Iron palm

[iwingchun]

Hello everyone,

I am glad because I started wing chun again after many months. The practitioner that I do the practice and techniques does iron palm technique and when he defenses with pak sao, my hand.....

my practitioner says that iron palm has 100 lessons. Is anybody here who has already done 100 lessons, and if someone do, can he see difference in his power?

I want to do the iron palm technique.......

[trubblman]

Hello everyone,

I am glad because I started wing chun again after many months. The practitioner that I do the practice and techniques does iron palm technique and when he defenses with pak sao, my hand.....

my practitioner says that iron palm has 100 lessons. Is anybody here who has already done 100 lessons, and if someone do, can he see difference in his power?

I want to do the iron palm technique.......

Iron palm. Mysticism and fakery hiding a scientific truth. It is called Wolff's law. From Wikipedia: Bone in a healthy person or animal will adapt to the loads it is placed under. If loading on a particular bone increases, the bone will remodel itself over time to become stronger to resist that sort of loading. The internal architecture of the trabeculae undergoes adaptive changes, followed by secondary changes to the external cortical portion of the bone. IOW, if you hit something over and over, the bone becomes denser. If you hit a heavy bag or a bag filled with rice or beans, over time the bones subjected to the stress will become more dense. Bones are microscopically like sponges. The more stress you place on them over team, the less spongy the bone becomes.

[Phil Redmond]

Iron palm. Mysticism and fakery hiding a scientific truth. It is called Wolff's law. From Wikipedia: Bone in a healthy person or animal will adapt to the loads it is placed under. If loading on a particular bone increases, the bone will remodel itself over time to become stronger to resist that sort of loading. The internal architecture of the trabeculae undergoes adaptive changes, followed by secondary changes to the external cortical portion of the bone. IOW, if you hit something over and over, the bone becomes denser. If you hit a heavy bag or a bag filled with rice or beans, over time the bones subjected to the stress will become more dense. Bones are microscopically like sponges. The more stress you place on them over team, the less spongy the bone becomes.

That's exactly what "Iron Palm" is. The medicine only helps with the contusions so the practitioner can continue training longer. I know for a fact that Iron Palm training works for the scientific reasons above. I have experienced it myself and have seen the progress in others. And I don't believe in anything mystical . Period

[iwingchun]

Thank you all for the advices, explanations and opinions.

I would like to have an iron palm hand

[Runlikehell]

While I am not an expert with them, I do believe iron rings exhibit Wolff's law according to the wikipedia definition.

Of course, they're more for use with other Southern styles but some might find it interesting. If they don't already know it.

[Yoshiyahu]

Why practice Iron Palm? Is this a technique that the WC is responsible for promoting...

If you practice iron palm why not iron fist (Sun Punch) or iron fingers (Bil Gee)?

[k gledhill]

Why practice Iron Palm? Is this a technique that the WC is responsible for promoting...

If you practice iron palm why not iron fist (Sun Punch) or iron fingers (Bil Gee)?

And dont forget "Iron Ginger Fist" , I think I saw a DVD series somewhere for that.....

[Hardwork108]

There is more to Iron Palm than creating hard hands. I believe some you guys need a little bit more research as regards this subject matter.

Hint, hitting the makiwara and hardening the hand is not not necessarily Iron Palm training on its own. Why? A good question whose answer will open "gates" for some people.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Correct Makiwara training should be like iron hand training and, in a certain way makiwara CAN be superiour ( because of the positioning and give, but that is subjective).
To issue is too many practioners view the makiwara as a "punching bag" and not a forging tool.
The makiwara, like the IP bag, is to be hit with moderate force ( something more easily controlled on the IP bag because one is simply dropping the hand and allowing fro gravity to do it job as opposed to the horizontal thrust used on the miakiwara).
As for the internal aspects, makiwara training is supposed to do that to.

Fact is though that the only evidence we have that hand conditioning works is the reliable and non-speculative evidence of the increase in bone density ( the aforementioned Wolffs Law).

Beyond that, well..

[Hardwork108]

Correct Makiwara training should be like iron hand training

That is why I stated that hitting the makiwara and hardening the hand is not necessarily Iron Palm/Fist training.

The key word you used above is: "correct". That word encompasses the types of energy; breathing methodologies; mindset; tension/relaxation, etc. used in the training.

and, in a certain way makiwara CAN be superiour ( because of the positioning and give, but that is subjective).

True, and as you also know, there are more than one kind of makiwara, for different purposes, as there is more to TCMA IP than "dropping" the hand on the sand (bean/iron fillings) bag. For example, there is the sand bowl; use of light weights, and even the use of punch bags (often filled with heavier material), not to mention supplimentary "development forms" training and other Internal body unity exercises.

To issue is too many practioners view the makiwara as a "punching bag" and not a forging tool.

Agreed, and these people think that because their bone density increases by using a makiwara as a punch bag, then they are doing IP.

The makiwara, like the IP bag, is to be hit with moderate force ( something more easily controlled on the IP bag because one is simply dropping the hand and allowing fro gravity to do it job as opposed to the horizontal thrust used on the miakiwara).
As for the internal aspects, makiwara training is supposed to do that to.

Except for the fact that some (not all) karate styles use the type of tension in striking that some TCMA-ists consider at best unproductive and at worse. unhealthy.

Fact is though that the only evidence we have that hand conditioning works is the reliable and non-speculative evidence of the increase in bone density ( the aforementioned Wolffs Law).

The way I have been taught IP, sees the importance of bone density and hardned skin as secondary to the main purpose which is to teach the practitioner to project his striking energy inside of the target - eventually, from the shortest range possible.

That is why I stated that there is more to IP than just hardening the hands.

[Yoshiyahu]

And dont forget "Iron Ginger Fist" , I think I saw a DVD series somewhere for that.....

Would you like to taste my iron ginger fist?

[k gledhill]

Would you like to taste my iron ginger fist?

I counter with lemon chicken finger strike

[Yoshiyahu]

I counter with lemon chicken finger strike

Awww But too late the chicken has ate the lemon an your finger...so you have nothing to defend yourself with...Not prepare for the blast of my Ginger Snaps!

[WhiteTiger666]

There are many different types of Iron Palm both internal and external.
If you practice tai chi you can develop internal iron palm as well.

As for 100 lessons that is probably very expensi.

like all things opinions vary
the main thing should be to practice and not hurt yourself to build up the energy overtime so you can focus it.

[Yoshiyahu]

The 100 lessons of iron palm is a do it your self video and book...

http://www.amazon.com/Iron-Palm-100-.../dp/0685637581

http://www.clearstaichi.com/tai-chi-...-dvd-1715.html

these are some sites that speak on it...

But google 100 days iron palm...

As for the validity of these videos I can not attest to them!

My Sifu and Sihing have shared info on how to develop iron hand techniques. But as for you having some new skill to kill someone with a touch or break bones with one hit thats not ever taught...

Personally i think the ideaology of iron palm is overrated and exaggerated. I do believe in iron palm conditioning...but not as it is depicted in fantasy or kung fu movies...

At best having an iron palm will be like anything just conditioning your hands to take more pressure as you would your shins or fist by kicking and punching a heavy bag!

Hello everyone,

I am glad because I started wing chun again after many months. The practitioner that I do the practice and techniques does iron palm technique and when he defenses with pak sao, my hand.....

my practitioner says that iron palm has 100 lessons. Is anybody here who has already done 100 lessons, and if someone do, can he see difference in his power?

I want to do the iron palm technique.......