Clip: Chen Style power generation demos

[Golden Arms]

A thread in the Wing Chun forum reminded me of these videos, fortunately they are still out there. I am not a Tai Chi guy but I felt these do a good job of showing some of the potential in the Chen style power methods. Thoughts?

http://youtu.be/pWBBhVLbDgk

http://youtu.be/eIc5NIfrnJs

[YouKnowWho]

Chen Taiji is famous in "short" Jin generation. The wrestling requires "long" Jin to work. The word "power generation" doesn't fit quite well in the wrestling world. The wrestling will require many Jins to be combined into a perfect circle. It's different from the power generation in the striking world. Chen Taiji tries to cross that bountary between the striking world and the wrestling world. Some principles that fit in one world may not work well in the other.

The Chen Taiji push hand has the wrestling arms and wrestling body but don't have the wrestling legs. If you give your opponent too much freedom on his legs, your throws will have less chance to work.

These 2 clips are much better than the average push hand. May be because the ruleset doesn't allow them to use legs make the wrestling match look "untural".

[Mulong]

Chen Bing is demonstrating good shu/ 术(method/technique); however, we should take into account Chenshi tuishou (Chen style push-hands) borders with shuaijiao (throwing-down, angle); therefore, the use of li/ 力(force/external energy) is intermixed with jin/ 劲(energy/internal energy) to execute the throws.

[YouKnowWho]

The short Jin may be good in push hand but not suitable for throw. In the following clip, you can see that the "long Jin (contact and sticky)" is used in the throw and not the short Jin (contact and separate).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ptr3sLWXVY

The reason is simple. It takes many Jins to complete the "circle" of a throw. The short Jin just doesn't work well for that connection. In the folllowing throw, it taks 4 different long Jins to complete that throwing circle. It can't be broken between each Jins.

冲(Chong) - 1st quarter of the circle, you use your left shin bone to run into your opponent's right leg.
掺(Can) - 2nd quarter of the circle, you use your right arm under your opponent's right armpit to pull his body to your right.
踢(Ti) - 3rd quarter of the circle, you use right leg to sweep your opponent's left leg.
亮(Liang) - 4th quarter of the circle, you spin your body, turn your face, and "smoothly" guide your opponent all the way down to the ground.

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/4...wprinciple.jpg

[Hebrew Hammer]

I love those vids of Chen Bing...they've been around a while but he generates great torque, power, and explosiveness for his size. That guy he's wrestling with has a good sixty pounds on him and he flings him like a rag doll.

[XiaoPang]

He makes a spiral to the triangle point. Formerly Chen style videos only showed the shoulders and hand motions, now they are showing more and more openly which is good for martial and shadowboxing together.

[Eric Olson]

What say you doubters of the internal?

EO

[iunojupiter]

Looked like external physical manipulation to me... I didn't see any Chi Balls or Chi Lightning...

[Eric Olson]

Looked like external physical manipulation to me... I didn't see any Chi Balls or Chi Lightning...

People need to learn to distinguish between the internal and the paranormal

EO

[iunojupiter]

I just have a personal dislike of the terms internal/external... and I was being sarcastic.

[Eric Olson]

FYI, just so people know what they're seeing. He "floats" the opponent and then uses short power to knock him into the ground. Awesome!

Eric

[SPJ]

Chen Taiji is famous in "short" Jin generation. The wrestling requires "long" Jin to work. The word "power generation" doesn't fit quite well in the wrestling world. The wrestling will require many Jins to be combined into a perfect circle. It's different from the power generation in the striking world. Chen Taiji tries to cross that bountary between the striking world and the wrestling world. Some principles that fit in one world may not work well in the other.

The Chen Taiji push hand has the wrestling arms and wrestling body but don't have the wrestling legs. If you give your opponent too much freedom on his legs, your throws will have less chance to work.

These 2 clips are much better than the average push hand. May be because the ruleset doesn't allow them to use legs make the wrestling match look "untural".

agreed.

"shudder" or vibrating power or zhan dou jin is developed from focus joint to whole body shaking in tai ji.

it serves 2 functions

1 to shake off holding and destable the opponent

2 to strike. it can be in the begining, in the middle or in the end of power generation

that is it can be used to generate, transfer and release/end of the power.

[SPJ]

for internal vs external argument

zhan dou or tan dou jin

it all starts from rotation in the dan tian, and outward

it is torque and not moving from left to righ or right to left

it comes from internal and expresses as external

both exist and not one without the other.

[faxiapreta]

What say you doubters of the internal?

EO

Looked like his "opponent" was simply "going with the flow" and not offering any kind of counter-resistance against the throws.

Use your brains people. If someone really was able to throw a grappler around like that, it would make much more sense (and would happen regularly) to enter a high level greco-roman tourney and throw some real grapplers around.

[KC Elbows]

Looked like his "opponent" was simply "going with the flow" and not offering any kind of counter-resistance against the throws.

Use your brains people. If someone really was able to throw a grappler around like that, it would make much more sense (and would happen regularly) to enter a high level greco-roman tourney and throw some real grapplers around.

Those same two throws are used in judo.