"Always hit them when they're talking" - agree or disagree?

[PalmStriker]

But is it worth the risk? Unless you take hits to the face every day, one hit may be all it takes for some cat to finish you. Why give him that hit if you know it's comming. And you are wrong about the law. I have struck first and got off because I was just defending myself. U are allowed to hit people in certain threatening situations. Especially when intimidation and/or confinement is part of it. Like standing in a doorway, the only doorway, and promissing pain to the occupant, for example. It would not be out of line to run right through the guy.

I was charged for defending myself once aswell. We each had one punch. His didn't land flush and mine did. Dude fell back and ended up in the ER with staples. I was convicted for that one too. Doesn't seem fair does it. But then the law isn't about being fair, it's about order. Otherwise I would be able to do a ton of harmless activities that are at this time quite illegal for whatever reasons.

Not talking about allowing someone to close in and place strikes.
The closing in, is first blood.

[Peaceful Orchid]

If you have to try to hit first, you probably have a low skill level, keep practicing, until you feel you don't need to hurt them at all.

This is very true.

[Peaceful Orchid]

It must be hell being a victim. You know, the police can not protect you. Will not protect you, only do a who done it after you are assaulted. No amount of training is going to garantee you can defend yourself or your family. A martial art is just something that is designed to give you an edge. That is all it is, and even then if you are not quick and fierce you might not have an edge. If you are in a situation where violence might be the conclusion, you have to have the upper hand if you are to survive it. You can not worry about the law or the police because neither is there to defend you. If there is even a remote chance that you are going to have to fight, only a complete fool would let the guy know that you intend to do so. Once he realizes you are going to fight you will have lost the advantage of stealth. There is absolutely no way that you can know what is going down. You have to make it go down the way you want and not wait and let him set the pace.
The other option is to stay at home or only go where there are boy scouts and police to protect you. And quite wasting your time learning and training something you are scared to use.

The other option is to be good enough that there is no threat from some weenie who is talking sh!t to you. If you're good enough, you don't have to worry about needing to hit first.

[I Hate Ashida Kim]

Greetings,

I saw a demo of this kind of approach done by Ronald Duncan. It is good stuff.

In terms of hitting first, elders have the right to hit first. They can't afford otherwise.

mickey

Ronald Duncan the koga ninja?

[sanjuro_ronin]

I can say this, in ALL my years bouncing and in the military that I can count on one hand the times I have NEEDED to "pre-emptive" hit anyone.
And ALL of them involved the fact that the person DID something that warranted it.
EX:
While talking his hand disappears ( reaching for something).
He turns away one side of his body ( classic sucker punch on the way).
I see his attention go BEHIND me.
Etc.

[Fighting Eagle]

With street experience you can know if it's going to escalate to violence, but you can never know when. I believe striking first will put you in an extreme advantage to escape, succeed, win. However, even if striking first affords you victory, it may hurt you legally or financially and in that case it can be better to expect a fight but take the first hit yourself. As we all know, the first person to strike loses in a legal battle or when the cops arrive. The old question, "Who started it?" always comes up.

I've been in many street fights but once I became proficient at kung-fu, I've never thrown the first punch and still won or avoided every street\bar fight I've be involved in. It all has to do with experience. You can take the hit, roll the punch, block the strike, bob and weave, duck, step back and then take your opponent down. In the case of multiple attackers, striking first will give you a much needed head start to escape or continue your attack on another opponent.

All in all, it really depends on the situation. Striking first can give you a much needed advantage but the situation should be evaluated first. This can only be done with experience IMHO.

[Lee Chiang Po]

From the way you guys talk, I certainly hope you are as good as you say. I have been into court on many occasions, being sued, charged with assault, causing bodily injury. On the other hand I have been shot, more than once. Stabbed, more than once. Beat all to hell, more than once. Most of that was because I did not take the initiative. No one is so good that they can give an opponent a break. How many of you have even been in a situation where you could be harmed? My skills are solid. I am a bad man when I fight. Old, but I can still get down. I am a realist however, and I realize that nothing is garanteed. Even an untrained fighter can mess you up if he gets the chance. You can never take anyone for granted when it comes to an exchange of violence.

[Syn7]

Not talking about allowing someone to close in and place strikes.
The closing in, is first blood.

even if i have to cross the room coz i know he's coming for me eventually. not always a bad idea to just get it on while the odds are somewhat even rather than difusing the situation then getting jumped later. which may or may not happen anyways, but you may as well get in while you can and hopefully you can dead the issue right there. you have to be able to read people, sometimes talking it out is better, for sure. but the do not need to be physically aggressive in order to warrant an attack IMO. there are times when you just need to clean house and do it now.

[Syn7]

From the way you guys talk, I certainly hope you are as good as you say. I have been into court on many occasions, being sued, charged with assault, causing bodily injury. On the other hand I have been shot, more than once. Stabbed, more than once. Beat all to hell, more than once. Most of that was because I did not take the initiative. No one is so good that they can give an opponent a break. How many of you have even been in a situation where you could be harmed? My skills are solid. I am a bad man when I fight. Old, but I can still get down. I am a realist however, and I realize that nothing is garanteed. Even an untrained fighter can mess you up if he gets the chance. You can never take anyone for granted when it comes to an exchange of violence.

sounds like you needed a lifestyle change many moons ago.

defensive kung fu takes significantly more skill than offensive kung fu. that is true for all combat methods, but it especially holds true for kung fu.

[Yao Sing]

Hey, the U.S. military is ok with pre-emptive strikes.

[RenDaHai]

The way a lot of you talk on here, its like you expect all fights to be with some kind of homicidal predator, but in my experience there is a lot of violence from normal people. Normal people who've had a bad day, or are drunk, or are just d*ck heads. Although all violence is potentially life threatening, I think murderous intent is rarely present. I think often someone just wants to ruff you up a bit. Yeah you could die, but you could die doing a lot of things.

But I'm from England... I guess maybe America is more dangerous.

[mickey]

Greetings,

Yes, Ronald Duncan of the Koga ninja school.

Elders have the right to hit first.


mickey

[Syn7]

The way a lot of you talk on here, its like you expect all fights to be with some kind of homicidal predator, but in my experience there is a lot of violence from normal people. Normal people who've had a bad day, or are drunk, or are just d*ck heads. Although all violence is potentially life threatening, I think murderous intent is rarely present. I think often someone just wants to ruff you up a bit. Yeah you could die, but you could die doing a lot of things.

But I'm from England... I guess maybe America is more dangerous.

Yeah but you should prepare for the worst and hope for the best. Hopefully people with deadly skills also have the intellect to know how far to go, or not go. It's usually pretty obvious. But unless you know that it will be a one on one fist fight you must assume a weapon and mutiple attackers are present until you can see otherwise. Know what I mean?

[Lee Chiang Po]

I was working as a bouncer once when this fellow kept trying to fight with me. He had seen me remove a fellow the week before and kept telling everyone, I wish that jap would try that stuff on me. I didn't mind except being called a jap. Anyway, he just kept on building up to it until he finally made a try. He tried to sucker punch me but I got him in a wrist lock that rolled him into an arm bar with it. No way that anyone gets loose from that one. Had my knee against the back of his neck and his butt up in the air. It was in front of his lady and friends so it didn't make him happy. I got him to agree to stop all hostilities and offered to buy him a cold beer. He agreed, but no sooner than I let him go he tried to sucker punch me again. I had to beat him down and ended up with him in the same wrist lock, arm bar. Two friends came over and was trying to get in behind me and I turned my back to a table where they could not do so. I told them that I was not going to fight all of them so I was going to break the guys arm and then to them. They kept on, being egged on by their ladies. I told them again and he even asked them to stand down. They didn't, so rather than turn him loose I snapped his wrist and kicked him across the room. The other 2 were not as tough as I had expected and when I popped the first one the second backed off. My boss was upset at me, thinking I really didn't have to do that, but I had no help and the end result would have been something I didn't even want to consider. I might have been able to whip all 3 of them. Who knows. But I had no idea about what any one of them could do or was capible of doing. I whipped 4 dudes in a pool hall once. I was rather scathed for the efforts too. You do what you need to do.

[David Jamieson]

cool story bro!