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Thread: When and how long have you done iron hand?

  1. #46
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    in real iron palm training,yes it does increase striking power.as real kung fu practitioners such as sifu gino know,iron palm is not just hitting a bag with a certain medium and applying jow. there is much more to it than that.
    as far as jow and science goes,i think there are some studies as to its effectiveness.if i can figure out how to pic off my phone i will show effectiveness firsthand.my aunt fel and bruised herself badly. i applied jow and 36 hr later most were gone and the rest had faded tremendously. i dont need some scientist to tell me if something works when i have experienced it. it wouldnt have been used by,monks warriors and emporers alike for 100s of years if it had no efficacy.

  2. #47
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    ooh,and the breaking of solid objects such as bricks and coconuts ,is not parlor tricks.if you think so try it,please. please try it and film it,please try.
    now that being said,there are fakers,as in everything,but legitimate breaking is real and it ain't easy.
    but i am preaching to the choir on this one.
    this is a kung fu forum about kung fu skills,we do not need to make beleivers of anyone that comes at us like jacka$$es. instead the burden of proof is on them. prove it doesnt work. prove iron palm is fraudulent,prove jow doesnt work,prove breaking bricks unspaced and coconuts especially on the string is easy.thenn prove it has not merit. the burden of proof is on you not us,you are on OUR boards,we are not on yours.

  3. #48
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    There is a relaxed striking power involved and it is multi directional, not only downwards.

    A boxer does indeed develop relaxed power and learns the structures that suit his attacks and defenses.

    Iron Palm is a two way function. It protects the hand from damage and it allows for repeated use of the relaxed striking. The jins can change. The palms can change. Even fists can be used. The arm bones benefit from the vibration. Wrist joints thicken.

    The thickening of wrist joints also happens with boxers from repeated striking at bags, et al.

    Iron Palm™ is useful for kung fu practitioners because of a wider array of striking hand forms. Not all fists, in other words. Palm strikes with bare hands, from a relaxed structure, repeatedly, is something an iron palm practitioner can do.

    Iron Palm is supplemental to fighting systems by the way. It is not a fighting system unto itself. It's favoured by those styles that use the conditioned surfaces.

    Not all IP™ is carried out in the same way. In some ways, different parts of the hand receive more conditioning because they are the chosen striking surface.

    This is sometimes reflected in the forms of the styles that use IP™ as a supplement to their style. Much like a boxer uses bag work or a kung fu guy would use a dummy or a karate guy would use a makawari etc etc.

    IP™ is not hard to learn or hard to do. It's the doing of it that takes time and patience and medicine.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  4. #49
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    [QUOTE=teetsao;1104032]in real iron palm training,yes it does increase striking power.QUOTE]

    If you're talking about striking 'power', I think you mean force (F=ma). Hand strength/hardness does not come into the equation. As has already been correctly pointed out, you may increase the strength of the hand in order to successfully cope with the delivery of a more powerful strike but on it's own, that conditioning will not result in more power.

  5. #50
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    (F=ma)

    mass

    accelerating.


    Is this mass dense? or soft?
    Is it spinning? Or traveling straight?

    mass.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by teetsao View Post
    ooh,and the breaking of solid objects such as bricks and coconuts ,is not parlor tricks.if you think so try it,please. please try it and film it,please try.
    now that being said,there are fakers,as in everything,but legitimate breaking is real and it ain't easy.
    but i am preaching to the choir on this one.
    this is a kung fu forum about kung fu skills,we do not need to make beleivers of anyone that comes at us like jacka$$es. instead the burden of proof is on them. prove it doesnt work. prove iron palm is fraudulent,prove jow doesnt work,prove breaking bricks unspaced and coconuts especially on the string is easy.thenn prove it has not merit. the burden of proof is on you not us,you are on OUR boards,we are not on yours.
    I have broken lots of stuff. I used to break bricks over my head too. I stopped because it's useless (and in the case of head breaks, dangerous in the long term). I didn't say it was easy at all, I said it was largely parlour trickery and simple physics. You don't even need I.P practice to sucessfully break, for those exact reasons. I respect the skill and dedication it takes to break unspaced blocks etc but personally I believe it's a waste of time as far as fighting application. The practice of breaking was born largely from the tradition of the travelling kungfu medicine salesman/marketplace performer. The true aim of iron palm training is not to smash bricks and coconuts. If all you're doing is conditioning for breaks then it's not martial at all. In fact if you are not hitting people with your I.P then why bother? Apart from the sideshow people mentioned above, those who trained I.P in the old days did it with the intention of killing or maiming people.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.Tunks View Post
    I respect the skill and dedication it takes to break unspaced blocks etc but personally I believe it's a waste of time as far as fighting application. The practice of breaking was born largely from the tradition of the travelling kungfu medicine salesman/marketplace performer. The true aim of iron palm training is not to smash bricks and coconuts. If all you're doing is conditioning for breaks then it's not martial at all. In fact if you are not hitting people with your I.P then why bother? Apart from the sideshow people mentioned above, those who trained I.P in the old days did it with the intention of killing or maiming people.
    Brendan,
    This has always been my take on the subject.

    All,
    As I mentioned in the other thread, I think one of the valuable benefits of IP is the ability to express the concussive force that is learned through training IP. It is a very different type of force than the blunt force trauma type of striking. I rarely strike others with my fist, since a simple palm strike done correctly has convinced others that they no longer want to pursue a fight with me.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

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  8. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by mooyingmantis View Post
    Brendan,
    This has always been my take on the subject.

    All,
    As I mentioned in the other thread, I think one of the valuable benefits of IP is the ability to express the concussive force that is learned through training IP. It is a very different type of force than the blunt force trauma type of striking. I rarely strike others with my fist, since a simple palm strike done correctly has convinced others that they no longer want to pursue a fight with me.
    There is a reason that thousands of bare-handed fighters fought with closed fists instead of open hands. Experience quickly taught them which was more effective.

  9. #54
    March 20008-present.

    (1 year off in 2009 for broken neck from shuai chiao class).

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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RD'S Alias - 1A

    I have easily beaten every one I have ever fought.....

  10. #55
    Are you the Royal Dragon?

    He was on here when I was lurking, but then got banned for no reason.



    his memory remains.


    There was also a man...he was named rolls. He has another name which is Bawang.

    He fought Shaolin Tiger and they became friends. Where is shoalin tiger?

    He went away like the others to the other side.

    Sifu Abel was the famous, until he fought a beginner and got beaten up, hugged a man on his knees and then talked crap online. Then he dissipated like the vapors in a public toilet.

    Knifefighter was a great South African, I used to rub myself thinking of his gruff ways.

  11. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Razaunida View Post
    Are you the Royal Dragon?

    He was on here when I was lurking, but then got banned for no reason.



    his memory remains.


    There was also a man...he was named rolls. He has another name which is Bawang.

    He fought Shaolin Tiger and they became friends. Where is shoalin tiger?

    He went away like the others to the other side.

    Sifu Abel was the famous, until he fought a beginner and got beaten up, hugged a man on his knees and then talked crap online. Then he dissipated like the vapors in a public toilet.

    Knifefighter was a great South African, I used to rub myself thinking of his gruff ways.


    Me? No.

    I just thought his quote was funny...
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RD'S Alias - 1A

    I have easily beaten every one I have ever fought.....

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC Elbows View Post
    Me: back in '87-92 did a bad version, '95 did a better version, aside form bag wok(gloved and otherwise), don't do it much now, probably will again sometime.
    Did it during my southern days for several years alongside iron body training using wing lams stuff and then my masters jow, stopped and don’t see the point anymore to be honest. I only met one sifu who impressed me with his heavy hands and arms that felt dense and heavy, but how much of that came from his hakka and southern iron practice and how much can from being a sports physio using his hands every day is any ones guess

    For me personally I cant see the point these days of training it, its questionable how useful it ever was, questionable if it had an adverse effect into old age on the people doing it, finding good medicine is hard (see this thread and the countless others about frauds in the arts, god knows what they put in their medicines) and the risk reward is these days not worth it for me at any rate, I mean im not looking to kill someone with my hands, when I spar gloves are fine, I hit the bag barehanded to ensure they are toughened should I need to hit on the street but what more do you need? The hardest hitters I know are the pros I have trained with, some have broken hands in the ring wearing gloves some haven’t, a fair few have had more than there fair share of streets fights (MMA and thai does not pay that well in the UK and a lot have worked the doors security etc) and I have heard a lot of stories of bare knuckle knockouts on the street, not too many have talked about breaking hands and that’s without jows and iron hand training

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    ive been lazy and havent done iron palm. im mostly doing squats
    squats arent lazy...hope you are using weight for them

  14. #59
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    I have been training my hands for over 15 years.

    I do not have damaged hands, as I have trained them correctly.

    No need to break over 4 inches of concrete, as you can cause serious damage if you can break 4 inches of unbaked/untreated block.

    Anything after that is cool, but not really needed.

    Progressive training with strong medicine keeps you from causing injuries.
    Mouth Boxers have not the testicular nor the spinal fortitude to be known.
    Hence they hide rather than be known as adults.

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