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Thread: Gary Lam Challenge vid???

  1. #1
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    Gary Lam Challenge vid???

    Apologies if the Chunners have already discussed this.

    I was just browsing along and found this:

    Gary Lam Challenged, "Switzerland Incident"
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBtnV...eature=related

    Of course Chi Sao is not fighting but I think that in the initial moves...GL got caught off guard probablly because he was just too comfortable and not expecting an attack.

    Everyone's human, perhaps GL could have taken it to the guy after the initial contact but I think he played it cool enough.

    It was his demo or speech...if he felt he could shake hands on it, then he must not have been that pi$$ed at all.

    Go figure, "O"
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    "O"..."Some people believe that you need to make another human being tap out to be a valid art. But I am constantly reminding them that I only have to defend myself and keep you from hurting me in order to Win."
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  2. #2

    Gary Lam Challenge Vid???

    Quote Originally Posted by Subitai View Post
    Apologies if the Chunners have already discussed this.

    I was just browsing along and found this:

    Gary Lam Challenged, "Switzerland Incident"
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBtnV...eature=related

    Of course Chi Sao is not fighting but I think that in the initial moves...GL got caught off guard probablly because he was just too comfortable and not expecting an attack.

    Everyone's human, perhaps GL could have taken it to the guy after the initial contact but I think he played it cool enough.

    It was his demo or speech...if he felt he could shake hands on it, then he must not have been that pi$$ed at all.

    Go figure, "O"
    ! Yeah ! He did get caught off guard , but really showed the guy not to play around with him at a seminar . Atleast Sifu Lam was nice about it by shaking hands . Subitai , thanks for sharing this video with us and posting it . Any wiseass
    person would want to get a cheap shot at a sifu , without knowing how the sifu himself would play around with those wise ass people . This is the first time I saw this video anyway .

  3. #3
    Gary Lam looked awful here.

    He was in a difficult situation in that the guy wasn't playing completely by the wing chun rules (i.e. disengaging and protecting face), but I do not think Gary Lam would have handled it smoothly if he had chosen to step it up even more. The guy was too fast and fit for Lam to dominate physically and too non-compliant to dominate via the rules. If you look closely you can also see the challenger de-escalating a bit when Lam gets angry, perhaps to help him save face a bit. Horrible situation for Lam but it shows how much these demos of skill rely on playing by a fixed rule set, being compliant, and helping the main guy look good.

    I think Lam should have disengaged and sent the guy to sit down or cracked a joke because once he stepped it up a notch he had to look really good, and he didn't. He looked awful
    Last edited by guy b.; 11-13-2011 at 06:24 PM.

  4. #4
    compare and contrast:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AFHt...yer_embedded#!

    This small outbreak of reality is truly awful for Gary Lam and a terrible realisation for wing chun in general.

  5. #5
    Does anyone have a clip of the later exchange between Gary Lam and Vladan Djordjevic?

    There is a significant difference between the account of the exchange posted by Lam on facebook and by the Miko kungfu people (as you would expect). Apparently it was filmed so there must be a clip lurking out there somewhere.

    Posting it would help clear up this mess.

    http://www.facebook.com/notes/offici...1568228?ref=nf

    http://www.miko-kungfu.ch/2011/10/ex...-gary-lam.html

  6. #6
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    This whole debacle is a good example of why other martial artists laugh at WC.
    Sifu Phillip Redmond
    Traditional Wing Chun Academy NYC/L.A.
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    傳統詠春拳學院紐約市

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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    This whole debacle is a good example of why other martial artists laugh at WC.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Much ado about nothing. The reactions are disproportionate. What's the point in trying to pull a fast one at a seminar? You go to a seminar to learn unless the presenter is clearly inviting a challenge.If you dont like the subject matter of a seminar or a presenter-best not to go.

    Gary Lam is a good wing chun practitioner/ teacher- and assited in teaching for Won Shon Leung.
    i was surprised on this thread a supposedly WSL/PB student making fun of gary lam (I have never met him). Apparently the PB student's post was later removed.
    Gary Lam handled the challenge fine- he does not have to show an exact WC?VT technique- he took control of the situation.There are always legal limits and consequences depending on the jurisdiction.

    It does not matter who laughs at what. An-Actual fight is something else-this was just an attempt to show off at a seminar.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Much ado about nothing. The reactions are disproportionate. What's the point in trying to pull a fast one at a seminar? You go to a seminar to learn unless the presenter is clearly inviting a challenge.If you dont like the subject matter of a seminar or a presenter-best not to go.

    Gary Lam is a good wing chun practitioner/ teacher- and assited in teaching for Won Shon Leung.
    What's the point in "learning" from someone that isn't any good at what he teaches? The thing about wing chun is that it holds chi sau as the gold standard of training and testing. If it didn't do so then Gary Lam would not have been offended by the guy from the audience touching him (quite gently) duing chi sau.

    Since this is the case Gary Lam had better be **** good at chi sau if he accepts random guys from the audience to chi sau with him. The fact is that he appeared rather mediocre here.

    The exchange also highlighted rather starkly what wing chun is not: fighting. This is extremely bad for wing chun in general. I don't think people are realising the magnitude of this. It is as if a rank beginner showed up at the seminar of one of the most celebrated living bjj blackbelts and gave him real trouble on the ground. That would mean one of two things: either the teacher is a fraud or the system is a fraud. Both are awful. Which is it here?
    Last edited by guy b.; 11-14-2011 at 12:17 PM.

  9. #9
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    Gary was being nice.
    A certain points you can see that He is holding HIMSELF back from following through.
    The other guy got lucky.
    Of course Gary had size and skill on his size.
    Still, he showed a great deal of control and for those that have seen Gary go HARD, that was him going half force at best.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Gary was being nice.
    IMO, he shouldn't. To be nice to your enemy is to be cruel to yourself. The best way (may be the only way) to prevent a future challenge like this is to build up your bad reputation. Anybody who challlenges you will receive serious body injury. When the words of mouth start to spread around, "Don't mess with this guy. He enjoys hurting people". You problem then will be solved once for all.

    When I was young, there was a skinny guy that nobody wants to mess with. People said that if you messed with him, not only he would kill you, he would kill every single members of your family, include dog and cat. That's "bad reputation".

    In the old time, people always took responsibility for their own challenge and the law would never be involved. For example, if you were killed with SC jacket, your family could not sue your opponent. If you have courage to put on your SC jacket on, your life is on your own hands. Such "bad reputation" was easy to build in the old time. Not sure how easy it is to build today.

    Today, if you beat me with:

    - hand, I'll come back with knife.
    - knife, I'll come back with gun.
    - gun, I'll sue you.

    The TCMA honor and diginity are all gone.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 11-14-2011 at 01:01 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    IMO, he shouldn't. To be nice to your enemy is to be cruel to yourself. The best way (may be the only way) to prevent a future challenge like this is to build up your bad reputation. Anybody who challlenges you will receive serious body injury. When the words of mouth start to spread around, "Don't mess with this guy. He enjoys hurting people". You problem then will be solved once for all.

    When I was young, there was a skinny guy that nobody wants to mess with. People said that if you messed with him, not only he would kill you, he would kill every single members of your family, include dog and cat. That's "bad reputation".
    I don't think he was challenged to a fight dude, just a chi sao demo.
    I've seen far more violent push hands, LOL !
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    I don't think he was challenged to a fight dude, just a chi sao demo.
    I've seen far more violent push hands, LOL !
    Exactly! Just a chicken sh$t attempt at trying to make Gary look bad. If it was a challenge then why be a pu$$y about it by pretending to be there to learn. And yeah this is exactly why Wing Chun is laugh at. The fact that people are making a big deal out of it makes me laugh.

  13. #13
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    Both single and double chi sao are pre-defined training patterns. How can you challenge someone in chi sao? Can you challenge someone to see who can stand in horse stance longer than the other?

    Someone once made a comment as, "Taiji push hand is just like a diaper". I asked him, "What do you mean by that?" He then told me the following joke.

    After a baby was born, his father died. The baby was raised by his grandfather. The grandfather put diaper on that baby. Soon the grandfather died too. The baby grew up without father or grandfather. Since nobody ever told that baby that diaper was only good for him when he was a baby, After that baby grew up, he had his diaper on him for the rest of his life.

    Even if it's just a joke. There is some truth in it.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 11-14-2011 at 01:28 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    IMO, he shouldn't. To be nice to your enemy is to be cruel to yourself. The best way (may be the only way) to prevent a future challenge like this is to build up your bad reputation. Anybody who challlenges you will receive serious body injury. When the words of mouth start to spread around, "Don't mess with this guy. He enjoys hurting people". You problem then will be solved once for all.

    When I was young, there was a skinny guy that nobody wants to mess with. People said that if you messed with him, not only he would kill you, he would kill every single members of your family, include dog and cat. That's "bad reputation".
    I disagree here as Vingtsun is a martial Skill Prove it ! And do it with Class not being off balance chasing hands reaching etc .Gary looked Pants man And no one wants to admit it GH said What ever and got Served a under the belt foul ,for saying his opinion

    Ipman when challenged by Wsl handled him with ease and control , high level Skill he didn't have to Crack heads bones or what ever for the young . Shun leung to realise he found his Sifu.

    Point is Theres a Saying in Vingtsun Kung fu "Don't speak of who is senior or junior. The one who attains the skill first is the senior Iow Dont become a lazy Fat cat man You'll will get Merked

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Both single and double chi sao are pre-defined training patterns. How can you challenge someone in chi sao? Can you challenge someone to see who can stand in horse stance longer?
    Same way you challenge someone to push hands.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

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