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Thread: Teaching Kung Fu from the Beginning

  1. #1
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    Teaching Kung Fu from the Beginning

    Teaching martial arts I believe is an art itself and I wondered for those who teach or those with experience who can talk about their teachers, what are the core elements it takes to make someone's Kung Fu strong.

    This is not a set routine but rather a guideline of what I find important for teaching Kung Fu:

    Basics- The absolute foundation that must be taught. I consider basics the tools and mechanics for everything. When teaching a punch, kick, block, throw, counter, ect., one should break this technique down in an A to Z fashion so that the student understands the what and why of what they are doing.

    Stance Training- Always get disagreements on this, but stance training, both stagnant and transitional, are essential to a student's foundation and rooting, which is a requisite for strong Kung Fu. Footwork, dropping the weight, counter sinking, sweeping, throwing, all come from good stance work and strong rooted legs.

    Bag Work- Working the heavy bag is something that is essential to build power, speed, and timing. There is nothing wrong with doing basics in line and throwing techniques in the air to learn and refine form, however, if a student never hits anything, how do they learn the true mechanics of it? Absolute requirement.

    Mitt Work- Seperate yet equally important to bag work, mitt work refines technique, builds speed and power, and increases and improves accuracy. I hold mitts often for my students and do set techniques as well as freestyle movement. I believe kicks are best practiced on mitts and have them partner up and do kicks such as front snap, side snap, crescents, hooks, roundhouses, and spinning for the more advanced. We hold Thai Mitts to work power roundhouses, knees, and push kicks. We kick body shields with front thust kicks, side thrust kicks, and roundhouses. This refines.

    Two Person Drills- Step sparring to give students the mechanics and know how to do certain techniques and combinations. It could be something as simple as jab, cross, roundhouse to advanced sticky hand drills, jamming and bridging, or clinch. Very essential in my opinion.

    Sparring- The absolute necissity for good Kung Fu, sparring can be done at different levels but what is required is freestyle movement and reactionary techniques. I have my students spar in three manners

    1. Hard Sparring- Full Equipment (Head Gear, Boxing Gloves, Shin Guards) Heavy Contact with protection for minimal injury, let's them go without much fear of injury.

    2. Refined Sparring-MMA or Fingerless Gloves, Less contact but more focus on technique and open hand strikes, clinch, and grabbing and sticky techniques.

    3. San Shou- Same as Hard Sparring but with throws, ground work, ground strikes, submissions, ect. Often you can mix this with refined sparring moreso for subs due to the inability with boxing gloves.

    Throwing/Shuai Training/Submissions/Chin Na- Can fall into the basics category but freestyle and randori must be done for best results.

    Iron Training- Bang arms, bang shins, kick ribcage, kick legs, and overall make the body a piece of steel. I have begun to implement much more of this into my teaching routine as it was a huge part when I was coming up through.

    Forms- Set patterns which define the system you teach. I also include Chi Kung and meditation into this area. While I do not feel these have as important of a role as others I mentioned, they are a part of Kung Fu and have their place within the system being taught.

    Please feel free to tell of your teaching method or of the teaching method that you learned with. I feel as an instructor nothing in Kung Fu should be stagnant and we should always be trying to teaching and training methods.
    "The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero projects his fear onto his opponent while the coward runs. 'Fear'. It's the same thing, but it's what you do with it that matters". -Cus D'Amato

  2. #2
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    I keep it simple:
    The first year- "kick boxing/mma" type training.
    It creates a practical and functional core to build everything from.
    After that, it depends of what the student wants to learn and why he wants to learn.
    No STATIC stance training ( all of the stance work is dynamic).
    Strength training is a must.
    Gungs and such are taught after.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    I keep it simple:
    The first year- "kick boxing/mma" type training.
    It creates a practical and functional core to build everything from.
    After that, it depends of what the student wants to learn and why he wants to learn.
    No STATIC stance training ( all of the stance work is dynamic).
    Strength training is a must.
    Gungs and such are taught after.
    I do the same, but I do teach static stance training. It teaches the student to feel and their body to learn what is a proper stance, so that when they are doing active drilling, they can maintain structure.
    Look at your worst students and realize that while it may not be the norm, it is common. The beginner is lazy. Perhaps not intentionally, but they will find the easy way out. They will come out of their structure, they will drop their hands, they will do incomplete movement.
    Static training gives the teacher the ability to make on the spot corrections and adjustments, and in time, it will take.
    (that last part, if you say it like Yoda...)
    "My Gung-Fu may not be Your Gung-Fu.
    Gwok-Si, Gwok-Faht"

    "I will not be part of the generation
    that killed Kung-Fu."

    ....step.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by TenTigers View Post
    I do the same, but I do teach static stance training. It teaches the student to feel and their body to learn what is a proper stance, so that when they are doing active drilling, they can maintain structure.
    Look at your worst students and realize that while it may not be the norm, it is common. The beginner is lazy. Perhaps not intentionally, but they will find the easy way out. They will come out of their structure, they will drop their hands, they will do incomplete movement.
    Static training gives the teacher the ability to make on the spot corrections and adjustments, and in time, it will take.
    (that last part, if you say it like Yoda...)
    Perhaps, but I really haven;t seen it do that any better than dynamic stance training and at least when it is dynamic they are learning a skillset on top of it.
    Some of the best "rooted" MA are wrestlers and judoka and they do NO static stance training at all, same thing for sumotoris.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  5. #5
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    Strength training and conditioning is a huge part of my class as well. I teach twice a week and have two hour classes, so a lot of the material is in those two hours and that includes loads of conditioning. It has always worked for us. I would probably seperate it more if I taught more days of the week, but I don't run a commercial school and have a job and a life outside of my gym so it is what it is.
    "The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero projects his fear onto his opponent while the coward runs. 'Fear'. It's the same thing, but it's what you do with it that matters". -Cus D'Amato

  6. #6
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    There is no such thing as a static stance. Not even in Kung Fu. There is always adjustment and motion happening.

    Here's a good article:
    http://www.citraining.com/Emerging-C...s-Posture.html
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    There is no such thing as a static stance. Not even in Kung Fu. There is always adjustment and motion happening.

    Here's a good article:
    http://www.citraining.com/Emerging-C...s-Posture.html
    Static is stance for the "sake" of stance - 20 min horse stance is an example.
    Dynamic stance work is maintaining a stance while under "pressure".
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Perhaps, but I really haven;t seen it do that any better than dynamic stance training and at least when it is dynamic they are learning a skillset on top of it.
    Some of the best "rooted" MA are wrestlers and judoka and they do NO static stance training at all, same thing for sumotoris.
    They used to make the wrestlers in my H.S. hold a half-squat position to time...
    Somewhere sometime TGY posted something interesting about static stance training, something to do with activating the muscle core...

  9. #9
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    Planks are static exercises, and GREAT for your core.

    Just because it doesn't make something blow up or have an immediate combat application doesn't mean it's not useful.
    The weakest of all weak things is a virtue that has not been tested in the fire.
    ~ Mark Twain

    Everyone has a plan until they’ve been hit.
    ~ Joe Lewis

    A warrior may choose pacifism; others are condemned to it.
    ~ Author unknown

    "You don't feel lonely.Because you have a lively monkey"

    "Ninja can HURT the Spartan, but the Spartan can KILL the Ninja"

  10. #10
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    Guys, knock yourselves out, LOL !
    Just because I don't do them nor would I teach them doesn't mean YOU shouldn't if you want to.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  11. #11
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    I find great benefit in static training. More than just Horse stance; tuck planche, front & back levers, l- sits.

    I don't go crazy with it; between 10 - 30 seconds to at the very most a few minutes focused on perfect form. They're a great form of active recovery exercise. You can't lift heavy, max out pull ups and do hill sled sprints every single day.

    It has it's place but it's no panacea or end all be all to training. Neither is weight lifting.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Guys, knock yourselves out, LOL !
    Just because I don't do them nor would I teach them doesn't mean YOU shouldn't if you want to.
    I've never NOT done core work. I don't come here for fitness advice, anyway.
    The weakest of all weak things is a virtue that has not been tested in the fire.
    ~ Mark Twain

    Everyone has a plan until they’ve been hit.
    ~ Joe Lewis

    A warrior may choose pacifism; others are condemned to it.
    ~ Author unknown

    "You don't feel lonely.Because you have a lively monkey"

    "Ninja can HURT the Spartan, but the Spartan can KILL the Ninja"

  13. #13
    I love how the first response recommends you train them in kickboxing/mma when you want to teach them Kung fu.

    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    - Sun Tzu

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neeros View Post
    I love how the first response recommends you train them in kickboxing/mma when you want to teach them Kung fu.
    That you don't get it shows that you don't get it.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake View Post
    I've never NOT done core work. I don't come here for fitness advice, anyway.
    Awesome !
    You shouldn't come here for fitness advice anyways, or MA advice either for that matter.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

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