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Thread: What are your favorite WC techniques?

  1. #46
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    Dan Chi sao v uppercut round

    I posted this clip before and someone said that we should try that at a boxing gym. Well, it is in a boxing gym with a former amateur boxer/WC Sifu throwing the punches. There's also a PROFESSIONAL boxer in the background coaching so we keep it real.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4dzw...eature=related
    Notice I teach not to chase hands.
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  2. #47
    Originally Posted by chusauli
    That's why I say, "Let function rule over form" and "Let application be your guide".

    I think its assbackwards when you learn a form and try to "interpret" it. Forms come from application, not vice versa.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sihing73 View Post
    I would need to disagree with this in part: The form should provide the guide or reference for the application. While the application needs to be present, you need a starting point or frame of reference for that application. This reference is found in the form. Much like each writen language has to have a common reference of letters with which to form words. While one needs the words, the alphabet and rules of grammer are necessary in order for the individual letters to be combined in an understandable format to form words, sentences and paragraphs. Our techniques are like the alphabet and our forms are like the sentences and paragraphs which allow them to make sense and be useful and understanable to others, imho.

    I think that as one explores the forms and begins to understand them on a deeper level than one will be able to dsicover new and different applications. Also once one truly understands the form then one can go outside of the box, much like some writers can ignore the rules of grammer and yet compose a bestseller. They are still using the same letters, but have made the expression their own.
    I agree with this entirely. You learn the forms and then you try to interpret what's in the form through application. But forms don't come from application. That assumes that you already know what to apply, and then you make a form out of it. Now that's what I would call assbackwards. How could you already know? You learn the form first, you've probably been given some idea or explanation of how to apply what's in the form, but then it's up to you to try and apply what's in the form and see for yourself what works based upon what happens.
    Last edited by Nite Templar; 02-11-2011 at 11:54 PM.

  3. #48
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    Forms come from application, not vice versa.
    I'm not sure I go along with that either.

    Just about everyone says about the forms and dummy something like "you hardly use any of this the way it looks like you do." Some of the sequences in the forms make no sense from an application POV and if taken literally (if that's the right word) arguably violate other WC principles. And most people do SLT in a stance they say they would never use in a fight.

    If WC forms came from application, IMO someone was smoking too much locoweed at the time.

    IMO the best advice I was given about forms is they give you a vocabulary of techniques for solo practice. Don't try to read too much more into them than that.

    We could discuss (yet again) whether forms have any value or not, but it appears some have felt the mention of the deadly cross kick side kick quan sao knee annihilator combo has "scared off the MMA crowd" or put them all in a trance of introspective crisis, and I wouldn't want to spoil that illusion ..
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  4. #49
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    I agree with the above...


    Form's are just a way of practicing technique, not an application in sight.

  5. #50
    We have gone over issues related to the importance of forms many times before. Not likely to change many minds by debating.

    Forms over time can add layers of skills- one upon another. Of course endless varieties of applications can be operationally discovered in the forms.
    In application against objects or persons motions wont exactly look like their origins in the forms, because you are adjusting the motions to the structures and timings of the person(s) you face.

    Forms. applications and experience are all important in learning wing chun IMO- though wing chun
    is not the only game that is possible.

    joy chaudhuri

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by chusauli View Post
    That's why I say, "Let function rule over form" and "Let application be your guide".

    I think its assbackwards when you learn a form and try to "interpret" it. Forms come from application, not vice versa.
    I would agree with this in regards to other TCMA or Shaolin based forms, but not with Wing Chun imho.

    I also speak and see a lot of teachers out there who use this motto "let function rule over form" & "let application be your guide" and can understand that in the right contaxt ie. you have already mastered your art and are now pursuing a competitive approach to training. But these terms again should not apply to Wing Chun, as we are not JKD or MMA.

    Every form (of the commonly seen 3) is very specific in its intention and purpose. They assist us to build the foundation to our expression. Unlike the SaapYeeSik or Sansau approach many Sifu prefer to use.

    And this thread really was intended for such 'technique' based discussion no? So let's see some names at least of common Wing Chun techniques instead of discussing the purpose of forms

    Looking at the 108, Tan Da is repeated a few times, along with gaan, jut, tok, jum and toi sau so these should be common among us all imho.
    Ti Fei
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  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by anerlich View Post
    We could discuss (yet again) whether forms have any value or not, but it appears some have felt the mention of the deadly cross kick side kick quan sao knee annihilator combo has "scared off the MMA crowd" or put them all in a trance of introspective crisis, and I wouldn't want to spoil that illusion ..
    Not my intention at all. Spoil all you like! I just added to a simple combo that works in any environment, like many more basic Wing Chun techniques imho. So then please share your favourites...
    Ti Fei
    詠春國術

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    I posted this clip before and someone said that we should try that at a boxing gym. Well, it is in a boxing gym with a former amateur boxer/WC Sifu throwing the punches. There's also a PROFESSIONAL boxer in the background coaching so we keep it real.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4dzw...eature=related
    Notice I teach not to chase hands.
    You realize that no boxer leads with a "round punch" or uppercut right?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgMVOTZ2bpk

    Hooks and esp uppercuts are inside tools.

    Let's see even one example of anyone in any actual fighting "blocking" using the same moves.
    Last edited by YungChun; 02-12-2011 at 11:47 PM.
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  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sihing73 View Post
    I would need to disagree with this in part: The form should provide the guide or reference for the application. While the application needs to be present, you need a starting point or frame of reference for that application. This reference is found in the form. Much like each writen language has to have a common reference of letters with which to form words.
    Yes that's right forms are like the alphabet...

    Quote Originally Posted by Sihing73 View Post
    I think that as one explores the forms and begins to understand them on a deeper level than one will be able to dsicover new and different applications.
    But this is backwards for the same reason why skilled authors don't study the alphabet or grammar "more deeply" to learn how to write better books, they write and read to learn how to write better.

    Just like one doesn't study ping pong form to get a deeper understanding of ping pong one plays ping pong to do that.
    Last edited by YungChun; 02-12-2011 at 11:40 PM.
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  10. #55
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    [QUOTE=YungChun;1078086]You realize that no boxer leads with a "round punch" or uppercut right?

    Wrong

  11. #56
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    [QUOTE=GlennR;1078088]
    Quote Originally Posted by YungChun View Post
    You realize that no boxer leads with a "round punch" or uppercut right?

    Wrong
    Very insightful.

    Care to elaborate?

    Are you saying that hooks and esp uppercuts are often outside leads?

    Got clip? Let's see all those outside uppercuts in use!
    Jim Hawkins
    M Y V T K F
    "You should have kicked him in the ball_..."—Sifu

  12. #57
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    [QUOTE=YungChun;1078089]
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Very insightful.

    Care to elaborate?

    Are you saying that hooks and esp uppercuts are often outside leads?

    Got clip? Let's see all those outside uppercuts in use!
    No less insightful than "never leads with..... "

    Watch this hack lead with left hook after left hook.

    Oh, and the scrub he's fighting actually does the same thing at a few points

  13. #58
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    [QUOTE=GlennR;1078090]
    Quote Originally Posted by YungChun View Post

    No less insightful than "never leads with..... "

    Watch this hack lead with left hook after left hook.

    Oh, and the scrub he's fighting actually does the same thing at a few points
    What are you talking about? What scrub? What hack? What is your point?
    Jim Hawkins
    M Y V T K F
    "You should have kicked him in the ball_..."—Sifu

  14. #59
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    [QUOTE=YungChun;1078091]
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post

    What are you talking about? What scrub? What hack? What is your point?
    Sorry, forgoet to paste.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUlL8UyvWnU

  15. #60
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    No uppercuts were thrown from the outside.. Proper hooks are tight and also not thrown from the outside..

    Curvy long round shots are not proper hooks in my book and most boxers will set up hooks and uppercuts and they will normally come from the inside..

    While some boxers might use footwork to get inside to throw a lead hook (Tyson) it will not happen from outside..nor will an uppercut..

    The point is that these tools are mainly inside tools and blocking them is very low %, reaching for any punch will leave you open..
    Last edited by YungChun; 02-13-2011 at 12:27 AM.
    Jim Hawkins
    M Y V T K F
    "You should have kicked him in the ball_..."—Sifu

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