XingYi Pao Chuan vs. Karate "high block, reverse punch"

[YouKnowWho]

When you use XingYi Pao Chuan, you use it as if you "raise the waist high curtain and walk in". The high block is only to "raise the curtain". The reverse punch is to "walk in". When you do that, you have added Shenfa into your Karate and integrated the XingYi principle into your Karate system.

Ask your opponent to punch at your head. You then use any one of the following responses to counter him.

- Karate "high block, reverse punch",
- XingYi "Pao Chuan"?
- Taiji "fair lady works on shuttle".
- Longfist "Tantui #5",
- Zimen "tiger holds head",
- boxing "crazy monkey",
- ...

Do that 100 times daily and repeat it for 1 year. After 1 year, do you still have 4 different ways to do the above? Or have you found one way that work for you the best? After that day, when you train all those moves, will you still do them all differently? Or will you use the "only" way that you like and apply on all of them?

You can apply the sam training method on:

- boxing hook punch,
- SC neck surround,
- mantis Juan Chui.

or on

- longfist roundhouse klick,
- TKD roundhouse klick,
- MT roundhouse klick.

or on

- SC single leg,
- Judo single leg,
- wrestling single leg.

After you have finished this kind of training, does the word "style" still have any meaning to you at all? What's your opinion on this?

[uki]

style is best translated as an expression...

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

The issue I have with the Karate version, is that it is a Block, and THEN a punch. The Chinese way is to do both at once. I think this works much better and helps keep your opponent from countering.

[-N-]

After you have finished this kind of training, does the word "style" still have any meaning to you at all? What's your opinion on this?

[TenTigers]

When you use XingYi Pao Chuan, you use it as if you "raise the waist high curtain and walk in". The high block is only to "raise the curtain". The reverse punch is to "walk in". When you do that, you have added Shenfa into your Karate and integrated the XingYi principle into your Karate system.

Ask your opponent to punch at your head. You then use any one of the following responses to counter him.

- Karate "high block, reverse punch",
- XingYi "Pao Chuan"?
- Taiji "fair lady works on shuttle".
- Longfist "Tantui #5",
- Zimen "tiger holds head",
- boxing "crazy monkey",
- ...

Do that 100 times daily and repeat it for 1 year. After 1 year, do you still have 4 different ways to do the above? Or have you found one way that work for you the best? After that day, when you train all those moves, will you still do them all differently? Or will you use the "only" way that you like and apply on all of them?

You can apply the sam training method on:

- boxing hook punch,
- SC neck surround,
- mantis Juan Chui.

or on

- longfist roundhouse klick,
- TKD roundhouse klick,
- MT roundhouse klick.

or on

- SC single leg,
- Judo single leg,
- wrestling single leg.

After you have finished this kind of training, does the word "style" still have any meaning to you at all? What's your opinion on this?

ya left out Hung-Ga's "Chin Ji Sao" and CLF's "Ching Lung Hawn Yut."

[TenTigers]

The issue I have with the Karate version, is that it is a Block, and THEN a punch.

depends who's teaching it. I have seen it done as simultaneous block and strike.

The "rising block," can also be used as a forearm strike to crash through the opponent's bridge, and/or to st9, into a guillotine.

[RWilson]

depends who's teaching it. I have seen it done as simultaneous block and strike.

The "rising block," can also be used as a forearm strike to crash through the opponent's bridge, and/or to st9, into a guillotine.

Bs. Only if you train it as a guillotine. Not of you train it in the air for 2 years.

[TenTigers]

Bs. Only if you train it as a guillotine. Not of you train it in the air for 2 years.

well, yeah, if you only train it in the air for two years, definitely BS.

Um, Wilson..? Nobody ever actually mentioned just training it in the air for 2 years.
You kinda got to that conclusion all by yourself.
You do get this, right...?
jus' sayin...

[RWilson]

well, yeah, if you only train it in the air for two years, definitely BS.

Um, Wilson..? Nobody ever actually mentioned just training it in the air for 2 years.
You kinda got to that conclusion all by yourself.
You do get this, right...?
jus' sayin...

My point was that a random move in a form is not strike x or submission y. It is just a random move in a form. Only a guillotine is a guillotine.

[TenTigers]

My point was that a random move in a form is not strike x or submission y. It is just a random move in a form. Only a guillotine is a guillotine.

If you did a guillotine in a form, what would it be then..?

[Thomas316]

hello hello everyone, since yall are comparing xing yi and karate, i think in the past i read a suggestion there may be a connection between xing yi and karate. can anyone please elaborate on this?

[bawang]

its rediculous that everything HAS to be in a form, and people will go to rediculous lengths to "extrapolate" and "interpret" their forms, which was prolly made up by an old opium addict/former male prostitute.


somehow the idea that people learned and practiced techniques not in their form just cannot be understood by a bunch of aging hippies and their manchild kids with mild autism.

this forum feel like one big autism convention.

[RWilson]

its rediculous that everything HAS to be in a form, and people will go to rediculous lengths to "extrapolate" and "interpret" their forms, which was prolly made up by an old opium addict/former male prostitute.


somehow the idea that people learned and practiced techniques not in their form just cannot be understood by a bunch of aging hippies and their manchild kids with mild autism.

this forum feel like one big autism convention.

Bravo, bawang. You are 100% correct.

Practicing the gillotine on a living opponent is how it is done. You do not sit around doing the gillotine form for 3 years and then spar with it. You show students the move once and then they can spar with it.

Forms are more interesting than calisthenics. I will give it that. I do not believe it is ok to extrapolate mma techniques into tcma forms because they did not have as many submissions back then. The ancient Chinese only fought battles that resulted in the death of one or both opponents.

Same with Chinese judo. Unfortunately not every one was a wrestler. Wong Fei Hung was not known for his amazing wrestling skills...so you cannot say southern shaolin HAS throws in it. Same with ba gua. Cheng Ting Hua was a wrestling expert who then learned ba gua. So his form techniques supposedly have wrestling in them as opposed to striking like Yin Fu's ba gua. The problem is that you have to actually study wrestling like Cheng Ting Hua did. If you just do his variations of ba gua forms you will suck big balls at throwing.

[Yao Sing]

My point was that a random move in a form is not strike x or submission y. It is just a random move in a form. Only a guillotine is a guillotine.

Random moves in forms? Are you really Knifefighter in disguise? He thought forms were created first then later they tried to figure out apps for the moves. That's how you sound with these 'random moves' in forms.

[TenTigers]

So, Wilson..again, let me ask you;
If you did a guillotine in a form, what would it be then?

aw, man...dude got banned...?
I will miss him....


about as much as I miss my ex gf....