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Thread: Tiger Mothers and FOB Moms

  1. #31
    whoa... thats fukced up DJ... why would you consider this question off limits???

    VERY curious...


    i have no kids... that i know of... and i would be right ****ed off to find out otherwise... but i do have a god son who ive put ALOT of time into and between fam and friends i have spent alot of time with kids... i had an injury a few years back that kept me from working for a length of time and since i was being paid to stay home i decided to help my peoples and become mister daycare... i saved alitta people alotta money and i learned alot about kids... i feel like when i do have my own kids, i'll have a decent handle on this thang... better to learn the tricks of the trade BEFORE you have your own, IMO...

  2. #32
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    I get the feeling he doesn't like you, Kansuke

    Do you have kids? I have one.

    And Syn7, I hear what you're saying but I disagree. Being a parent is something you learn by doing. There's no way you can learn the tricks of the trade beforehand. Other people's kids are totally different from your own. It's like saying you'll figure out marriage by interacting with other people's wives. Well, not quite like that - get that synful thought out of your mind right now - but you get what I'm saying.
    Gene Ching
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneChing View Post
    I get the feeling he doesn't like you, Kansuke
    lol, ya think?

    mmm ignore function works great.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  4. #34
    i get what youre saying but i stand by what i said... although i think we agree more than you seem to think... you can learn to parent untill you actually act as a parent... and im saying if you put that time in with other fam and whatnot, you are acting as a parent... you dont have to be a parent to be doing the act of parenting... its all just guidance and mentorship and its a two way street that has a bond of love to keep it together in trying times and make the good times that much better...

    my godson doesnt have a reliable father... i taught lil man how to stand and pee... you know what im saying... i didnt spend two weeks babysitting and think i know it all... and i dont know it all... but i am significantly more prepared than i was before any of these experiences... now ofcourse i would have figured it out when the time came if i had to with my own kids, but i happened to have the opportunity in taking a positive role in the lives of other children around me and not only has that changed me and made me personally a better person i feel but its also helped prepare me for my own... i know it... the way i deal with kids now is sooo much better than it was when i was afraid i might break them... ive put the real time in and ive been rewarded for that... ofcourse i'll get curveballs, but im better off with the batting practice than without... there is no doubt about that what so ever...

    you said you learn by doing... and thats exactly what im talking about... i wasnt talking bout buying ten books and then knowing whats up... but by doing the work and learning the task... maybe i'll love my own kids more, i dont know...
    Last edited by Syn7; 02-10-2011 at 03:57 PM.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    whoa... thats fukced up DJ... why would you consider this question off limits???

    VERY curious...
    Oh, I don't. I have a son.
    But, also, I don't think much of kansuke as he's a dick. lol
    Should be in the faq.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    lol, ya think?
    no accounting for taste I guess. If you travelled and became enlightened you'd like me more. I'll wait for you to come around!

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    Oh, I don't. I have a son.
    )


    Ah, now we're getting somewhere! So, do you deliberately withhold things from him to make his life more difficult, so to reap the benefits to which you alluded in post #18?

  8. #38
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    And I think sin and gene are both right. But gene is more right.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Kansuke View Post
    )


    Ah, now we're getting somewhere! So, do you deliberately withhold things from him to make his life more difficult, so to reap the benefits to which you alluded in post #18?
    i will... and i wish my parents had for me...

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    i will... and i wish my parents had for me...

    Like what? You wish they had not fed you when you were hungry or put a roof over your head? Are you sorry they put shoes on your feet? Just how deprived does it have to get before these benefits kick in?

  11. #41
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    Tiger moms vs. xombies

    I was tempted to post this on our zombie thread, but decided it would be more topical here. I've been in contact with Roger Ma. He was kind enough to forward us a copy of his book. It's quite amusing.

    Roger Ma on Why Tiger Mothers Are Superior (During A Zombie Outbreak)
    * By Brad Moon Email Author
    * February 14, 2011 |
    * 12:30 pm |

    Unless you’ve been living under a rock for the past month or so, you’ve probably been inundated by the flood of opinions on Amy Chua’s controversial parenting book Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother. Jonathan posted his thoughts on the matter a month ago and we’re bringing another viewpoint on Chua’s parenting methods. This time, it’s well known zombie-fighting instructor, author of The Zombie Combat Manual: A Guide to Fighting the Living Dead and previous guest post contributor to GeekDad, Roger Ma. I’m willing to bet that the angle of “tiger mothering” has not previously been discussed in the context of surviving a zombie outbreak (The NYT, for example, seldom seems to write critically about the subject of flesh eating corpses); it certainly adds a new light to Chua’s techniques. Read on to see Roger’s take on things.

    Why Tiger Mothers Are Superior (During a Zombie Outbreak)
    by Roger Ma


    Over the past several weeks, the media heat generated Amy Chua’s article “Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior” has exceeded nuclear fission levels. For the few of you who have been able to remain outside the blast radius, allow me to briefly summarize. In the article, an excerpt from her now best-selling book, Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother, Chua details a style of parenting somewhat common among first-generation immigrants, but particularly widespread within the East Asian community. The guidelines of this parenting style Chua enforces on her own children include the following:

    • stringent, disciplined academic study
    • no television or video games
    • no playdates or sleepovers
    • musical instrument proficiency (piano and violin only)

    In recent media appearances, Chua has backed off from her original intrepid stance (receiving death threats can cause that to happen), saying that her book is meant to be a memoir and self parody. However, I have no doubt that, with the cameras off, she would affirm that not only is her way of parenting the better way, it’s the only way. The other unspoken truth that Chua has not confirmed in either her book or her appearances is that this style of child-rearing is exceptionally well suited to ensuring your children can survive in a world of flesh-eating corpses.

    I am a zombie fighter. I am also the product of a Tiger mother. While these two facts may seem incongruous to most people, I can assertively say that not only are they related, they have a direct causal relationship. It is no coincidence that my book, The Zombie Combat Manual, begins with a dedication to my mother “for her strength and discipline.” Having experienced many of the parenting techniques Chua details, I can explain exactly how this type of regimen not only prepares children for the world of higher education, but also a world infested with living dead.In this article, I’ll cover the most prominent guidelines of Tiger mother parenting, and how they relate to becoming an effective zombie combatant.

    Discipline
    The cornerstone of Tiger mother parenting is the development of discipline within your children. Whether it’s learning 50 new SAT words a day, sitting at the piano for three hours (minimum), or repetitively striking a target in the shape of an undead cranium, discipline enables the Tiger offspring to repeat a task for hours on end with nary a peep of complaint. This skill is especially handy during a large scale zombie outbreak, when your days will be replete with repetitive tasks. Only the most disciplined individuals will be able to sharpen armaments, mend barriers, and beat back ravenous corpses without going completely insane, children raised in the Tiger manner among them.

    Math Skills
    “When will I ever use this stuff?” This plaintive refrain can be heard among many disobedient children in the throes of mathematical study. While an argument can be made that accelerated calculus and differential equations have limited use in the post-undead world, a quick analytical wit is essential for surviving a zombie outbreak. Should an element of doubt still lurk in your mind, assess the following two scenarios:

    * You are being pursued by a zombie. The corpse’s pace averages 23 minutes/mile. You can run an 11-minute mile. If you run 7.5 miles, with two five-minute breaks, how long before you encounter a zombie again?
    * Your weapon can only crush another 35 undead skulls. Your exit is blocked by a room packed with the living dead. The room is 10 x 8 feet, and the average standing zombie occupies a space of two square feet. Can you eliminate all the attackers in the room?

    Without basic math competency, the answer to these two questions will elude you, as will your ability to survive in an undead world. (Click here for the actual and reality-based answers to these two problems.)

    Independence
    Another essential component of this extreme parenting strategy is the desire to create an individual that can excel independent of a hovering parent, or what I’ve termed the “Boy Named Sue” strategy. Tiger mothering is also highly critical of the “over-coddling” displayed by today’s Western parents. When it comes to undead survivability, it is often the unfortunate case that due to infection and/or reanimation of a parent, children may be on their own. Which child is more likely to survive a zombie outbreak: the one who has had to manage academic studies, household chores, college prep work, a part-time job, musical practice, Math club, a Westinghouse project, and volunteer hours, or the one whose mom still scrubs his underwear?

    Tiger Shortcomings
    While I’ve detailed the argued advantages of Tiger parenting, there are admittedly some shortcomings of this type of child-rearing when it comes to zombie apocalypse preparation. Two of these not-insignificant liabilities require additional note:

    * Physical Fitness – In traditional Tiger parenting, not only is there a clear lack of emphasis on physical activity and fitness, it is disregarded in lieu of other “more worthwhile” activities. During an attack of flesh-eating corpses, however, your fitness level, at least in the short term, will be critical to your survival. A regimen of physical activity needs to be incorporated into traditional Tiger parenting in order to develop a well-rounded zombie survivor.

    * Teamwork – while personal excellence is a focus for the Tiger child, social interaction and the ability to work within groups is typically de-prioritized. In an undead outbreak, this lack of social skill could be detrimental to your child’s survival. While the concept of the “Lone Wolf” survivor and “Last Man Standing” is a romantic one, the reality is that you will need to band together with others who have skills that complement your own. You can survive in a zombie world without being a “team player,” but for how long is questionable.

    There are many who contend that this type of uber-strict, hyper-achievement-oriented mentality with little to no room for mental or emotional growth has no place in today’s society. While this point can be argued ad infinitum, there’s no denying the fact that the disciplined product of Tiger parenting will fare infinitely better in a world rampant with flesh-eating corpses. Thus, If you are one these parents that have endured the judgmental gazes of other, non-Tiger training parents, fear not.

    When the dead rise, Tiger parents can rest assured that they have prepared their child well to succeed at university as well as battling the living dead.

    Roger Ma is the author of The Zombie Combat Manual: A Guide to Fighting the Living Dead. He is currently planning the undead combat training regimen for his two infant sons.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
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  12. #42
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    I just listened to her being interviewed on the CBC.

    Apparently she waffled with her 15 year old and lets her have sleepovers and she no longer has to play the violin.

    so... maybe this ain't all it's puffed up to be and is just an ideal coming out of mom's head but not actually and truly manifest in reality.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  13. #43
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    Obey

    Gene Ching
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  14. #44
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    Panda dads!

    * March 29, 2011, 9:00 AM ET
    Tiger Mom…Meet Panda Dad
    By Alan Paul

    I have watched the uproar over the Tiger Mom debate with growing annoyance that one simple question remains unasked: Where are the dads?

    I am a father of three who has been on the frontline of parenting for years, thanks to my wife’s demanding career and my own freelance lifestyle. I refuse to cede the entire discussion about proper child-rearing to mothers, Tiger or otherwise.

    When my kids were 2, 4 and 7, our family of five moved from suburban New Jersey to Beijing.

    Our 3½ years in China give me an unusual insight into what author Amy Chua claims is not only the best way of parenting but also the Chinese way.

    During our first weeks in Beijing, we attended a talent show at our children’s British school and watched Chinese students ascend the stage and play Chopin etudes and Beethoven symphonies, while their Western counterparts ambled up and proudly played the ABCs under their flapping arms. It was enough to make anyone pause and ponder the way we are raising our kids.

    But time in China also taught me that while some here view a Chinese education as the gold standard, many there are questioning the system, noting that it stifles creativity and innovation, two things the nation sorely needs. Further, having seen it in action, I have a strong aversion to hard-driving “Tiger” parenting, certain that is not a superior method if your goals are my goals: to raise independent, competent, confident adults.

    Call me the Panda Dad; I am happy to parent with cuddliness, but not afraid to show some claw. Though I have had primary child care duties since our eldest son was born 13 years ago, I too have always worked, sometimes juggling a variety of demanding deadlines with an increasingly complex family schedule. As a result, controlled chaos reigns in our house – and it works for us, even if this has befuddled some friends and family members and sent weak-kneed babysitters scurrying for the door.

    It has also been a plus for our children, giving them space to take on responsibilities, be independent and see their parents pursuing their own interests and careers while also being very involved in one another’s lives. And it introduced them to a simple fact early: Life itself is controlled chaos and success depends on navigating it, rather than waiting for things to be perfect.

    This is largely a male perspective. To make a sweeping generalization, moms tend to be more detail oriented, and order driven. Dads often care less about the mess, can live with a bit more chaos and more easily adopt a big picture view. If my wife and I swapped positions, life would certainly be more orderly. But she cedes to my style of parenting because I am in charge of the day-to-day stuff. Her ability to do this is a key to us having a strong, thriving relationship; you can’t backseat drive how your children are being raised.

    This only works if you share the same basic values and the differences are small bore rather than big picture. She would not tolerate me calling the kids garbage or chaining them to a piano bench; we would both view this as barbaric and counterproductive.

    Kids raised in this fashion have more of an opportunity to develop their own personalities and interests. Our home is like a state university, where you can get a great education but you have to do your own legwork. A typical night: one kid has a big project due, another has a school play, the third has soccer practice; mom is working late because there is an international crisis brewing but she will barrel home to be sitting in the auditorium when the curtain rises; and I am trying to help everyone while fielding calls on a story I have to finish writing that night after the kids go to bed.

    It’s not the hyper-orderly household that Amy Chua portrays, but the kids are constantly learning to take responsibility for their own homework, play time and everything else. Doing so allows them to take genuine pride in their accomplishments. They need to succeed for their own benefit, not to prove that their parents are successful. It’s sheer narcissism to believe that your child’s every success and failure is a reflection of your worth. Get over yourself.

    Living in a Beijing housing compound, I watched Western and African kids running through the streets in roving packs of fun-seekers while their Chinese friends looked dolefully out the window in the midst of long hours spent practicing violin, piano or character-writing. When they were done, they unwound by picking up video game consoles. It looked like a sad, lonesome way to grow up and nothing I would ever prescribe to my children. And of course it’s not the only style of Chinese parenting. I saw plenty of kids smashing these same stereotypes.

    It also seems insane to cast an eye around the upper-middle-class American milieu Ms. Chua is discussing and conclude that the problem is that our child-rearing is too laid back. The shallowness of this concept will be obvious to anyone who has ever stalked a suburban soccer sideline or listened to New York parents prep their 18-month-old for nursery school interviews. God help us all if Ms. Chua’s books convinces these same people that they simply have not been trying hard enough.

    It’s easy to understand a traditional Chinese drive for perfection in children: it is a huge nation with a long history of people thriving at the top and scraping by at the bottom without much in between. The appeal in contemporary America stems from a sense that our nation is becoming stratified in similar ways and is about to get steamrolled by China. If you can’t beat them, join them.

    It’s an understandable impulse but it’s wrong. Forcing a child to constantly bend to your will can lead to docile mama’s boys or girls seeking approval for everything they do–or lead to constant rebellion and head-butting. Banning playing and sleeping at friends’ houses furthers a dangerous sense of isolation, denying them the ability to make the very social connections and interactions that they will need throughout life. These are the very skills that kids should be honing for success as a functioning adult, far more important than being able to play piano. Kids need more unstructured play, not less.

    Aside from being a much cheaper option than babysitters, sleepovers also help children learn to sleep anywhere, in any bed, with any pillow. This is not an ability to be scoffed at. It is, in fact, one of three goals everyone should realistically set for raising their kids: get them to adulthood with no sleeping, eating or sexual hang-ups. Do that and you will have done your job, launching them off with the foundation needed to thrive.

    Drop the hubris of thinking you can pick your children’s friends, interests and musical passions. Instead, help them grow up to be highly functioning, non-neurotic contributors with a strong sense of self. They will thank you.

    And so will society.

    Alan Paul is the author of “Big in China, My Unlikely Adventures Raising a Family, Playing the Blues and Becoming a Star in Beijing” (Harper). It is based on his award-winning WSJ.com column The Expat Life.
    Paul's book looks interesting.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneChing View Post
    It should be noted that Chua and Rubenfeld are very successful people and are capitalizing on the buzz very well.
    It's great as a marketing and financial addition to the spiritualist workplace and if it works, it is great! Stuff like this makes USA great! It gets people talking and keeps them on the 'radar' of success and talk show circuit so kudos to them.


    Mother leaves 13 years old alone to go to Taiwan

    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/04/...an-for-a-week/
    Last edited by mawali; 04-08-2011 at 03:24 AM.

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