An interesting way to flow... from Germany

[Sihing73]

Hello,

I have trained with Keith Kernspecht while I was in Germany. While this was many years ago I can assure you that he was very powerful yet soft in his approach. I remember in particular during a winter visit to the castle I slipped off the road and put my car into a ditch. I had a 1982 Ford EXP. Keith actually lifted the rear end of my car out of the ditch. Now I realize that this is not the same as lifting the front, with the engine, but I was impressed. Then again, perhaps I am easily impressed.

KK did do a stint as a PRO Wrestler prior to doing WT and also did another version of WC prior to training WT. In addition to that he was also a powerlifter, though I do not think it was on a high or pro level, I could be wrong though.

My point is that, unless there has been a dramatic change in his physique, he is most likely a lot stronger than most of those posting on this board. I can also say that he did not use or rely on strength when doing Chi Sau. I found this to be one of the scariest experiences as I remember thinking this guy does not need WT. I was also awed by the ovious hard work he put into learning to be soft and apply his force without relying on brute strength. As a matter of fact the initial stages of training was learning how to "get rid of our force".

KK is listed as one of my Sifu, along with Allan Fong, on my Primary Level Certification.

I have also had the opportunity to train with and touch hands with several different lineages of WC so I do have something to compare him with. I am also no longer affiliated with his organization and have not been for many years so I have no stake in promoting him or his approach.

My only point in posting is to state my experience which leads me to believe that Keith is quite capable of dealing with a non-compliant partner\opponent. What was in the video are demos and I am not sure exactly what the end result was desired to be. Although, I would hazard a guess and suggest it was more for marketting than for actual application, but that is my opinion and may be off base.

[k gledhill]

Just to clarify, Im not just slinging **** either, I have been to several WT schools in Germany when they where secretly defecting from Leung Ting, after finding out he was a phony years back. I helped give seminars in east german 'massive' Gym 'hangars' with at least a 200-300 students who where the worst standard I have ever seen.

mcdojo is a nice way of describing guys leaning away from a target while also trying to hit it leaning backwards turning away while trying to reach with straight arms forwards yeah...so i walked around and helped so they could reach then showed them they couldnt make air hurt the attacker , no matter how hard they hit the space between them

At another school in Germany I saw similar . I saw also the 'applications' and hierarchy of arse kissing $ making going on. Like secret curtains of levels .

So if I seem a bit harsh its not becasue I dislike KK I have just seen the reality of the curriculum .

[Graham H]

Many of PB's students are from the LT lineage. I have been shown some things and also viewed "secret high level technician" video footage! Eye opening stuff! Maybe KK can take up working for roadside assistance instead!!! Mind you saying that if you can sell s**t for 80 million euro then one are one clever SOAB!! lmao

GH

[duende]

That is some of the goofiest sh1t I've ever seen!

Guess they don't have head butt's in Germany.

Wow! Truly bizarre.

[Sihing73]

Hello,

As to the effectiveness of what I was taught while in WT all I will say is this:

I found my training to be of aide when I worked as a Correctional Officer, Philadelphia Housing Police Officer in the Projects of Philly. I won't include my time as a PA State Trooper since by that time I had begun training with Sifu Chow.

Seeing some of the comments of those who feel they have found the "Holy Grail" of WC and that their approach is the best or real deal makes me smile.

Reminds me of a school I visited which had opened in Upper Darby just outside of Philadelphia. I really went to check out the Kali more than anything else but the instructor was a Wing Chun guy, I won't mention the lineage. Anyhow he is working out with his students and sees me standing there and comes over and starts talking to me about Wing Chun and what he is doing. During the conversation, without even knowing me or my background, he continuously bashes WT saying how ineffective it is and totally wrong. He then goes on to say how he regularily beats up on the WT guys and other things along those lines.

He thens asks me if I have any background and I reply; "Yes I am one of Leung Tings Instructors in WT". He quickly excused himself and went back to teaching class

I never did get to see the Kali guy which was a shame since I was training Pekiti Tirisia also at the time. Although I did have a school for a short time with a Sayoc Kali Guy.

Now I am not saying that WT was the end all be all of WC/VT/WT or that it is the best system out there. I will say that often those who bash others approaches are sometimes more filled with hot air than skill. Not saying anyone in particular just making an observation. Drinking the Kool Aide is the same no matter where it springs from.

[k gledhill]

Hello,

As to the effectiveness of what I was taught while in WT all I will say is this:

I found my training to be of aide when I worked as a Correctional Officer, Philadelphia Housing Police Officer in the Projects of Philly. I won't include my time as a PA State Trooper since by that time I had begun training with Sifu Chow.

Seeing some of the comments of those who feel they have found the "Holy Grail" of WC and that their approach is the best or real deal makes me smile.

Reminds me of a school I visited which had opened in Upper Darby just outside of Philadelphia. I really went to check out the Kali more than anything else but the instructor was a Wing Chun guy, I won't mention the lineage. Anyhow he is working out with his students and sees me standing there and comes over and starts talking to me about Wing Chun and what he is doing. During the conversation, without even knowing me or my background, he continuously bashes WT saying how ineffective it is and totally wrong. He then goes on to say how he regularily beats up on the WT guys and other things along those lines.

He thens asks me if I have any background and I reply; "Yes I am one of Leung Tings Instructors in WT". He quickly excused himself and went back to teaching class

I never did get to see the Kali guy which was a shame since I was training Pekiti Tirisia also at the time. Although I did have a school for a short time with a Sayoc Kali Guy.

Now I am not saying that WT was the end all be all of WC/VT/WT or that it is the best system out there. I will say that often those who bash others approaches are sometimes more filled with hot air than skill. Not saying anyone in particular just making an observation. Drinking the Kool Aide is the same no matter where it springs from.

My koolaid stand awaits.....; ) your still invited.

[Sihing73]

My koolaid stand awaits.....; ) your still invited.

Kevin,

If and when I ever back up North I would welcome the opportunity to meet, have lunch, whatever. I am sure we would get along fine.

However, I have little reason to travel up North at the moment. My kids do not want to see their mom so I have little motivation. I had planned on coming up that way around Thanksgiving and if I do I will let you know. If I do come up I will be seeing Phil so perhaps we can combine the visit and all get together at the same time.

By the way I prefer my kool aid to be Cherry Flavored.

[duende]

Hello,

As to the effectiveness of what I was taught while in WT all I will say is this:

I found my training to be of aide when I worked as a Correctional Officer, Philadelphia Housing Police Officer in the Projects of Philly. I won't include my time as a PA State Trooper since by that time I had begun training with Sifu Chow.

Seeing some of the comments of those who feel they have found the "Holy Grail" of WC and that their approach is the best or real deal makes me smile.

Reminds me of a school I visited which had opened in Upper Darby just outside of Philadelphia. I really went to check out the Kali more than anything else but the instructor was a Wing Chun guy, I won't mention the lineage. Anyhow he is working out with his students and sees me standing there and comes over and starts talking to me about Wing Chun and what he is doing. During the conversation, without even knowing me or my background, he continuously bashes WT saying how ineffective it is and totally wrong. He then goes on to say how he regularily beats up on the WT guys and other things along those lines.

He thens asks me if I have any background and I reply; "Yes I am one of Leung Tings Instructors in WT". He quickly excused himself and went back to teaching class

I never did get to see the Kali guy which was a shame since I was training Pekiti Tirisia also at the time. Although I did have a school for a short time with a Sayoc Kali Guy.

Now I am not saying that WT was the end all be all of WC/VT/WT or that it is the best system out there. I will say that often those who bash others approaches are sometimes more filled with hot air than skill. Not saying anyone in particular just making an observation. Drinking the Kool Aide is the same no matter where it springs from.

For the record...

I'm not trying to bash anybody. Those video's are F'in freaky! Lineage has nothing to do with it.

I've trained and worked out with numerous people from the VT organization. And while we don't agree on few things... nothing remotely resembled the vulcan mind meld chi present here.

[Vajramusti]

For the record...

I'm not trying to bash anybody. Those video's are F'in freaky! Lineage has nothing to do with it.

I've trained and worked out with numerous people from the VT organization. And while we don't agree on few things... nothing remotely resembled the vulcan mind meld chi present here.

----------------------------------------------------

KK is WT not VT.

joy

[Vajramusti]

KK used to use more muscle... nowadays he seems to have become more soft... except for that- I don't have an idea of the point of the demo.Maybe his students can explain?

joy chaudhuri

[jesper]

Its been around 10 years since I last met KK. I will say though that he liked to goof around when he chi sao with you, but nevertheless you were hard pressed to hit him. Stupid *******

Back in 85 when I started WT he was really hard on us when he came to Denmark.
Once every 3 month or so he would come to grade us. That took a weekend with 3 hour training on fridays and 6 hours on saturday and sunday. It was a rare grading when we didnt go home full of bruises and ****.
Now wether that was because scandinavia was generally more combat oriented I dont know but I remember first time I trained outside of Denmark and the others didnt wear protective gear to regular training I was a little hmm...
Also at that time I thought that fight clubs was universal in WT, I was wrong again.

Ah well that was many years ago, things may have changed alot