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Thread: Zhai Yao Er Lu - Comparative Study

  1. #1
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    Zhai Yao Er Lu - Comparative Study

    A few weeks ago we had a good discussion going on the different versions of the Essentials #1 (zhai yao yi lu) form. Tonight I decided to start a discussion of Essentials #2 (zhai yao er lu).

    Below I have listed the techniques of the first section in one version of the Taiji Meihua Tanglangquan set Zhai Yao Er Lu (Essentials #2) as taught by Zhang Zhen Yuan.

    Feel free to add comments concerning how the version you learned may be different than this.

    Zhai Yao Er Lu
    Essentials #2

    01. Gather Power
    02. Right Reverse Qilin Step with Double Hooks
    03. Horse Pattern, Right Chopping Palm to Er Men
    04. Reverse Qilin Step, Immortal Points at Road
    05. Left Grab with Left Front Kick
    06. Right Front Kick with simultaneous Right Circular Claw Strike
    07. Right Jade Ring Step and Left (Double) Rising Elbow Strike
    08. Left Jade Ring Step and Right (Double) Coiling Elbow
    09. Right Forward Step and Right Rolling Arm Strike
    10. Left Forward Step with Right Awl Character Strike
    11. Left Seven Star Step with Right Inverted Awl Character Strike
    12. Left Seven Star Step with Left Gua and Right Inward Split to Temple
    13. Right step forward with Double Downward Palm Blocks
    14. Left Seven Star step with Left Outward Block and Right Awl Character Strike
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-14-2011 at 01:22 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    Movement 02:

    This posture is traditionally known as 螳 螂 雙 封 下 “Praying Mantis Double Seals Descend” (táng láng shuāng fēng xià).

    Here is the description of this move taken from my book Diao Fa: Mantis Hook & Claw Methods:

    Step the right foot sideward a little past shoulder width distance. Circle the arms in a counter-clockwise movement from five o’clock to nine o’clock. When the palms reach the nine o’clock position sweep them forward across the body back to the three o’clock position while shifting into qi lin bu (麒 麟 步 qilin step) with shuang gou shou (雙 勾 手 double hook hands).
    This movement is a double palm sweeping block that ends in double hook grabs to the opponent‘s left attacking arm. It represents the keyword 采 cai (pluck) which is a jerking pull used to uproot the opponent’s stance, causing him to stumble forward.


    An example of the Qilin Step (麒 鱗 步 qí lín bù) can be seen here:

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...7292.750549480

    However, in this form the head would face toward the rear with the hands more to the side of the body than in the photo.

    Here is a drill we practice in my school to train movements 02 - 04:

    雙 勾 掌 擋 穿 爪
    shuang gou - zhang dang - chuan zhao
    double hooks - palm block - piercing claw

    The opponent throws a right lead punch. Mantid sweeps the punch aside with double hooks to the right. The opponent executes a left reverse punch. Mantid deflects the attack with a right cross palm block, then pulls the opponent’s left arm down and attacks with a left high piercing claw to the opponent’s eyes. The opponent cross palm blocks with the right hand, pulls mantids left arm down while switching his feet and executes a left lead punch. Mantid sweeps the punch aside with double hooks to the left. The opponent executes a right reverse punch. Mantid deflects the attack with a left cross palm block, then pulls the opponent’s right arm down and attacks with a right high piercing claw to the opponent’s eyes.


    This drill is also found in my book.

    Here is a video of my son and I doing two versions of the drill:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp2gvR8HO2I
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-27-2011 at 07:53 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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    Quote Originally Posted by mooyingmantis View Post
    02. Right Reverse Ride Scales Step with Double Hooks
    What does this mean?
    Scales?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tainan Mantis View Post
    What does this mean?
    Scales?
    鱗 lín fish scales

    That is the literal translation.

    When I first translated the phrase 騎 鱗 步 qí lín bù I wondered if it might actually be a h o m ophone error and refer to the 麒 麟 qí lín Qilin, one of the four fabulous beasts mentioned in Chinese mythology. Notice that both have the same tones.
    However, I chose to go with what was written and the literal translation of the phrase "ride scales".
    Chinese art often uses the motif of a small child riding atop a fish.

    Any information you can provide would be appreciated!
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-27-2011 at 07:54 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

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    phonetics

    Quote Originally Posted by mooyingmantis View Post
    鱗 lín fish scales

    refer to the 麒 鱗 qí lín Qilin, one of the four fabulous beasts mentioned in Chinese mythology. Notice that both have the same tones.
    Chinese Phonetics
    It is the creature.
    Chinese has a very strong phonetic component. Much stronger than modern Chinese people give it credit.
    In English the meaning is related to the sound.

    In Chinese, the meaning should be related to the character first, and the sound second. In other words, you would need to see the character to verify the meaning of the word.

    But, in actuality, it does not work like that. Any character that the writer knows that fits the sound he is looking for will suffice.
    As a student learning Chinese this is unacceptable from the language instructors perspective.
    Hence, the strong tendency of educated Chinese to give less weight to the phonetic component of the written word.

    Boxing manuals where passed down originally as short songs or phrases describing the techniques. Later came a habit of writing the sound down.
    So, when translating the manual it is important to have a good understanding of what the original sounds were as that is how the manual was passed down.
    When making translations of boxing manuals.

    The Poem of Commands
    In ancient times orders were sometimes transmitted through rhyming verse.
    To understand and use this method of transmission all the soldiers had a song that they sang. When an order or secret command needed to be transmtted it was told as a 5 or 7 character rhyming verse.
    This helped to insure that there would be no mistake in the transmission of the message.

    This may have something to do with the habit of transmitting technique names from generation to generation, since the soldiers would already be familiar with the process.

  6. #6
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    麒鱗步 is also called "monkey" stance.

    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTYwNDA2OTY0.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tainan Mantis View Post
    Chinese Phonetics
    It is the creature.

    Boxing manuals where passed down originally as short songs or phrases describing the techniques. Later came a habit of writing the sound down.
    So, when translating the manual it is important to have a good understanding of what the original sounds were as that is how the manual was passed down.
    When making translations of boxing manuals.

    The Poem of Commands
    In ancient times orders were sometimes transmitted through rhyming verse.
    To understand and use this method of transmission all the soldiers had a song that they sang. When an order or secret command needed to be transmtted it was told as a 5 or 7 character rhyming verse.
    This helped to insure that there would be no mistake in the transmission of the message.

    This may have something to do with the habit of transmitting technique names from generation to generation, since the soldiers would already be familiar with the process.
    Kevin,
    Thank you for the feedback! I am glad my inference was correct concerning Qilin. I will change my two initial posts to reflect that.
    Your added information was very interesting!

    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    麒鱗步 is also called "monkey" stance.

    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTYwNDA2OTY0.html
    John,
    Thanks for the add information and the video clip!

    Here is an article on the Qilin with one photograph of a statue rendering:

    http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/110049/qilin
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-13-2011 at 05:03 AM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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    Movement 04. Reverse Qilin Step, Immortal Points at Road

    Of the six examples I have seen of Essentials #2 each includes the traditional movement 仙 人 左 指 路 xiān rén zhǐ lù (The Immortal Points at the Road).

    The movement can be interpreted as a left piercing claw strike to the eye or as a open palm strike to 耳 門 ěr mén.

    Again, I present this same video as an example of movements 02 - 04: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp2gvR8HO2I
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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    麒 鱗 sometimes loosely translated as "Unicorn".

    As in the actor's nickname, Unicorn Chan.

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    Small Hill Climbing Stance

    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    麒鱗步 is also called "monkey" stance.

    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTYwNDA2OTY0.html
    We refer to the above as Xia Dan San (spelling?).
    Small Hill Climbing.

    The reverse of that, where the back thigh is parallel to the ground with the knee up and the front knee turned down to the ground is what we refer to as "monkey stance". Body and intent is still facing the forward direction.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by iunojupiter View Post
    We refer to the above as Xia Dan San (spelling?).
    Small Hill Climbing.
    小 登 山
    xiǎo dēng shān (Mandarin)
    siu dang saan (Cantonese)

    Junojupiter,
    Thanks for the information!
    What is the weight distribution that you were taught for this stance? Front/Rear? 60/40, 50/50, etc.?
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-14-2011 at 01:25 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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    Thank you!

    Thanks Richard.

    Weight distribution is about 70/30 I would say, for both Small Hill Climbing and Monkey Stance.

    SHC- 70/30 front leg
    MS- 70/30 rear leg

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    First Several Moves of Zhai Yao Er Lu

    Start facing "North".
    - from start, step into right leg forward small hill climbing with right hand supporting a left arm block (defending against a kick).
    - look left, left arm goes left to block punch, right hand pats opponents arm out of way, left hand strikes face, return to guard position in cat stance face "west".
    - left hand hooks (attack to eyes or as defense against attack) while left foot kicks (instep roundhouse). This I believe would be Richard's Immortal Points at the Road.
    - Follow with right hook to head while right leg roundhouse.
    - Step into right foot forward lady stance (jade ring) towards north west, right hand blocks/grabs opponents arm with left rising elbow to break opponents arm.
    - Step into left foot forward small hill climbing stance towards south west, left hand blocks/grabs opponents arm with right horizontal (coiling) elbow to opponents arm.
    - Step into right foot forward small hill climbing stance towards north west, left hand supports right arm push (not sure for name of this strike. left hand supports right wrist, right arm is parallel to ground and can be used to push the opponent or shoved into throat area as a strike.)

    Cheers,

  14. #14
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    Junojupiter,
    Very good and easy to follow description! I have seen it played the way you describe it. Does your version come from Master Zhang Bingdou's lineage?

    Quote Originally Posted by iunojupiter View Post
    First Several Moves of Zhai Yao Er Lu
    - Step into right foot forward small hill climbing stance towards north west, left hand supports right arm push (not sure for name of this strike. left hand supports right wrist, right arm is parallel to ground and can be used to push the opponent or shoved into throat area as a strike.)
    I do not know what this movement is called in TJMH (still have more translating to do). However, in WHF's book the type of movement you describe is referred to as 滾 膀 gǔn bǎng ("rolling arm"). Perhaps someone else can provide us with the proper TJMH term.
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-14-2011 at 10:29 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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    Mandarin Duck Kicks

    05. Left Grab with Left Front Kick
    06. Right Front Kick with simultaneous Right Circular Claw Strike

    鸳 鸯 腳 yuān​ yang jiǎo - Mandarin Duck Kick

    Movements 05 & 06 feature the famous Mandarin Duck Kick theory of Master Lin Chong, one of the original eighteen masters from which Praying Mantis boxing was developed, according to legend.

    There seems to be some diversity as to which kicks are applied here. I have seen double front kicks, one front kick and one roundhouse kick and two roundhouse kicks, depending on who was performing the movements.

    Yet, in nearly every performance the hand work was the same. The first kick was preceded by a left grab and the second kick had a simultaneous hook punch (yang zhang, quan chui or quan zhao chui) attached to it.

    Shrfu Xia Zhao Long refers to the kicks as:

    连 环 脚 lián huán jiǎo - Linked Ring Legs (e.g. chain or continuous kicks)
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-16-2011 at 07:16 PM.
    Richard A. Tolson
    https://www.patreon.com/mantismastersacademy

    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

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