Is it ok for Wing Chun to evolve?

[YouKnowWho]

Trying to evolve boxing into Judo may be impossible. Trying to "integrate" boxing and Judo is possible. May be the word "integration" will be a better word for "evolution". Instead of saying:

A -> C

may be it's better to say:

A + B = C

[Nite Templar]

Carlson Gracie's bjj evolved. Look what his young protege Vitor Belfort did to Wanderlai Silva. He was only 21 years old at the time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjrz76qqRac

I mention this because it seemed as though Vitor used a wing chun like chain punch attack to end the fight so quickly. Although it looks like the first punch was sort of like a rear cross. If he fights like that against Anderson Silva, I think he could win.

[Frost]

Carlson Gracie's bjj evolved. Look what his young protege Vitor Belfort did to Wanderlai Silva. He was only 21 years old at the time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjrz76qqRac

I mention this because it seemed as though Vitor used a wing chun like chain punch attack to end the fight so quickly. Although it looks like the first punch was sort of like a rear cross. If he fights like that against Anderson Silva, I think he could win.

please that was straight boxing, the only time carlson touched wing chun was to make money years later off seminars

none of his fighters including victor ever trained wing chun

[sanjuro_ronin]

If WC was like this, no it wouldn't need to evolve.

[Nite Templar]

I never saw a boxer finish off a fight like that, though. Have you? I don't know if Vitor had a any wing chun lessons or not. Certainly never heard that anywhere. But the way he chased Silva down with those punches sure did look like some sort of chain punch attack, didn't it?

[Frost]

I never saw a boxer finish off a fight like that, though. Have you? I don't know if Vitor had a any wing chun lessons or not. Certainly never heard that anywhere. But the way he chased Silva down with those punches sure did look like some sort of chain punch attack, didn't it?

nope it looked like a boxing blast

and dont you think its strange that the only example you can think of of a wing chun type finish to a fight is from a brazilian boxer?

[Syn7]

nope it looked like a boxing blast

and dont you think its strange that the only example you can think of of a wing chun type finish to a fight is from a brazilian boxer?

yeah vitor has a classic boxing style and in the silva fight that was all boxing... no wing chun about it...

[couch]

Just something I've been working on for a bit with some help from my friends...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i24mkN0ybZ8

Maybe it's not the system/the curriculum. Maybe it's the training. Instead of the patty-cake drills, Chi Sau and forms, perhaps there's a better approach. (I'm not saying to get rid of the Chi Sau - just to make it perhaps a smaller portion that it normally is.)

And we don't have to look far for something better. Take the pad-work in boxing for example. There are folks who are using this approach quite well in the WC world.

Heavy bag work. More cardio, body conditioning. Making the training ITSELF more functional.

I don't think WC as a system/approach has to evolve...just the way it's expressed has to.

Peace,
CTK

[KPM]

please that was straight boxing, the only time carlson touched wing chun was to make money years later off seminars

none of his fighters including victor ever trained wing chun

Nite Templar never said Vitor studied Wing Chun. He said his barrage of punches was "wing chun like." You could also say that it was very much like JKD's "straight blast." But I'm sure Vitor never studied JKD either! I think the point is that Vitor used something that worked well for him based on his own training. It just happened to be very "Wing Chun-like", and it wasn't "straight boxing"!

[KPM]

nope it looked like a boxing blast

I've never heard the term "boxing blast", and I've never seen a boxer charge across the ring throwing centerline punches that were the same punch with both arms.

[KPM]

Maybe it's not the system/the curriculum. Maybe it's the training. Instead of the patty-cake drills, Chi Sau and forms, perhaps there's a better approach. (I'm not saying to get rid of the Chi Sau - just to make it perhaps a smaller portion that it normally is.)

And we don't have to look far for something better. Take the pad-work in boxing for example. There are folks who are using this approach quite well in the WC world.

Heavy bag work. More cardio, body conditioning. Making the training ITSELF more functional.

I don't think WC as a system/approach has to evolve...just the way it's expressed has to.

Peace,
CTK

That's exactly what Alan Orr has been doing!

[bennyvt]

I think its like any training program, strength and conditioning, speed and agility, theory and mental drills etc. Do your VT when you train VT and your grappling when you train grappling.
Sparing (hopefully) or fighting (not the same thing) is when this comes togeather. You use the skills you need for that job.
MMA is not a style, its a rule set that tries to favour no style.
When you add stuff to VT its no longer what you learn. Teach the style how its supposed to be taught then go through the differences or changes and each can decide. But the VT needs to be pure so its not just what a few people thought was good. Yip ching said at the VTAA conference he was showing his dad that he did the punch in biu jee different. Yip man asked why ching gave his reasons and he said that was OK for him. He teaches what he learnt off his day but shows them his version.

[Frost]

I've never heard the term "boxing blast", and I've never seen a boxer charge across the ring throwing centerline punches that were the same punch with both arms.

That was a series of crosses thrown on the run, not centre line punches

[KPM]

That was a series of crosses thrown on the run, not centre line punches

I haven't seen the footage in a very long time. You may be right. But, by definition, doesn't a "cross" come from the rear hand? If you are charging at someone with your body pretty much "square on" to him while punching.....which one would be the rear hand?

[YungChun]

Maybe it's not the system/the curriculum. Maybe it's the training. Instead of the patty-cake drills, Chi Sau and forms, perhaps there's a better approach. (I'm not saying to get rid of the Chi Sau - just to make it perhaps a smaller portion that it normally is.)

And we don't have to look far for something better. Take the pad-work in boxing for example. There are folks who are using this approach quite well in the WC world.

Heavy bag work. More cardio, body conditioning. Making the training ITSELF more functional.

Yes taking out ChiSao makes sense if you are going to do boxing instead of VT.. VT is not based on seeing things and hitting through openings you see...

VT is about controlling, breaking him down, issuing force and making those openings, not seeing them...

Good VT training is not about patty cake..

Are most evolving or devolving?