Why is there not a single WC fighter, anywhere!!!!!!!!!

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

not twisting words asking for specific reasons why and how it was set up to aid BJJ guys, simple question, was it the rules, equip used, fighters invited, venue...

i mean you must have a reason other than saying because it allowed shock horror grappling to take place right?

thats like me saying it was set up to aid strikers because it started standing and allowed nearly unlimited stirkes...

Obtuse comes to mind... it was created by a Gracie.

**Frost** · 05-21-2011, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

Obtuse comes to mind... it was created by a Gracie.

so thats your whole arguement........seriously thats all you can come up with....

nice to see you put some thought into it

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

so thats your whole arguement........seriously thats all you can come up with....

nice to see you put some thought into it

Who's arguing ? oh yeah YOU. I tried to give you a raison d'etre for the UFC , take it or leave it I'm not trying to convert you

**Frost** · 05-21-2011, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

Who's arguing ? oh yeah YOU. I tried to give you a raison d'etre for the UFC , take it or leave it I'm not trying to convert you

you stated something but then couldnt back it up...but ill leave it there and simply ask you a question,

you are from the WSL lineage through philip bayer correct, thats how you judge clips when you see people fighting and say it is or it not wing chun...would that be correct to say?

Now on this thread you have said at least once the wing chun guys opponent looked more wing chun like than the chunner so could you post some clips of your students or bayers in action so we can see what you mean?

I know you dont train your guys for MMA but WSL was known for testing his skills in fights and comps, and since you are all so proud to be associated with him surely some of his students carry on that tradition (i know you fight ond test yourself on the street but what about the rest of the association? your students?)

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

you stated something but then couldnt back it up...but ill leave it there and simply ask you a question,

you are from the WSL lineage through philip bayer correct, thats how you judge clips when you see people fighting and say it is or it not wing chun...would that be correct to say?

Now on this thread you have said at least once the wing chun guys opponent looked more wing chun like than the chunner so could you post some clips of your students or bayers in action so we can see what you mean?

I know you dont train your guys for MMA but WSL was known for testing his skills in fights and comps, and since you are all so proud to be associated with him surely some of his students carry on that tradition (i know you fight ond test yourself on the street but what about the rest of the association? your students?)

I have posted clips, but guys see what they want, sorry. What did I state that I couldnt back up ?
If I see mechanics in a guy then whats wrong with saying so ? it may not be 100% what we are doing but its fighting with fists and motion, timing, balance, etc...not a style.

Who's 'we' ? you your mates, I dont care if YOU believe me or not. I reckon you will just perpetuate your agenda, whatever that is.

Like you said I have tested my thing often and its strong. If you don't think my punch will break a jaw, and need a clip to prove it, sorry.

**Frost** · 05-21-2011, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

i have posted clips, but guys see what they want, sorry. What did I state that I couldnt back up ?

what sparring full contact clips...not drills? can you tell me which threads these are on

you stated the ufc was set upin the Gracies favour...but cant back this up by saying how other than they had a hand in its creation

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

what sparring full contact clips...not drills? can you tell me which threads these are on

you stated the ufc was set upin the Gracies favour...but cant back this up by saying how other than they had a hand in its creation

Drills, no full contact sorry, there are some with gloves but its pretty much exactly the same, but with face masks and gloves.

Wait.... you have the info that Gracie started the UFC , started the UFC , started the UFC, and dont see the connection yet

You're kidding me....a fight program that allows ground and submission started by guys with years of experience. Then asking random guys to come in and strike anyway that doesnt matter to them becasue they have BJJ in a ring with time and space to work the guard....you dont see that ?

**Frost** · 05-21-2011, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

Drills, no full contact sorry, there are some with gloves but its pretty much exactly the same, but with face masks and gloves.

Wait.... you have the info that Gracie started the UFC , started the UFC , started the UFC, and dont see the connection yet

You're kidding me....a fight program that allows ground and submission started by guys with years of experience. Then asking random guys to come in and strike anyway that doesnt matter to them becasue they have BJJ in a ring with time and space to work the guard....you dont see that ?

it also allows striking with near unlimited rules, only rules were no eye shots, it even allowed deadly groin shots...........they invited strikers as well not just random ones they invited a lot of good fighters, the likes of ernesto hoost, karelin etc were all asked, the ring was somthing like 30 feet plenty of room for strikers to run away

so your basic arguement is that because it allowed stand up clinch and ground it was biased against strikers and unfair to them

**goju** · 05-21-2011, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

what sparring full contact clips...not drills? can you tell me which threads these are on

you stated the ufc was set upin the Gracies favour...but cant back this up by saying how other than they had a hand in its creation

Oh come on man hes right.You mean to tell me they couldn't have found better grapplers and strikers at that time? The fact they avoided guys like dolman proves it. It was slanted in their favor so they could market their product and then leave once they hooked enough people just as Frank Shamrock said.

Granted it doesn't take away that they proved something .That something being that if you don't have a ground game your screwed.But when ones market a product by showing its effectiveness against against a similar product the idea is to test it against a product that is highly regarded not one that is of inferior quality.

And the Gracies intentionally did the latter. It looked like a tough man competition when instead they could have intentionally tried to rope in better opponents to genuinely test their product to its fullest.

**Frost** · 05-21-2011, 04:43 PM

Originally Posted by goju

Oh come on man hes right.You mean to tell me they couldn't have found better grapplers and strikers at that time? The fact they avoided guys like dolman proves it. It was slanted in their favor so they could market their product and then leave once they hooked enough people just as Frank Shamrock said.

Granted it doesn't take away that they proved something .That something being that if you don't have a ground game your screwed.But when ones market a product by showing its effectiveness against against a similar product the idea is to test it against a product that is highly regarded not one that is of inferior quality.

And the Gracies intentionally did the latter. It looked like a tough man competition when instead they could have intentionally tried to rope in better opponents to genuinely test their product to its fullest.

oh please doleman again....they are on record as having asked ernesto hoost to take part, and karelin, neither accepted and you think they were scared of doleman? They invited the greasted wrestler of all time and the greatest thai guy around, fact is they asked lots of guys, not too many wanted to fight no rules

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 04:48 PM

Nobody is taking away what they proved

.

**GlennR** · 05-21-2011, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

you dont ? please explain why it wouldnt be ...then we can see your thinking.

Structure, footwork, shoulder turning and punches.

I see a guy (a very good guy by the way) coming forward with straight punches, thats it.

Doesnt make it WC

**GlennR** · 05-21-2011, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by k gledhill

Guys want to see tansao punches to make it VT or a pose....

No, i want to see WC structure in their delivery. I see that in Alan Orrs guys.

Thats what defines a WC fighter to me.

**goju** · 05-21-2011, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by Frost

oh please doleman again....they are on record as having asked ernesto hoost to take part, and karelin, neither accepted and you think they were scared of doleman? They invited the greasted wrestler of all time and the greatest thai guy around, fact is they asked lots of guys, not too many wanted to fight no rules

Do we have any evidence of this besides what came out of the gracies mouths? They are known for their tall tales after all

**k gledhill** · 05-21-2011, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by GlennR

Structure, footwork, shoulder turning and punches.

I see a guy (a very good guy by the way) coming forward with straight punches, thats it.

Doesnt make it WC

Okay, what would ?

Thread: Why is there not a single WC fighter, anywhere!!!!!!!!!

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