Dit Da Jow questions

[MrOneEyedBoh]

From looking around and doing research on these subjects, I have been continuously reverted back to this site. So why not join?

What Im after is a Jow that is used for Iron palm. So it would be for conditioning, strengthening, opening channels, and promoting blood flow and energy.

What Im going to do is get a more advanced formula ( Most likely Ku Yu Cheong Jow , the full version ) and let it sit for a while. I know they pretty much reach their max potential within 6 mths, but why not let it sit a bit longer? While that Jow is being extracted/set up, Id like to get one that is pre-made for the time being.

I know about Plum Dragon and Coiling Dragon, and I have been in contact with them via e-mail. They have both been of much help, and being very patient with me. What I'd like to know is what would the other guys recommend for a beginner's Jow that is already pre-made and ready to roll ( from an online vendor ). I'd like to use this for now ( the beginning stages ) and in case if ( also to replace for the time being ) I ever get any type of cut on my hands while Im using a Jow with any toxic herbs in it.

Lastly, if you have any more advanced Jow formulations that you would like to share with me, post em up.

Thanks!

edit: In the Ku Yu Cheong Jow, I see that there is the following:

Bai Hua She
Tu Bie Chong
Wu Ling Zhi

I was wondering how these should be prepared? Just coarsely grind them with a mortar and pestle? Cut them up a bit?

And I know for all of the other herbs, they should just be coarsely ground.

[Brule]

I think you have contacted two respected people in the field of jow and iron palm, so i'm not sure what else you're seeking. I would presume that most here would recommend them anyway.

[JamesC]

Like Brule said, we're all going to recommend one or the other.

I have experience with Dale's IP jow. His jow works the best of any i've used and he's always more than happy to answer any questions you might have in relation to either Bagua or Traditional Chinese Medicine.

Even if his jow WASN'T the best I have used(although it definitely IS) the entire experience of dealing with a knowledgeable TCM doctor, Bagua instructor, and all-around nice guy is more than worth the small price of his herbs.

[MrOneEyedBoh]

Yeah thats what I figured. Well thanks!

[WhiteTiger666]

Hi Every1,


what are your thoughts regarding heating of alcohol b4 adding dit da jow herb pack to it?

I know some guys say it is ok and helps speed the process and others are against it saying that the herbs get messed up and the jow is not as good.

what are your guys thought about it, im just curious.

[Ben Gash]

My Sifu always taught me that cooked jow was the best, but it was somewhat impractical as it makes your house smell for weeks.

[David Jamieson]

The key to good infusion is how finely you grind your herbs. And how long you let them infuse.

Cooking anything will reduce and make stronger the efficacy but it also reduce content.

Alcohol is the vehicle for carrying the herbs into the skin, I wouldn't cook too much of it off.

If you want to use it sooner, a little cook can't hurt. If you have time, just let the process take place organically.

[PlumDragon]

Theres nothing wrong with heating the alcohol before adding it to the herbs. This is not strictly speaking, "cooking the herbs" but it does help to jumpstart the aging process and should not damage any of the more volatile herbs which might be damaged from a more thorough cooking process.

Cooking anything will reduce and make stronger the efficacy but it also reduce content

For what its worth, the original poster isnt referring to cooking, rather just heating the alcohol before adding it to the herbs. This will not cause any reduction to occur.

[Dale Dugas]

There is a supposed "grandmaster" claiming to have Chinese Herbal Medicine training who teaches people to boil their herbs in alcohol for 2 hours. This would destroy all the volatile oils which many herbs contain and render them useless.

This is something you do not want to do for any reason what so ever.

Heating alcohol up is very very dangerous.

You do not EVER bring 20% or higher alcohol content to a boil no matter who is telling you. If you are using a gas stove and heat high proof alcohol you are going to blow up the kitchen, start a serious fire, and maybe get seriously burned in the process.

Many people will boil water and after it comes to a boil place their alcohol containers into the water with any caps off to ensure the pressure will not cause the containers to explode. This hot solvent will then do its work.

When you grind up the herbs and help break down the cell walls in the herbs, adding this to hot booze makes for more surface area on the herbs able to release their active components to the solution of the heated solvent.

Cold soaking is considered foundational and creates decent liniments.

Heating your alcohol will create something a little stronger.

I cook my liniments over 1-2 day process.

Certain herbs are added, certain cooking times are used for the various herbs.

The outcome is something much more complex than mere cold soaking. I can create almost a different formula when cooking one recipe and cold soaking the same herbs.

Let me know how I can be of service.

[WhiteTiger666]

Thanks guys for your input it shed some "light" on the topic. I do respect both Josh and Dale's opinion and have purchased product from both of you and am satisfied with what I got from you both. Dale you are really good guy in my book. Josh you are 2 both very generous and knowledgable.

Some guy tried to tell me I messed up a Hung gar formula he made me by heating it up and using whiskey instead of Gin. I really felt the guy didn't know what he was talking about although he has knowledge. The real issue i had is that the jow he advertised was pictured very dark color but when I made it it came out more brownish in color. One of Sifu Kong's guys, I felt he gave a bad name to his Sifu for being arrogant.

Ya know when I really think of it there are always different opinions and thats what makes up Ying/Yang energy so there really is no one way. We can see how this is playing out in the political arena in the world today bigtime. One side pushes left and the right counters. end of story.

[Dale Dugas]

I am always happy to assist others who are interested in acquiring and using Chinese herbs for their martial arts training.

Let me know how I can be of service to you and yours.

[mickey]

Greetings,

I have actually done the reverse. Steam the herbs, place in jar and then add the wine. It allows for greater penetration. The jow darkens much faster this way and is much stronger.

mickey

[Dale Dugas]

Mickey,

Basically the same concept. Using heat the break down the cell walls of the herbs to help facilitate more active components in your final solution.

I know a local Dit Da teacher who steams his herbs 12 times, and dries them before making his Dit Da Jow.

Many roads but we all get a similar destination. good liniments.

[mickey]

Greetings,

Yes, in a way it is similar. I dare say that it is safer and more effective.

The original poster was given a suggestion that reminded me of some mean spirited advice that went, "The best way to sharpen a knife is on your tongue."


mickey

[TenTigers]

has anyone heard of "frying" the herbs first? Meaning, in a dry pan, rather than steamed or heat-soaked?
I would think that this would do the opposite of releasing the herb, but searing them, as you would first sear meat before braising, sealing in the properties.

White Tiger-I know of one herbalist in Chinatown that uses Johnny Walker black for his jow.
I have this image of a Monk in the Siu-Lum Temple..
"Oh no, we are low on Dit Da Jow! Kwai-Chang! Get on your horse and ride to Scotland!!"

Along the same line,one of my old Sifus has always insisted on Tanguery-which I think is not necessary as it is being applied topically and not ingested. Any store-bought gin/vodka/spirits of 60 proof+ would suffice.
You could use Fred's Gin and save the money.
I went the traditional way and bought Sam Jing Jow (Triple distilled liquor) which worked fine. I will however use gin next time, as the juniper berries have a soothing effect on the skin, and it's more aromatic. Also easier to get. Bottles and Cases is around the block, Mark's Liquor store on Mott Street is an hour away.
Oh, and I have a rewards card!