How Does the West Train Internal?

[bawang]

i think internal is another word for passive aggresiveness.

when you learn to sneer and smirk at other peoples kung fu and make them feel very bad, you have the real internal.

[sanjuro_ronin]

yeah, but I think we've already come to a consensus that people as individuals are clever, even smart. But in a group they are all outright morons.

This is, regrettably, true.

[sanjuro_ronin]

As for small and strong:
Galabin Boevski was the olympic champ in 2000, did a 195 KG clean and jerk at a BW of 69 kg.

Zhan XUgana at 77 KG Clane and jerked 207kg
Shi_Zhiyong at 62kg had a 152.5kg snatch (LOL).
The chinese female olympic lifters dominate their weightclasses !
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._weightlifting

[bawang]

i do qigong before i workout. its a great warmup.

combine external and internal, become one with the tao.

[Lucas]

could crack every single joint in his body. thats the sign of someone who lifted a lot of weights.

thats weird cuz thats how i am, i can totally crack pretty much all my joints, and have even learned how to 'adjust' myself in many ways you find a chiropractor doing. it actually helps out alot when you feel 'out of place' i just put it back where it goes. lol

[bawang]

weight lifting= hard qigong.

thats weird cuz thats how i am, i can totally crack pretty much all my joints, and have even learned how to 'adjust' myself in many ways you find a chiropractor doing. it actually helps out alot when you feel 'out of place' i just put it back where it goes. lol

i dont think thats a good thing, bro. i rotate my joints and eat glucosamine and i dont make much noise anymore.

[Lucas]

naw its just how ive always been. i even consulted a doctor about it when i was younger. its a least resistance kind of thing, some people are just like that. at least thats what the doc told me. I can force a release if i want but i dont do that because its not good to try and force 'popping'

[wenshu]

People (sexually marginalized beta male hard gainer westerners to be specific) desperately cling to the idea that "internal" is a pugilistic panacea.

There are undoubtedly practices that can be justifiably classified as internal; meditation, qi gong (hell even strategic thinking). The problem so often demonstrated is when people believe that practicing these things without a strong base in simple physical conditioning amounts to anything more than just practicing meditation and qi gong.

[bawang]

People (sexually marginalized beta male hard gainer westerners to be specific) desperately cling to the idea that "internal" is a pugilistic panacea.

from far away, you cant tell if they are man or womans. some time if you do bang bang bang in anoos, it feels just like with a womans.

[Indrafist]

I think we forgot to mention, beer, hamburgers and hotdogs.

"The intelligence of a group is the inverse ratio of its size"
Carl Gustav Jung.

[IronFist]

As for small and strong:
Galabin Boevski was the olympic champ in 2000, did a 195 KG clean and jerk at a BW of 69 kg.

Zhan XUgana at 77 KG Clane and jerked 207kg
Shi_Zhiyong at 62kg had a 152.5kg snatch (LOL).
The chinese female olympic lifters dominate their weightclasses !
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._weightlifting

Galabin Boevski was the olympic champ in 2000, did a 429.9 pound clean and jerk at a BW of 152.1 pounds

Zhan XUgana at 169.75lbs Clane and jerked 456.35lbs
Shi_Zhiyong at 136.6lbs had a 336.20lbs snatch (LOL).
The chinese female olympic lifters dominate their weightclasses !

I translated your post into American

[Ray Pina]

There are undoubtedly practices that can be justifiably classified as internal; meditation, qi gong (hell even strategic thinking). The problem so often demonstrated is when people believe that practicing these things without a strong base in simple physical conditioning amounts to anything more than just practicing meditation and qi gong.

Don't let people fool you. There is an "internal" way of fighting. It's very clever and efficient.

It has to do with mechanics and alignment but also strategy. All of this could be entailed in something as simple as Ba Gua circle walking. Each step is a kick but it's not rounded.... its like a straight knee with the foot turned out to protect the gate but not going up, it goes out..... the walking is to practice drive and hang time. The circle helps train changing direction while driving off the back leg. It's not a rounded, erect, single point balance kick. It is a falling-on-you-under-control driving forward thing.

This is just one kick. One example of circle walking.

As I look back now, a handful of advantages like that, including being able to strike while shielding allowed me to not get destroyed in competitions (San Da, MMA) I had no business competing in without previous high-level experience in kick boxing, etc., sparring partners and conditioning.

Now that I'm more seasoned and have filled in holes I realize these things allow me at 37 to perform against guys much younger than me. At the very least I cancel out/jam up their energy filled movement with very simple movement.... overtime, I let them spend themselves and then I finish.

The only teachers I could recommend is Master David Chan in NY and based on his feedback Mr. BK Frantzis .... other than that I just see guys walking in circles with weights, talking all kinds of nonsense. The two men above have studied the real thing with legit fighters.

My master's master Wong Zong Fei was/is a legend in China. His son trained the Singapore special forces. Don't let people who don't know discourage you from learning something. It's as wrong for an MMA to talk out of turn about Internal as vice versa.

Real internal players fight for the same reason I fight..... who says they're better than me? If they're not a hardcore, fighting age, pro fighter type..... I'm willing to throw fists to prove it. And even then I'd sample. Truth is it doesn't take much. You can tell right away.

[wenshu]

Don't let people fool you. There is an "internal" way of fighting. It's very clever and efficient.

It has to do with mechanics and alignment but also strategy. All of this could be entailed in something as simple as Ba Gua circle walking. Each step is a kick but it's not rounded.... its like a straight knee with the foot turned out to protect the gate but not going up, it goes out..... the walking is to practice drive and hang time. The circle helps train changing direction while driving off the back leg. It's not a rounded, erect, single point balance kick. It is a falling-on-you-under-control driving forward thing.

This is just one kick. One example of circle walking.

MY point is that what you describe is no different than styles labeled external. They all have mechanics, efficiency, cleverness and strategy.

[Ray Pina]

I never said they didn't. A western boxer has a certain way of employing mechanics, etc.... that's completely different from Wing Chun. In fact, I would say completely different structure and striking mechanics. Hung Gar generates power differently than Southern Mantis. Judo and BJJ take a different approach with their tactics, though the techniques are mostly the same.

Not only does internal have unique methods of applying their skill sets/abilities, even within the three major arts there are vast differences: Hsing-I creates space using wedging and goes forward upon threats. Looks to occupy. Taiji absorbs an attack, letting the opening essentialy create itself. And Ba Gua, the one I saw the least of, is about very unexpected angles of attacks. Fists coming with power, mechanics, alignment from weird angles.

I have a student now. We just started week two. Next week I'll have my wife video some of our practice and you can tell me if/where you've seen it before.

[bawang]

i feel sad that a lot of traditional martial arts are not getting the recognition they deserve because people today are more comfortable with the well known "brands".

i really think the reason a lot of people obsess about interneals is because it is inside their comfort zone. americans feel comfortable about kung fu as long as its silly and not serious.