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Thread: Wing Chun is not a Defensive Art

  1. #16
    chi-sao is the most misunderstood drilling method, ever.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    chi-sao is the most misunderstood drilling method, ever.
    along with Taiji push-hands.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    along with Taiji push-hands.
    Taiji push-hands can be used to develop many valuable skill. It's a good starting point but most people treat it as the ending point. The funny thing is you will still see an 80 years old man doing PH as if he refuses to graduate from elementary school (or high school).

    Also too much restriction has been added into the Taiji PH which restrict that format to be expanded.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 01-13-2012 at 11:27 AM.

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfaring View Post
    I mean a lot of the "chi sau skirmish" skill I see out there reminds me of a religious joke. "Why don't Baptists have sex standing up? Because it might lead to dancing".
    Or maybe because they're not using their "tools" to their fullest potential and had never got pass the missionary position - just like the misguided notion that the Tan Sao can effectively nullify an hook punch.

  5. #20
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    Very good points. So thats Why maybe WC tools are better in an evironment where you the ref doesn't break you up every time your in a clinch. Maybe he needs to be in a competiton that allows for punches as well as kicks, leg sweeps and take down throws.


    Quote Originally Posted by wingchunIan View Post
    I'd personally advocate closing the distance. Proactively going forward all the time keeping the attacks going. Difficult to relax when the adrenalin is flowing so it becomes very sapping. As i said, I don't think the rules helped because on the few occassions he managed to close the gap, he wasn't allowed to hit full power so his opponent just shrugged off the shots and moved back or turned his back causing the ref to restart the fight - at the ideal range for the kick boxer.

    How does your chi sau (drill) relate to fighting? How does your ability to do chi sau benefit you when you fight? From what you wrote it sounds like practicing chi sau just makes you better at chi sau and not fighting?



    Quote Originally Posted by Graham H View Post
    I competed in full and semi contact kick boxing for 8 years mate in the World Allstyles Kickboxing Organization! If I thought VT was kick-boxing I may as well have stayed.

    My chi sau skirmishes are a means to an end for developing not fighting.

    You already knew that though didn't you chump?

    You have nor surpassed everybody as being the biggest nob_cheese on this forum.


    GH
    The Flow is relentless like a raging ocean with crashing waves devasting anything in its path.

    "Kick Like Thunder, Strike Like Lighting, Fist Hard as Stones."

    "Wing Chun flows around overwhelming force and finds openings with its constant flow of forward energy."

    "Always Attack, Be Aggressive always Attack first, Be Relentless. Continue with out ceasing. Flow Like Water, Move like the wind, Attack Like Fire. Consume and overwhelm your Adversary until he is No More"

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoshiyahu View Post
    Look at this clip...We see the guy doing WC defensively trying to counter the kickboxer power kicks. Now not taking anything away from WC he has some good use of guards and good defenses against the kick boxer. In my opinion he lacks one fatal flaw...

    The Push(aggression)...

    the WC priniple is to attack first to gain control and continously and persistently attack your opponent to gain entry so he cant withstand you.

    The WC guy just waits for his opponent to join with him so he can attack. He blocks then attack. Instead of attacking and defending simultaneously.


    Wing Chun guy gets owned video

    what do you think
    It all depends on who you're fighting and their skill level. All arts have offensive and defensive moves.
    Sifu Phillip Redmond
    Traditional Wing Chun Academy NYC/L.A.
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoshiyahu View Post
    Wing Chun guy gets owned video.....
    Since there are only two people fighting in any competition the loser gets "owned'?
    So that means all the famous boxers, MMA fighters, etc., that lose got owned.
    Well, I will say this. At least they had the cojones to get in there in the first place.
    Sifu Phillip Redmond
    Traditional Wing Chun Academy NYC/L.A.
    菲利普雷德蒙師傅
    傳統詠春拳學院紐約市

    WCKwoon
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  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    Wing Chun guy gets owned video.....
    Since there are only two people fighting in any competition the loser gets "owned'?
    So that means all the famous boxers, MMA fighters, etc., that lose got owned.
    Well, I will say this. At least they had the cojones to get in there in the first place.
    Agreed, it takes courage to fight. But there are several variables of why he could of lost. But either way hopefully the wing chun fighter trains hard and learns from his mistakes.

  9. #24
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    Very True Phil Indeed thanks for your Post!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    It all depends on who you're fighting and their skill level. All arts have offensive and defensive moves.
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    Wing Chun guy gets owned video.....
    Since there are only two people fighting in any competition the loser gets "owned'?
    So that means all the famous boxers, MMA fighters, etc., that lose got owned.
    Well, I will say this. At least they had the cojones to get in there in the first place.
    The Flow is relentless like a raging ocean with crashing waves devasting anything in its path.

    "Kick Like Thunder, Strike Like Lighting, Fist Hard as Stones."

    "Wing Chun flows around overwhelming force and finds openings with its constant flow of forward energy."

    "Always Attack, Be Aggressive always Attack first, Be Relentless. Continue with out ceasing. Flow Like Water, Move like the wind, Attack Like Fire. Consume and overwhelm your Adversary until he is No More"

  10. #25
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    If you just stand there you better be a great counter fighter otherwise its like shooting fish in a barrel IMO

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjw View Post
    If you just stand there you better be a great counter fighter otherwise its like shooting fish in a barrel IMO
    lol thats too funny
    The Flow is relentless like a raging ocean with crashing waves devasting anything in its path.

    "Kick Like Thunder, Strike Like Lighting, Fist Hard as Stones."

    "Wing Chun flows around overwhelming force and finds openings with its constant flow of forward energy."

    "Always Attack, Be Aggressive always Attack first, Be Relentless. Continue with out ceasing. Flow Like Water, Move like the wind, Attack Like Fire. Consume and overwhelm your Adversary until he is No More"

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Taiji push-hands can be used to develop many valuable skill. It's a good starting point but most people treat it as the ending point. The funny thing is you will still see an 80 years old man doing PH as if he refuses to graduate from elementary school (or high school).

    Also too much restriction has been added into the Taiji PH which restrict that format to be expanded.
    Even in my short time of training ,I see this is all to present in many styles of fighting refusing to expand or to add for self preservation instead of growing and developing from there base.It seems when some thing becomes codified it becomes a art not a combat system any more.You are so right YouKnowWho

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by evrchangingfist View Post
    even in my short time of training ,i see this is all to present in many styles of fighting refusing to expand or to add for self preservation instead of growing and developing from there base.it seems when some thing becomes codified it becomes a art not a combat system any more.you are so right youknowwho
    it all depends on person reason for studing the art...


    Is it purely to fight? Or is it purely for the art...or is it a little of both?
    The Flow is relentless like a raging ocean with crashing waves devasting anything in its path.

    "Kick Like Thunder, Strike Like Lighting, Fist Hard as Stones."

    "Wing Chun flows around overwhelming force and finds openings with its constant flow of forward energy."

    "Always Attack, Be Aggressive always Attack first, Be Relentless. Continue with out ceasing. Flow Like Water, Move like the wind, Attack Like Fire. Consume and overwhelm your Adversary until he is No More"

  14. #29
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    Wing Chun is both defensive and offensive as are ALL martial arts. Anyone who says that an art is only offensive is delusional at best. Anyone can get caught off guard and be put in defensive mode. That premise works in both individual and group combat. Just read the Art of War which most military people do.
    Sifu Phillip Redmond
    Traditional Wing Chun Academy NYC/L.A.
    菲利普雷德蒙師傅
    傳統詠春拳學院紐約市

    WCKwoon
    wck
    sifupr

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Redmond View Post
    Wing Chun is both defensive and offensive as are ALL martial arts. Anyone who says that an art is only offensive is delusional at best. Anyone can get caught off guard and be put in defensive mode. That premise works in both individual and group combat. Just read the Art of War which most military people do.
    I agree...but the intent on the article is to share WC is offensive because its main intent is to attack first...where as aikido or tai chi waits for an opponents attack...

    A defensive fighter is more of counter type of guy...where WC is more offensive an attack first...WC has both defenses and attacks. But the key to WC is aggression ie attack aka offense.

    Tai Chi is more passive aggressive. It awaits on an opponents aggression turns it around on him...ie defends attacks first aka defensive...
    The Flow is relentless like a raging ocean with crashing waves devasting anything in its path.

    "Kick Like Thunder, Strike Like Lighting, Fist Hard as Stones."

    "Wing Chun flows around overwhelming force and finds openings with its constant flow of forward energy."

    "Always Attack, Be Aggressive always Attack first, Be Relentless. Continue with out ceasing. Flow Like Water, Move like the wind, Attack Like Fire. Consume and overwhelm your Adversary until he is No More"

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