A clip

[k gledhill]

It's not your Ving Tsun Kev!

But with all respect to what everyone has said here, this type of Yong Chun is more popular in the mainland and also has hints of Shaolin Weng Chun too and I (or anyone else for that matter) can't really say if that's Wing Chun or not imho.

What we can definitely say is that it isn't how xxx taught me

But for some reason the same guys get on the bandwagon of insults CLASSIC!

No it isnt, but if we see something that looks like a duck, walks like a duck, sounds like duck, we can all safley assume it is a duck.

[trubblman]

It's not your Ving Tsun Kev!
But with all respect to what everyone has said here, this type of Yong Chun is more popular in the mainland and also has hints of Shaolin Weng Chun too and I (or anyone else for that matter) can't really say if that's Wing Chun or not imho.
But for some reason the same guys get on the bandwagon of insults CLASSIC!

The problem with what you are saying LoneTiger108 is that the video purports to show chi sao from someone who should be clearly in Yip Man lineage. From what I can tell this guy, Sifu such and such, comes from Kernspect, who comes from Leung Ting, who is part of Yip Man lineage. So one the issues I am sure with this chi sao practice, is clearly Leung Ting does not perform chi sao in this fashion, as can be seen from Ting's videos.

[Eric_H]

Dear Moderation team:

Though my earlier comment represented a disbelief in the content of the video (honestly can't believe what I'm seeing) I don't feel they were in any way out of line for the TOS for the forum. Please contact me via PM and let me know why it was removed.

Thanks,

[Sihing73]

Dear Moderation team:

Though my earlier comment represented a disbelief in the content of the video (honestly can't believe what I'm seeing) I don't feel they were in any way out of line for the TOS for the forum. Please contact me via PM and let me know why it was removed.

Thanks,

AH I still see it so I am not sure what post you are referring too.....

I assume this is what you are referring to, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Wow. This has to be a joke. Please God let it be a joke.

[trubblman]

Awkward...

[LoneTiger108]

The problem with what you are saying LoneTiger108 is that the video purports to show chi sao from someone who should be clearly in Yip Man lineage. From what I can tell this guy, Sifu such and such, comes from Kernspect, who comes from Leung Ting, who is part of Yip Man lineage. So one the issues I am sure with this chi sao practice, is clearly Leung Ting does not perform chi sao in this fashion, as can be seen from Ting's videos.

Isn't every trained Sifu responsible for their own development??

So the fact that the Sifu in the clip learnt from the Leung Ting way of thinking doesn't mean that he is representing that organization. The EWT group are/were massive in Europe, having thousands of students pass through them (possibly millions!) Although I have also seen Kernspect actually practise similar drills, that may just be a development of his own.

Fact is, as I said, I still feel it's wrong to throw insults at something you don't understand just because it doesn't fit the mould you are used to. Ip Man definitely learnt and had access to various teachings in his life and for us all to try to fit ourselves into his image of the system is just ridiculous.

We are meant to grow throughout our martial lives, and the blueprint for Wing Chun may have been in Ip Mans hands but I really do not think he taught any individual the whole. It's impossible imho, and better to teach various students specialities that suit their personality.

The funny thing is, and maybe he even had this in mind, if the brotherhood/family competes against each other and argues over this and that then none of us will ever learn or appreciate the vast knowledge that is within Wing Chun! That can always remain hidden in the families and people Ip Man himself trusted

[GlennR]

Isn't every trained Sifu responsible for their own development??

Actually, i think every individual is responsible for their development... sifu or not.

So the fact that the Sifu in the clip learnt from the Leung Ting way of thinking doesn't mean that he is representing that organization. The EWT group are/were massive in Europe, having thousands of students pass through them (possibly millions!) Although I have also seen Kernspect actually practise similar drills, that may just be a development of his own.

Sure, but how does he justify his change in direction?
Results or vivivd imagination?

Fact is, as I said, I still feel it's wrong to throw insults at something you don't understand just because it doesn't fit the mould you are used to. Ip Man definitely learnt and had access to various teachings in his life and for us all to try to fit ourselves into his image of the system is just ridiculous.

Yes, but how far removed from the original (in your case IM) does it need to be before it ceases to be what it originally was?

We are meant to grow throughout our martial lives, and the blueprint for Wing Chun may have been in Ip Mans hands but I really do not think he taught any individual the whole. It's impossible imho, and better to teach various students specialities that suit their personality

.

No, he never had "the blueprint" as you'd suggest..... other non-IM WC folks now and then would argue that now and then

The funny thing is, and maybe he even had this in mind, if the brotherhood/family competes against each other and argues over this and that then none of us will ever learn or appreciate the vast knowledge that is within Wing Chun! That can always remain hidden in the families and people Ip Man himself trusted]

Life isnt a Kung Fu Film Spencer.... its just a bunch of guys learning to fight

[anerlich]

Fact is, as I said, I still feel it's wrong to throw insults at something you don't understand just because it doesn't fit the mould you are used to.

Look, the clip with the four guys in a circle doing group chi sao doesn't make sense. Period. I suspect it was actually done as a joke.

You think it's wrong to criticize? So what? I disagree. I think you need to develop your critical facilities more. Your opinions of my or anyone else's forum behaviour are of no consequence or interest.

The funny thing is, and maybe he even had this in mind, if the brotherhood/family competes against each other and argues over this and that then none of us will ever learn or appreciate the vast knowledge that is within Wing Chun! That can always remain hidden in the families and people Ip Man himself trusted]

Will you stop with this brotherhood/family sh*t already? YM and his direct students screwed up. Whether that was because YM was too ill, made mistakes or just didn't care, WC is fractured and Humpty Dumpty ain't getting put back together again. Deal with it. I've got some great training buds, but to call us a family insults both them and families everywhere.

What you seem to want WC to be is frankly of little interest to me.

[GlennR]

Deleting my post.

Pointless in discussing the bias and censorship on this forum


So long folks. Just not worth it participating here anymore

Yep, its all a bit too pleasant now isnt it

[Eric_H]

AH I still see it so I am not sure what post you are referring too.....

I assume this is what you are referring to, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Crazy, I logged in this morning and like half of these posts were gone. I thought maybe the thread had gotten out of hand and had to be cleaned up - my bad.

[Graham H]

Life isnt a Kung Fu Film Spencer.... its just a bunch of guys learning to fight

Hey! Stop trying to burst Spencers little fantasy bubble.

Clowns don't only reside in circus'

GH

[Graham H]

Look, the clip with the four guys in a circle doing group chi sao doesn't make sense. Period. I suspect it was actually done as a joke.

You think it's wrong to criticize? So what? I disagree. I think you need to develop your critical facilities more. Your opinions of my or anyone else's forum behaviour are of no consequence or interest.



Will you stop with this brotherhood/family sh*t already? YM and his direct students screwed up. Whether that was because YM was too ill, made mistakes or just didn't care, WC is fractured and Humpty Dumpty ain't getting put back together again. Deal with it. I've got some great training buds, but to call us a family insults both them and families everywhere.

What you seem to want WC to be is frankly of little interest to me.

What he said!

G

[LoneTiger108]

Sure, but how does he justify his change in direction?
Results or vivivd imagination?

How about mailing him on his Youtube page and asking him yourself?

Yes, but how far removed from the original (in your case IM) does it need to be before it ceases to be what it originally was?

Bit of a strange one

What is original Wing Chun to you?

No, he never had "the blueprint" as you'd suggest..... other non-IM WC folks now and then would argue that now and then

So on admitting this is what you think, then WSL didn't have anything close to the blueprint either, let alone PB, so if most of the lame attacks are coming from this WSLPB camp how can you explain that?

Life isnt a Kung Fu Film Spencer.... its just a bunch of guys learning to fight

Well, I agree with you on this one! Life is much better than any of the kung fu films I have seen. But this bunch of guys thing?? I wouldn't know mate. I learnt with guys and girls

[LoneTiger108]

Look, the clip with the four guys in a circle doing group chi sao doesn't make sense. Period. I suspect it was actually done as a joke.

To you it doesn't because you have no time for family or let me say 'team building' in your approach to kung fu training. And no understanding of what it is developing because you have never been taught anything like that, right?

Well, I can bet he was taught it for reasons he himself thinks are enough.

You think it's wrong to criticize? So what? I disagree.

No I don't. I think it's wrong to just be plain out harsh for no reason other than self indulgence. Take a look at whats left of this thread and others and you will see what I mean.

Will you stop with this brotherhood/family sh*t already?

Why? What's the matter with it exactly? Have you got your own reasons to not want to be as close to your training partners as you are to a brother or sister? Do you not feel as close to these guys after not seeing them for a while, like you would do with your own brother?

YM and his direct students screwed up.

Absolute cr4p!

Ip Mans students messed it all up, if you want to play a blaming game. And do you know why? Because they all competed with eachother, rubbished eachothers ideas just to play the hard men or to cover up their lack of understanding.

Some tried their hardest to keep the family together, but most, like you, couldn't care less for family and so we are where we are today. Deal with that.

What you seem to want WC to be is frankly of little interest to me.

Listen, it's never been about what I want, it's simply what is and always has been. A family system. And I guess you have no interest in these terms because you may have not experienced that side to the chinese culture? Within Wing Chun even?

I have and my memories are very fond ones thanks. And from all the people I have met within my own lineage, and some from others here in the UK, we all seem to agree.

[Graham H]

So on admitting this is what you think, then WSL didn't have anything close to the blueprint either, let alone PB, so if most of the lame attacks are coming from this WSLPB camp how can you explain that?

There is no blueprint Spencer ffs! What WSL had was contact. Not many people had that contact. The reasons for that could be many but what is the point in speculating? Both those guys are no longer with us!

What one needs to posses in learning Ving Tsun properly is a certain ability to understand. Some people get it and some people don't. That's life. It happens in all aspects of life. If we were all the same and had the same abilties then we would all be rocket sctientists and be colonising space perhaps. Human nature varies massively.

IMO WSL was a man who was clever, hard working and got his hands dirty proving Ving Tsun. He proved it to himself obviously, but also for a certain period in time Yip Man himself. You must have heard the stories of the discussions that went on between WSL and Yip Man during these "Beimo" days. There were probably many factors that contributed to the passing of knowledge between Yip Man and WSL. If these qualities are not present then the information will be flawed. I personally wasnt there but its common sense because it happens everyday in school between teacher and student. We are not all grade A, physically gifted students so the same must apply to Ving Tsun.

The reason why I have hang ups about your ideas is because they make no sense. They contradict many core principles of Ving Tsun. Many principles that the whole system is based on. This is what I would tell you if you were my student so why should telling you that on the internet be any different?

Nobody on this forum can give 100% accurate information about the history of Ving Tsun even up to Yip Man's passing!

It is common knowledge (for those that know) that Ving Tsun is probably the most misinterpreted and misunderstood MA on the planet. There is no point in blaming anybody personally. We can blame the human factor everytime.

Ving Tsun in essesnce is a system of unarmed combat based on sound scientific concepts and principles. Simpleness is its purpose and its goal. No flashy hong kong fooey BS just hardwork achieiving a very effective form of real world fighting. No competitions, no spear and flag waving, no manipulation of chi power or meditation....just plain old conditioning ones body and mind for boxing somebodies ears in in the most simple, efficient and direct manner.

Does your system think that way? My teacher does, his teacher did and surely Yip Man must have else somebody has totally reinvented the wheel. I dont beleive that for one minute!!!

If you can't see that you live in kung fu la la land then no forum, man or beast will change your thinking. That is very plain to see. Whilst we may all disagree on here to a ceratin extent I have yet to see anybody remotely agree with anything you write. Your reason for that is because you think that Lee Shing had this special relationship and you have close family secrets. You are no closer to Yip Man than you are my brother. Maybe I'm the same. Who knows and who f'ing cares?

G