New Sheriff In Town...

[Ray Pina]

I've gotta check that out!!! Hopefully they're not all just doing kickboxing, you know? Hopefully you can actually tell what styles they're from by how they fight!

I'm looking. So far I see a lot of BJJ. Good stuff, but not top-of-the-pecking order stuff. Seeing boxing.... haven't seen anything resembling Wing Chun folding elbows, Mantis fist traps, Hung Gar element striking, crane, snake. Definitely no taiji, Hsing-I or Ba Gua. Didn't see any drunken boxing.

If you find anything, please share. I would love to see it. It would be awesome if it was so.

[Lucas]

I'm on my way into work now but ill try and find that link of shuai jiao taking the division title. When I get a chance. However I think realistically guys are def going to cross train no matter if they start in kungfu, muaythai or western boxing. Plus bjj is huge in China now. I've watched several art of war fights but just on YouTube. I'd have to dig in research on the fighters and fi d their stat lists. Gotta be listed somewhere, tho its prob going to be in Chinese lol

[Lucas]

Great now u got me really wanting to know the fighters style ratios in that art of war.

[Ray Pina]

Here's a "Kung Fu" victory a la an Asian giant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqsLJ...eature=related

Either way, this in no way represents the high level of pro MMA. No way!


In actuality, TCMA will not get the legitimacy. It's too late. Maybe in the first few years when people stuck more to one style. Now you have to have BJJ to compete. You can't compete as just a Thai Boxer or boxer or just a BJJ.

Evolution. If you're doing what you were doing 20 years ago, never mind 200 years ago.... you're out. You can't compete unless it's in these "dumbed down" events.

[wenshu]

Loathe though I am to give you more of an excuse for your self congratulatory masturbation; you are projecting an extremely attenuated perspective of gong fu. You haven't even mentioned shuai jiao while also ignoring the existence of the wide range of northern styles with the exception of bagua, you make offhand mention of mantis but have you ever really seen any actual mantis?

Concerns about lack of actual fight training in modern gong fu schools are perfectly reasonable but the only thing you seem capable of adding to the conversation is that you are a dedicated aficionado of blowing yourself. Typical story I guess - you got grafted for years by some wing chun school and now express your bitter resentment by projecting your narrowly subjective experience onto everything. All this self obsessed bravado reeks of insecurity and the only new insight I have gained from this thread is your woefully regrettable body art and interior decorating decisions.

[Lucas]

Ray, here is a link to the fight, you have to browse/skip to about 80-83 minutes in, then thats where the fight is. unless you want to watch all of it that is

the shuai jiao guys name is Yao Hung Gong, and hes introduced to the crowed as shuai jiao for his style if i remember correctly.

http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMjg2NzA2ODIw.html

[hskwarrior]

Loathe though I am to give you more of an excuse for your self congratulatory masturbation; you are projecting an extremely attenuated perspective of gong fu. You haven't even mentioned shuai jiao while also ignoring the existence of the wide range of northern styles with the exception of bagua, you make offhand mention of mantis but have you ever really seen any actual mantis?

He also totally ignored other systems like CLF who is in the rings these days. I think he has selective vision.

Typical story I guess - you got grafted for years by some wing chun school and now express your bitter resentment by projecting your narrowly subjective experience onto everything. All this self obsessed bravado reeks of insecurity and the only new insight I have gained from this thread is your woefully regrettable body art and interior decorating decisions.

Personally, i think you hit it on the money. he's bitter about his experience with CMA. And, even if you showed him something decent, its a GIVEN that he's gonna shoot it down with a typical shot of "Either way, this in no way represents the high level of pro MMA. No way!" I think its safe to say he'd give the same response event if it was PRO MMA he's checking out. And, i'm not even trying to disrespect the guy.....it's just how he comes off

[Frost]

He also totally ignored other systems like CLF who is in the rings these days. I think he has selective vision.



Personally, i think you hit it on the money. he's bitter about his experience with CMA. And, even if you showed him something decent, its a GIVEN that he's gonna shoot it down with a typical shot of "Either way, this in no way represents the high level of pro MMA. No way!" I think its safe to say he'd give the same response event if it was PRO MMA he's checking out. And, i'm not even trying to disrespect the guy.....it's just how he comes off

to be fair he was asking how YOU get your guys to compete not CLF in general, riding a styles coattails whilst only ever posting clips of body shots only light sparring can be annoying......but to be fair i do sometimes wonder why hes still here if thats how he feels...mind you i wonder that myself sometimes too lol

[hskwarrior]

to be fair he was asking how YOU get your guys to compete not CLF in general, riding a styles coattails whilst only ever posting clips of body shots only light sparring can be annoying......but to be fair i do sometimes wonder why hes still here if thats how he feels...mind you i wonder that myself sometimes too lol

Thanks man, but i know what he was trying to do. I just didn't want to go down that road with him. And i'm not even trying to put him down. I don't really know him. I can only go off of how he acts on this forum. And yes, i agree with you about why he's comes here. and, yes, i too ask my self the same question only to find myself clicking the KFM link.

All i was trying to say was at least CLF wasn't trying to be one of the hated on styles. My students don't just spar CLF people but they have a big group of martial artists of varying styles that get together and spar. We even work on some ground stuff as well.

I just don't like putting all i got out there.

[Lucas]

now this is a very simple wiki seach on art of war, they have a list of notable fighters. the only 2 listed as hailing from China both have sanshou/sanda and bjj as their styles. mixed in with mongolian/chinese wrestling backgrounds. but thats pretty good evidence that china based fighters are having backgrounds based in chinese kickboxing.


Bao Li Gao- sanda, shuai jiao, bjj.

Zhang Tie Quan Mongolian wrestling, sanshou, bjj

[bawang]

Let's say at the very least I suck. I studied Kung Fu for over 10 years and I went out to fight and I failed miserably. Let's keep it at that.

Who's fault is that?

The fact that besides a small handful of San Da fighters here, no one, including teachers making a living from Kung Fu, have even gone out to try. Who's fault is that?

If Kung Fu sucks, it's not because of me. It's because of you. What have you done to raise the bar? If you love Kung Fu so much, do something about it.

I don't stay in a bad relationship that's not working out. If you love it so much, treat it with the respect others treat their MA. Bring it to life.

i dont need to "do somethign about it" because:

- i understand it is a primitive and crude method for trainin farmers in ancient times
- i appreciate its cultural value
- i dont see it as the grand ultimate style of fighting

[Ray Pina]

you make offhand mention of mantis but have you ever really seen any actual mantis?

My Hung Gar/Wing CHun teachers brother studied S MAntis with Milton Chin and Norman Chin in NYC Chinatown. He was their disciple.

I studied with him after hours in his brother' school with a small group, about 5 guys who wanted to fight. Training was 100% live drills and sparring.

Unfortunately, there was such a difference between our group and the other group politics arose and we were shut down.... thus the beginning of my journey. It was from that group I was introduced to Chinatown Freemason Wing Chunners to throw around.

Concerns about lack of actual fight training in modern gong fu schools are perfectly reasonable

All this self obsessed bravado reeks of insecurity and the only new insight I have gained from this thread is your woefully regrettable body art and interior decorating decisions.

I seek to improve in all areas of interest. When I was single I lived in a simple apartment. I'm getting married in April and now live in a 3 bedroom house on a cliff overlooking my favorite surf beach.

Telling it like it is, and then using evidence to defend myself from attacks .... how you take that. What you do with it. If you want to attack me personally.... that's your business and of no concern to me.

[bawang]

in your quest to find the real kung fu ,you trained hung gar and wing chun, and went to shang hai.


the fuk wrong wit you??

[Ray Pina]

I find it interesting that I'm being accused of insecurity by this group.... what do I have to be insecure of? Here?

Martial arts is what I dedicated the past 33 years of life towards. It's the subject I'm most comfortable talking about and a skill that I'm better than average at. At least up to standard.

I have the body, mind and skill of a fighter who has done the two times a day, six days a week, prepare to fight training. Compare those recent pics with the old video. I'm 37 now with a much stronger, versatile, responsive body.

Could it possible be that "professional" sifu types with marshmallow builds and no fighting ability are insecure of my statements... because they hit their mark?

[bawang]

i dont think you are insecure. i think you are a douchebag. and a dum dum.