Alan Orr Questions 4 - Chain Punching

[sanjuro_ronin]

Do you Sanjuro??

It's been a long day and I forget if I have seen you on the Youtube machine!

Oh I don't compete anymore and due to health issues I have had to curtail my hard sparring very, very much.
But what I "proclaim" is nothing so different that can be seen on any youtube video of kyokushin or MT or any other full contact system and the videos I do post are about developing kungs like the Iron Palm or the PE fist or about strength and conditioning.
That said if I was ever to post a video about techniques or fighting strategy I would most 100% follow the adage:
See it taught, see it fought.
EX:
If I was to post a video eschewing the benefist of chi sao then I would make sure that video showed the attributes developed from chi sao in a hard contact setting ( the the opponent NOT being complacient) and NOT chi sao drills.

[LoneTiger108]

But what I "proclaim" is nothing so different that can be seen on any youtube video of kyokushin or MT or any other full contact system and the videos I do post are about developing kungs like the Iron Palm or the PE fist or about strength and conditioning.

I thought I had seen you PE fist clip. Different than what I do if I remember right, but good stuff all the same.

If I was to post a video eschewing the benefist of chi sao then I would make sure that video showed the attributes developed from chi sao in a hard contact setting ( the the opponent NOT being complacient) and NOT chi sao drills.

I don't think any 'Chisau' clip I film would be worth putting up because I tend to approach the whole interactive training differently than most. Saying that, I understand the frustration felt by Alan when he gets criticized for sharing his thoughts here even though he handles it far better than I would or have lol!

I mean, I have had disagreements with him about certain things too, but I do know a Martial Artist when I meet one and nobody can take that fact away from Alan and his approach to training, even if his Wing Chun idea is different to some. For me it makes sense what he is doing. I can see his progression and why he sees it this way or that and if anyone here met some of his students I think you would understand too!!

Good people trying to do good promtions for Wing Chun, and I never always thought like this lol! Even he knows I don't like competitions!!!

[LoneTiger108]

Some guys just dont do clips....

And some simply put up numerous clips of others to get their point across dude! I mean, when will the time ever come for you to share a simple 2 min clip with us Kev?? You know you want to

[k gledhill]

And some simply put up numerous clips of others to get their point across dude! I mean, when will the time ever come for you to share a simple 2 min clip with us Kev?? You know you want to

When hell freezes over, pigs fly, and Frost learns VT....never okay maybe .

[Frost]

When hell freezes over, pigs fly, and Frost learns VT....never okay maybe .

or when you grow a set

[k gledhill]

or when you grow a set

Nope never....

[Frost]

Nope never....

at least you are honest

[Yoshiyahu]

I agree very well. I just think your kinda of saying the traditional utilization of chain punch as technique is not usable against a skilled MMA fighter who has never experienced that technique...

but again im not speculating only giving my opinion!

I understand what you may' think' , but I can say 100% that nothing watered down in my wing chun. I teach everyday people who have defended well with our system on the street, fighters that use it in the ring/cage and lots of door and security personal who tell me they have never seen a system so deep and street effective. All opinions, but tested ones. So we are far from watered down. If it was watered down it would never work at all.

This whole idea that street fighters are tougher of better that skilled MMA fighters is a whole other debate. I train for both as most tough street fighters are now doing MMA! lol

You are again telling what I think about chain punching. I could have put up a clip on chain punching that would be hours long. It was just a few minutes to get an idea out. Please don't feel the need to explain anything to me. If you want to post clips to watch then great.

[Chadderz]

I agree very well. I just think your kinda of saying the traditional utilization of chain punch as technique is not usable against a skilled MMA fighter who has never experienced that technique...

but again im not speculating only giving my opinion!

Traditional train punching isn't going to work against ANYBODY. Except other guys who think it works ironically enough....

[Alan Orr]

I thought I had seen you PE fist clip. Different than what I do if I remember right, but good stuff all the same.



I don't think any 'Chisau' clip I film would be worth putting up because I tend to approach the whole interactive training differently than most. Saying that, I understand the frustration felt by Alan when he gets criticized for sharing his thoughts here even though he handles it far better than I would or have lol!

I mean, I have had disagreements with him about certain things too, but I do know a Martial Artist when I meet one and nobody can take that fact away from Alan and his approach to training, even if his Wing Chun idea is different to some. For me it makes sense what he is doing. I can see his progression and why he sees it this way or that and if anyone here met some of his students I think you would understand too!!

Good people trying to do good promtions for Wing Chun, and I never always thought like this lol! Even he knows I don't like competitions!!!

Thanks bro

[Alan Orr]

This is a very valid point IMO.
There are WC instructors that believe that SHOWING what they are doing and why is crucial to bridging that "WC bridge" that exists not only between the WC lineages but other MA as well.
To guys like Phil and Alan I say THANK YOU!
One can find demo or seminar footage a plenty from various WC instructors but what Phil and Alan ( I speak of them because this thread is Alan's and Phil has commented on this thread) post is not ONLY the tehory of their WC ( which is ALL that demos and seminar footage can show) but the PRACTICAL application of their WC.
Something that is VERY LACKING from others who are just as vocal and just as prolific posters of videos.

Many thanks.

Funny really Phil and I have different systems and different ideas but we have common ground in the way we think about martial arts development and training. We also have always been able to chat and talk about stuff with no problem and have become friends. Is that not what a forum should produce? wing chun forum - all wing chun guys - building wing chun? That is martial respect.


Maybe we should only listen to ideas from guys that take the 5 mins to post some clips to share rather that the guys who waste our time telling us we are wrong - even though we have shown that it works and why.

[WingChunABQ]

Many thanks.

Funny really Phil and I have different systems and different ideas but we have common ground in the way we think about martial arts development and training. We also have always been able to chat and talk about stuff with no problem and have become friends. Is that not what a forum should produce? wing chun forum - all wing chun guys - building wing chun? That is martial respect.

I agree.

Some of the most productive exchanges I've ever seen between martial artists were when my teachers would bring in teachers of other styles to share their methods with us - radically different approaches to acheive the same ends. The respect you're talking about was alive.

I currently have the luck to train at a gym where lots of other stylists train too, and all the teachers there actively share their knowledge with each other. Good stuff.

The piddle matches only seem to happen on the internet, where there's no danger of provoking a physical conflict. Funny how that works.

[JPinAZ]

Maybe we should only listen to ideas from guys that take the 5 mins to post some clips to share rather that the guys who waste our time telling us we are wrong - even though we have shown that it works and why.

haha, you're so right. How can anyone know what they are doing or have a valid opinion that may differ from yours if they haven't posted up a clip of themselves on youtube?
(BTW, just because someone posts a clip doesn't mean what they are doing is WC simply because they titled it as such. Youtube is full of garbage WC clips. Not saying yours are/aren't but a clip doesn't validate one's knowledge of WC)

IMO, a lot of what you do goes against many basic WC principles from my understanding. If what you do works for you, great, but I don't need to flood youtube with a bunch of my training clips to offer my view (which I usually back up with examples) or have my opinion count.
You'll have to excuse me if I didn't follow your 'new rules' by not doing it in a video clip - I thought this was a forum for written words and views..

[JPinAZ]

I agree.

Some of the most productive exchanges I've ever seen between martial artists were when my teachers would bring in teachers of other styles to share their methods with us - radically different approaches to acheive the same ends. The respect you're talking about was alive.

I currently have the luck to train at a gym where lots of other stylists train too, and all the teachers there actively share their knowledge with each other. Good stuff.

The piddle matches only seem to happen on the internet, where there's no danger of provoking a physical conflict. Funny how that works.

Dave, I hear what you're saying. The only issue I have is Alan's approach of 'Hey, I post videos, so unless you either agree with me or post your own, you don't have a clue what you're talking about or what you're looking at'.

Where's the 'respect' in that?

[WingChunABQ]

Dave, I hear what you're saying. The only issue I have is Alan's approach of 'Hey, I post videos, so unless you either agree with me or post your own, you don't have a clue what you're talking about or what you're looking at'.

Where's the 'respect' in that?

Maybe. But he has a point insofar as anybody can type anything on the internet without backing it up. I do respect his view of establishing some sort of 'proof' of what we say.

His Wing Chun may not be my Wing Chun, but at least he's using video evidence to prove that he's actually practicing something, and not just some obese corn-chip repository lurking on an internet forum in his underwear.

(and my name's not Dave )