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Thread: Skill vs. Strength/speed

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    How do you teach someone what they "want" to learn?
    You can't.
    One American guy came to a Chinese teacher and wanted to learn

    - Chinese meditation. The Chinese teacher marked a black dot on the wall and asked that American student to sit in front of that wall and looked at that dot for 2 hours in every training section.

    - spear form. The Chinese teacher open a CMA spear book and learned 3 spear moves in the morning and then taught that American student those 3 moves that evening. That teacher didn't end that spear form because there was a flip in that form that the Chinese teacher couldn't do himself.

    Both stroies are true and did happen back in the 70th.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 03-31-2011 at 12:34 PM.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Both stroies are true and did happen back in the 70th.
    You sure are mean to your American students

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by -N- View Post
    You sure are mean to your American students
    That wasn't me.

  4. #94
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    I just wanna answer the original post/poster.

    I'm at a point in my training where I know that being good at something requires maximizing your physical attributes and your skills. Any other perspective is bull****; it's not possible to do one without the other. You can't effectively and efficiently use your attributes if you don't have the skill to do so. You cannot get the most out of your skill training if you are not in shape enough to train it hard, repetitively, and under pressure.
    "In the world of martial arts, respect is often a given. In the real world, it must be earned."

    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand. "--Bertrand Russell

    "Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends of every country save their own. "--Benjamin Disraeli

    "A conservative government is an organised hypocrisy."--Benjamin Disraeli

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Merryprankster View Post
    I just wanna answer the original post/poster.

    I'm at a point in my training where I know that being good at something requires maximizing your physical attributes and your skills. Any other perspective is bull****; it's not possible to do one without the other. You can't effectively and efficiently use your attributes if you don't have the skill to do so. You cannot get the most out of your skill training if you are not in shape enough to train it hard, repetitively, and under pressure.
    What attributes are you talking about? What skills? These statements are too general to argue with.

    What I'm saying is that there are many fighting skills, even whole systems (ie internal systems) that don't require "strength" in the Western sense of the word. And I'd argue that these are superior because they're efficient and they're less likely to gas you out in a protracted fight vs. wasting your energy jumping around or wrestling.

    EO

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Olson View Post
    What attributes are you talking about? What skills? These statements are too general to argue with.

    What I'm saying is that there are many fighting skills, even whole systems (ie internal systems) that don't require "strength" in the Western sense of the word. And I'd argue that these are superior because they're efficient and they're less likely to gas you out in a protracted fight vs. wasting your energy jumping around or wrestling.

    EO
    Lol on the one hand we have an national level competitor in both BJJ and submission grappling who has also fought MMA saying that gasp both physical abilities and skill are needed in fighting and competition

    On the other we have someone spouting the usual internals don’t need strength to make them work and thus are far superior line, but cant show us any proof of this working
    I wonder who we should believe (and I wouldn’t blame Merry at all if he doesn’t post again on this thread)

    Here’s an idea post a clip of YOU in action in a fight that is full contact OR a grappling match in a major competition which lasts a full round where you are using your superior internal arts to not waste energy and beat your opponent…………..

    And yes this is the same tired old argument that I would like to see what you talk about in action before I believe you………………..because I can see what merry and others are talking about in action all the time, where as for some unknown reason you cant provide any proof at all to back up what you are talking about

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Olson View Post
    What attributes are you talking about? What skills? These statements are too general to argue with.

    What I'm saying is that there are many fighting skills, even whole systems (ie internal systems) that don't require "strength" in the Western sense of the word. And I'd argue that these are superior because they're efficient and they're less likely to gas you out in a protracted fight vs. wasting your energy jumping around or wrestling.

    EO
    I really think you need to get out more and experience more, a lot more.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Olson View Post
    What attributes are you talking about? What skills? These statements are too general to argue with.

    What I'm saying is that there are many fighting skills, even whole systems (ie internal systems) that don't require "strength" in the Western sense of the word. And I'd argue that these are superior because they're efficient and they're less likely to gas you out in a protracted fight vs. wasting your energy jumping around or wrestling.

    EO
    I guess you'll have to tell me what you think internal is before this conversation can even begin.
    "In the world of martial arts, respect is often a given. In the real world, it must be earned."

    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand. "--Bertrand Russell

    "Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends of every country save their own. "--Benjamin Disraeli

    "A conservative government is an organised hypocrisy."--Benjamin Disraeli

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    Here’s an idea post a clip of YOU in action in a fight that is full contact OR a grappling match in a major competition which lasts a full round where you are using your superior internal arts to not waste energy and beat your opponent…………..
    Does not necessarily even have to be a competition.

    I would be satisfied with some hard sparring.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R. Brown View Post
    This is not a veiled request for compliments

    The short story is I did 325# for one set of 1 rep.

    1) Does this sound gifted, or just lucky?

  10. #100
    I don't know why, but I find Wenshu's sig pic strangely fascinating. It's like witnessing a train wreck. You don't want to watch because deep down inside you know it's horrible, but, at the same time, you can't take your eyes away from it.

    Good pic choice sir.

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    I don't know why, but I find Wenshu's sig pic strangely fascinating. It's like witnessing a train wreck. You don't want to watch because deep down inside you know it's horrible, but, at the same time, you can't take your eyes away from it.

    Good pic choice sir.
    Agreed.

    Also, the minimum character requirement is lame.
    "In the world of martial arts, respect is often a given. In the real world, it must be earned."

    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand. "--Bertrand Russell

    "Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends of every country save their own. "--Benjamin Disraeli

    "A conservative government is an organised hypocrisy."--Benjamin Disraeli

  12. #102
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    Thanks gentlemen,

    . . I think.

    Honestly, I find that there is no greater representation of what modern wushu is than Johnny Weir.


    Seriously, wushu comps are like those horrible toddler beauty pageants.

    They all make that face, uhhhhhhh, pageant face. Gives me the creeps.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R. Brown View Post
    This is not a veiled request for compliments

    The short story is I did 325# for one set of 1 rep.

    1) Does this sound gifted, or just lucky?

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Olson View Post
    What attributes are you talking about? What skills? These statements are too general to argue with.

    What I'm saying is that there are many fighting skills, even whole systems (ie internal systems) that don't require "strength" in the Western sense of the word. And I'd argue that these are superior because they're efficient and they're less likely to gas you out in a protracted fight vs. wasting your energy jumping around or wrestling.

    EO
    BJJ is an "internal" art. It's more about leverage, relaxation, position, and balance than strength and power. But, if you aren't in shape, you're still going to lose.
    He most honors my style who learns under it to destroy the teacher. -- Walt Whitman

    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    As a mod, I don't have to explain myself to you.

  14. #104
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    Who didn't think that figure skating would become a top sport for flaming gay males?

    who?



    p.s wushu kind of looks the same when it comes to the boys.

    the chub larper representing trad...sadly, that is not far off the mark in many cases either.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  15. #105
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    Eric -

    Don't be evasive.

    You are saying you don't require strength to defeat an opponent.
    I think you are not understanding the concept behind efficient kinetics as is expounded in "internal" martial arts training.

    I don't think people understand it without doing "external" martial arts.

    You cannot understand dark without knowing light, you cannot understand the sky without knowing the ground and so on, so it makes sense that you cannot comprehend the soft without feeling the hard.

    So, pairing down power to use only that which optimizes function is indeed a course of practice in martial arts. It is not the begin point though and it takes people a long time to relax in their movement and striking etc.

    Furthermore, it is my opinion that if you start your martial arts journey with a so called internal martial art, you will NEVER get any good at martial arts. Ever. You will never gain the required understanding of combat and confrontation and you will poison your mind with fallacy and delusion as you try to become weaker and weaker. lol
    Kung Fu is good for you.

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