Punching people in the face?

[Phil Redmond]

Not an upper cut. I know it looks like it....its only my opinion , I know...

Ok, your WC doesn't have an uppercut but some Wing Chun lineages do have an uppercut. It's illogical to think that one WC lineage is "the" authority on all WC.

[k gledhill]

Ok, your WC doesn't have an uppercut but some Wing Chun lineages do have an uppercut. It's illogical to think that one WC lineage is "the" authority on all WC.

We use cutting straight line intercepting punches and then ...why would there be an uppercut in the last part of a form section just thrown in randomly ?

You know CK is SLT with movement, so where is the uppercut in the SLT ?

[YouKnowWho]

Does anyone here think it's a good idea to punch people in the face ...

Old Chinese saying said, "If you don't hit your opponent's head (not just face), you may have to fight him from sun raise until sun set".

[k gledhill]

Old Chinese saying said, "If you don't hit your opponent's head (not just face), you may have to fight him from sun raise until sun set".

good saying.

[Phil Redmond]

We use cutting straight line intercepting punches and then ...why would there be an uppercut in the last part of a form section just thrown in randomly ?

You know CK is SLT with movement, so where is the uppercut in the SLT ?

I'm watching a WSL CK vid now.Where is the arm break in SLT? Where are the kicks, the central line bong sao, the low bong sao? btw, there is no uppercut in my CK either. But that doesn't mean other WC people are wrong if they use it.

[k gledhill]

I'm watching a WSL CK vid now.Where is the arm break in SLT? Where are the kicks, the central line bong sao, the low bong sao? btw, there is no uppercut in my CK either. But that doesn't mean other WC people are wrong if they use it.

Kicking is bridging a gap...

Jut and tan can be a Jip sao combination, each in SLT. But its a 'move' not the primary reason for the dual action of a jut over a tan.

There is only ONE bong sao, guided by logic of use at any degree of variation in the arc of its useful motion, RELATIVE to the height of the person and the attacking limb to yours, etc...not 3 bongs, its unlimited bongs Where and why is decided by your opponent not thought of high ? low? no middle, no wait ! 45 deg raising shifting , refacing another way bong ....doh !


Glad to hear you dont do an uppercut too ; ) our elbows find center as they reach the apex of the turns to unify forces, train balance with movement and ballistic force.

[EternalSpring]

LOL @ the invincible streets and punching street fighters in the face

those guys have guns!

but hadoukens > guns

[Vajramusti]

[QUOTE=k gledhill;1163366]We use cutting straight line intercepting punches and then ...why would there be an uppercut in the last part of a form section just thrown in randomly ?

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It's ok for you to do it your way. Pointless to comment on others when you don't understand what they do. The so called uppercut is not thrown in at random in the chum kiu form. When the bong comes down into the sinking motion the forward drilling trajectory easily can continue into a short power punch to the face with the chor ma/ chum kiu. Good mechanics and flow is the key.

joy chaudhuri

[k gledhill]

[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1163394]

We use cutting straight line intercepting punches and then ...why would there be an uppercut in the last part of a form section just thrown in randomly ?

---------------------------------------------
It's ok for you to do it your way. Pointless to comment on others when you don't understand what they do. The so called uppercut is not thrown in at random in the chum kiu form. When the bong comes down into the sinking motion the forward drilling trajectory easily can continue into a short power punch to the face with the chor ma/ chum kiu. Good mechanics and flow is the key.

joy chaudhuri

Not an upper cut ... In SLT , dan chi-sao, chi-sao...CK...MYJ....We all do a bong and the drop the elbow to center to strike from center....same throughout the system. For a reason.
NO altered action just for random uppercut idea.

Saying 'shut up and mind your own business' wont change the fact

[Vajramusti]

[QUOTE=k gledhill;1163397]

Not an upper cut ... In SLT , dan chi-sao, chi-sao...CK...MYJ....We all do a bong and the drop the elbow to center to strike from center....same throughout the system. For a reason.
NO altered action just for random uppercut idea.

Saying 'shut up and mind your own business' wont change the fact

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Won't change your perception. True!!

joy chaudhuri

[k gledhill]

[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1163399]

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Won't change your perception. True!!

joy chaudhuri

On a more positive direction, I feel the reason many assume this action to be an uppercut comes from missing striking concepts early on. Jum and tan elbows.

Many trainees never fully understand the jum concept alone. A punching concept.

The re-centered elbow is adopting a position for jum or tan , but without the 'thinking' behind the actions, it is left for the uninformed to try and correlate the action to an...uppercut .

It might change your perception to conceptual striking ideas, instead of an 'upper cut' in VT.

[Tom Kagan]

But the question is, how are you going to do it with your WC? Sadly enough, some people really need the help answering this one

[Yoshiyahu]

Phil so How do you train your fist to condition to punch the head?

Sure, you can train you fists to punch to the head. The Japanese use a Makirawa board.
Btw, Tyson broke his hand hitting to the head in a street fight in Harlem.

Joy lol...not the same energy as a upper cut tyson a boxer would through. But an upper cut like punch all the same.

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Once the wing chun punch is properly developed you can punch wherever and whenever there is an open lime IMO.
Also in chum kiu after the last bong wu /kwan sequence there is a short and sweet Tyson like upper cut


joy chaudhuri

So true...Some people just think theirs is be all to end all...

Ok, your WC doesn't have an uppercut but some Wing Chun lineages do have an uppercut. It's illogical to think that one WC lineage is "the" authority on all WC.

Thats right you use a cutting straight line intercepting the punches. Not every one does just that one application of Bong to raising fist in chum kiu.

In fact in my SLT we have an upper cut in it...lol...There is an upper cut motions in both the innovated one and the one my Sifu taught me. We also have another form called Ma Form that also has an upper cut. This technique we refer to as split the lip.

The problem is see with your rant is your purely a principle based stylist more or less.

Where i rely on both principle and technique..I was never taught one size fits all. I was taught with in the forms there are numerous applications to each technique. Every Block can be a strike and every strike could be a block. I know you guys dont use the word block but i do. Let me also share. With in the SLT there are also techniques know as Tie Sau and Tok Sau. Which are raising and lifting hands. These techinques can intercept attacks, cut off attacks, uproot or distablize your opponents structure, centre and posture. As well as be used as strikes. Just as they are or modified with a fist.

Look at Lop Sau with rolling fist.

Lop sau is not a back fist. it simply means grabbing hand. When you grab the hand downward you roll your fist upward to the opponents face. Thats where you have the back fist. Its two techiques been done at once. You can lop sau with a palm strike, sun fist or even a bil gee. The energy of lop sau is more subtle than that of jut sau. But you can implement a rolling back fist with jut sau too. there are numerous applications you can either drill with a partner or apply while fighting. There is No one size fits all buddy.

which means there is no one application for each technique in the form.

Look at the various versions of Sil Lim Tau. Everyone has something a little different. Either the energy is different or certain techniques are different or the principle behind the form is performed is different. Everyone has their own innovations. Even among brothers let alone different sifus. Different intrepreations to One simply form?

If their are myriad of different ways to do the movements of SLT why cant their be a myriad of ways to apply the techniques found with in the Sil Lim Tau.

In conclusion I see nothing wrong with the way you use the rising fist in Chum Kiu. Kudos for that. But its not merely the only way to do it. If people have ten different ways to perform the same technique i think knowing atleast have of them is worthwhile than only knowing one way!

We use cutting straight line intercepting punches and then ...why would there be an uppercut in the last part of a form section just thrown in randomly ?

You know CK is SLT with movement, so where is the uppercut in the SLT ?

[k gledhill]

Phil so How do you train your fist to condition to punch the head?




Joy lol...not the same energy as a upper cut tyson a boxer would through. But an upper cut like punch all the same.



So true...Some people just think theirs is be all to end all...




Thats right you use a cutting straight line intercepting the punches. Not every one does just that one application of Bong to raising fist in chum kiu.

In fact in my SLT we have an upper cut in it...lol...There is an upper cut motions in both the innovated one and the one my Sifu taught me. We also have another form called Ma Form that also has an upper cut. This technique we refer to as split the lip.

The problem is see with your rant is your purely a principle based stylist more or less.

Where i rely on both principle and technique..I was never taught one size fits all. I was taught with in the forms there are numerous applications to each technique. Every Block can be a strike and every strike could be a block. I know you guys dont use the word block but i do. Let me also share. With in the SLT there are also techniques know as Tie Sau and Tok Sau. Which are raising and lifting hands. These techinques can intercept attacks, cut off attacks, uproot or distablize your opponents structure, centre and posture. As well as be used as strikes. Just as they are or modified with a fist.

Look at Lop Sau with rolling fist.

Lop sau is not a back fist. it simply means grabbing hand. When you grab the hand downward you roll your fist upward to the opponents face. Thats where you have the back fist. Its two techiques been done at once. You can lop sau with a palm strike, sun fist or even a bil gee. The energy of lop sau is more subtle than that of jut sau. But you can implement a rolling back fist with jut sau too. there are numerous applications you can either drill with a partner or apply while fighting. There is No one size fits all buddy.

which means there is no one application for each technique in the form.

Look at the various versions of Sil Lim Tau. Everyone has something a little different. Either the energy is different or certain techniques are different or the principle behind the form is performed is different. Everyone has their own innovations. Even among brothers let alone different sifus. Different intrepreations to One simply form?

If their are myriad of different ways to do the movements of SLT why cant their be a myriad of ways to apply the techniques found with in the Sil Lim Tau.

In conclusion I see nothing wrong with the way you use the rising fist in Chum Kiu. Kudos for that. But its not merely the only way to do it. If people have ten different ways to perform the same technique i think knowing atleast have of them is worthwhile than only knowing one way!

You're completely clueless....

[Phil Redmond]

Kicking is bridging a gap...

There is only ONE bong sao, . .

There is a gou, jung, dai bong. But of course you use it where it's needed.

Glad to hear you dont do an uppercut too ; ) . . .

I said that there is none in our form. Not that I wouldn't use one.