When and how long have you done iron hand?

[faxiapreta]

Einstein, using a caustic substance is not the only way to cause degeneration of bone, it could be due to calcium leaching from the bones. Certain steroids cause this as well. I am guessing that whatever herbs combined with the vinegar-which is known to affect calcium in bones, had that effect.
BTW-the breaks of my fingers were not from any IP training itself, but occurred during sparring. The brittleness was attributed to the jow formula.

You are the one who said it was caustic:

um, ok, so read, stupid
Using the wrong jow incorrectly made my bones brittle.
It was a very caustic, black vinegar based jow that was only supposed to be used sparingly, during final phases of training.
I soaked my hands in it three times a day in the beginning of my training.

But, OK, I'll go by what you are saying. It leeched calcium from your bones.

Of course, this does beg the question:

Why would someone put a substance on his hands that leeches calcium from the bones and is absorbed through the skin into the bones, when he is trying to do the opposite... increase the calcium in the bone structure?

Speaking of Einsteins, don't you guys think this stuff through?

[TenTigers]

You are the one who said it was caustic:



But, OK, I'll go by what you are saying. It leeched calcium from your bones.

Of course, this does beg the question:

Why would someone put a substance on his hands that leeches calcium from the bones and is absorbed through the skin into the bones, when he is trying to do the opposite... increase the calcium in the bone structure?

Speaking of Einsteins, don't you guys think this stuff through?

the vinegar was caustic to the skin, it broke out in white blisters. Vinegar is acetic acid. This happened when I wasn't patient enough to let the jow age enough-according to my Sifu.
Obviously, I was not aware at the time that there would be any damage.

[KC Elbows]

One more time.

You have forced the closing of one of the five ip threads up now. If you want to discuss points that come up in the thread, but aren't the main topic, you may start a new thread of your own. If you choose to derail each thread, you'll probably get banned.

When and how long have you done iron hand. That's the topic.

[faxiapreta]

Fair enough.

However, you start to troll me again with your b.s. insulting crap and I'll be all over every thread you start or post in.

[KC Elbows]

Fair enough.

However, you start to troll me again with your b.s. insulting crap and I'll be all over every thread you start or post in.

Which is the only bannable offense I'm aware of here. Good luck with that.

[teetsao]

i have been training in the skill of iron palm for 5 years this coming oct.
my bro. and i started off on our own using books and videos for the first year and made great progress. we got help from some people such as robert miller,dale dugas,jim lacy ans the rizzo bro. we filltered through what was real and what was b.s.
then we met our teacher ,rick pickens and got the real deal and he fixed a couple things then we made progress by leaps and bounds.you can see this in our videos fro breaking 1 and 2 ,2x8x16s to breaking 3,a 4"blok,a 4"and 2" unspaced,in air breaks,against the wall,coconuts(ground,hand and on the string)
our teacher said we would have gotten there eventually as we were good at filtering and at reasoning,but he showed us some twists to speeds up progress and it shows.
we knw for a fact that i.p. training has made the difference in our power generation.not just hitting our hand but real iron palm training which is more than just hitting a bag.
we use real lineage based dit da jow and that also makes a difference. it helps to heal and strengthen the bones and surrounding tissues f the hand at a faster rate. wolffes law in full effect,the jow helps to speed the healing process and protects the hands into the future.
there is no doubt iron palm training works to give you the desired effect. stronger hands and arms and a more effective tool on the end of a strike.

[ginosifu]

I have been doing IP for over 15 years. I started out using Wing Lam's Jow (You can buy it on the web). After a couple of years I started researching TCM and Herbal Jow Recipies. Eventually I started making my own jow and I have had no problems / No weak bones / bone loss etc etc.

There is no evidence that jow is bad. Modern medicine does not except TCM theories so they say it must be bad for you. Just because modern medicine does not believe in TCM does not mean that it does not work. There is no real proof that a properly made jow is bad for you.

ginosifu

[B.Tunks]

Makiwara as a kid, sand bag and iron palm/fist training on and off for many years since (various methods). Last high intensity period of practice was daily for 2 years (minimum 1000 strikes) - apart from periods when I was travelling for work, and I still managed to break both my thumbs whilst fighting (avulsion fractures caused by hitting a skull and an elbow respectively ) during that particular period. I also broke a few knuckles, the same metacarpal twice, had multiple finger and thumb dislocations and related ligament damage and squashed an interphalangeal joint from both fighting and rugby league throughout the total period of conditioning (approx 88-08). And before anyone says that the methods I used were wrong, I used several in order to compare results. I agree that it is a useful method of tempering and a valuable cultural treasure worthy of preserving but I do not necessarily agree that it is a particularly 'sensible' practice when analysed objectively, especially since there are far easier ways to increase striking effectiveness. Having said that, personally I like the practice and will most likely do some form of it again. It depends what you're after and there are certain benefits from this kind of training that you would be very hard pressed to obtain in any other way. Who knows how badly I would have mangled my hands without it?

If we're talking about fighting effectiveness though, its certainly a lot easier to just concentrate on developing punching power with more conventional methods rather than to concentrate on hardening the striking surfaces. In that respect I agree with faixapreta. However when you get someone like Sanjuro who does it the way it's supposed to be done (as pointed by Bawang - the way its always supposed to have been done) by combining both methods, then you have quite a weapon. As far as rupturing internal organs etc though, that is largely bullsh.it. Also, no matter how you look at it cracking coconuts and other inanimate objects is largely parlour trickery and simple physics. Of course most of you guys already know this but I think your dislike of the reincarnated knifefighter may be tainting the argument.

BT

[faxiapreta]

I have been doing IP for over 15 years. I started out using Wing Lam's Jow (You can buy it on the web). After a couple of years I started researching TCM and Herbal Jow Recipies. Eventually I started making my own jow and I have had no problems / No weak bones / bone loss etc etc.

There is no evidence that jow is bad. Modern medicine does not except TCM theories so they say it must be bad for you. Just because modern medicine does not believe in TCM does not mean that it does not work. There is no real proof that a properly made jow is bad for you.

ginosifu

I'm pretty sure most of the "bad" talk comes from the CMA crowd

Western medicine is pretty much of the opinion that it doesn't do anything one way or the other.

[B.Tunks]

we knw for a fact that i.p. training has made the difference in our power generation.

Power generation in striking has nothing to do with the hands. I would agree that you may have possibly hardened your hands to a degree but that has nothing to do with the generation of power.

[B.Tunks]

I'm pretty sure most of the "bad" talk comes from the CMA crowd

Western medicine is pretty much of the opinion that it doesn't do anything one way or the other.

Western medicine at least agrees on it's analgesic effect.

[David Jamieson]

Einstein, using a caustic substance is not the only way to cause degeneration of bone, it could be due to calcium leaching from the bones. Certain steroids cause this as well. I am guessing that whatever herbs combined with the vinegar-which is known to affect calcium in bones, had that effect.
BTW-the breaks of my fingers were not from any IP training itself, but occurred during sparring. The brittleness was attributed to the jow formula.

[David Jamieson]

[faxiapreta]

..

David Jamieson is on your ignore list because he is a clueless fairy who does nothing but disrupt threads with meaningless drivel and made up cr@p from his make-believe training.

[David Jamieson]

David Jamieson is on your ignore list because he is a clueless fairy who does nothing but disrupt threads with meaningless drivel and made up cr@p from his make-believe training.