else. Nothing implied.

When you stand at rest then raise your and an inch is that momentum? If so fine. However it is not in the same league as what was being discussed. Stepping and 2 different rotational movements to generate force.

There was no discussion or mention of methods of using bones and tendons.

Nothing mysteries or magical. this is the very first thing Wing Chun begins to train after one opens the stance in SLT. I find it strange that someone can talk about wing chun yet not have an understanding of the first thing trained.

[horserider]

Mr. Hendrik

I enjoy your posts but am sorry to say I do not think my continued participation is possible.

I do not see how one can have an adult discussion when others don't read what is written but rather add to or filter through their own beliefs. I have never been exposed to a group so ready to attack and so reluctant to ask for further clarification or explanation. Discussion is not possible with a closed mind with near religious fervor and belief.

I do not know how you can continue to do it. Either strength of character and immense desire to share or you are a masochist

[Scott R. Brown]

Hi horserider,

If you re-read your first post, there is a heavy implication of no movement.

Not mis-communication. You made your own additions to what was written. I implied nothing. You added your own meanings and then went on to semantic hairsplitting for your own purposes.

I would expect an adult to tell me they did not understand what i said and could I explain further.

To review. Your agreement was that a demonstration of wing chun inch force consisted of the following.
A. twisting if the waist. My reply. No,no waist twisting.
B. Stepping into the target. My reply No,no stepping.
C. pulling back of left shoulder to propel right. My reply No,no pulling back of one shoulder to generate momentum for the other.

This is all I am talking about . Nothing else. Nothing implied.

When you stand at rest then raise your and an inch is that momentum? If so fine. However it is not in the same league as what was being discussed. Stepping and 2 different rotational movements to generate force.

There was no discussion or mention of methods of using bones and tendons.

Nothing mysteries or magical. this is the very first thing Wing Chun begins to train after one opens the stance in SLT. I find it strange that someone can talk about wing chun yet not have an understanding of the first thing trained.

You implied a great deal dimwit. Do not blame the reader for your inability to be clear when you write!

What? Are you Hendrik Jr.? You think your job is to bait people into pleading with you to present more information in order for your vague assertions be made more clear, so we may be blessed by your rarefied wisdom?

How about you just be more clear from the beginning? How about instead of saying what you "think" isn't happening, you state what "IS" happening and THEN describe it in a clear manner? We aren't mindreaders here! We aren't responsible to know what is inside your innermost thoughts while you are posting your poorly worded comments!

What is with you guys? You claim you have knowledge of things you can't even communicate clearly to others!

You, like Hendrik, appear to have little to no awareness of your bodies.

Mr. Hendrik

I enjoy your posts but am sorry to say I do not think my continued participation is possible.

I do not see how one can have an adult discussion when others don't read what is written but rather add to or filter through their own beliefs. I have never been exposed to a group so ready to attack and so reluctant to ask for further clarification or explanation. Discussion is not possible with a closed mind with near religious fervor and belief.

I do not know how you can continue to do it. Either strength of character and immense desire to share or you are a masochist

No, he is as dumb as a door, apparently just like you! He can keep posting and posting because he is narrow-minded and cannot see any perspective other than his own! He can keep posting because he is ignorant of anything that doesn't go on within his own scrambled up mind!

[Scott R. Brown]

Hendrik,

Getting tossed around by Mas Oyama is NOT the same thing as standing still and having someone push on you while you don't move.

Your comparison is like saying, "Just because someone can win while playing the video game Streetfighter, they can win a REAL streefight!" There is a huge difference between the two. One is PRETEND fighting, the other is REAL fighting!

Your little game with theo was just that, A GAME!!!

[anerlich]

There are plenty of good sport fighter who do great in competition but freeze in real fighting.

I venture that there are probably more guys who do internal training, chi sao and "structure demonstrations" - are they good? at what, and who could tell and how? - who freeze in real fighting.

Discussion is not possible with a closed mind with near religious fervor and belief.

I was thinking the same thing, but probably not about the same individuals.

I do not know how you can continue to do it.

"How" is easy. "Why" is the more difficult question.