looking for wong hun fun info:

[ninjaboy]

hi all, i have a detailed request:

i would like...

1. to know which book(s) of wong hun fun has his selection of 12 character principles

2. a list of those principles written in

a. simplified chinese
b. mandarin pinyin (not romanized cantonese) and
c. a rough english translation

thanks very much,

neil

[mooyingmantis]

Neil,

In the back of the Flying Goose Palms book of Wong Hon Fan, he lists these twelve keywords:

勾 - gōu - hook
摟 - lōu - gather
采 - cǎi - pluck
挂 - guà - suspend
刁 进 - diāo jìn - hook & advance
刁 打 - diāo dǎ - hook & strike
粘 黏 - zhān nián - stick & cling
貼 靠 - tiē kào - attach & lean

Notice that the last eight words are arranged as couplets.

[ninjaboy]

exellent, thanks very much. that's exactly what i was looking for. do you know of other writings of his from different times or other books where this list might be different?

neil

[mooyingmantis]

exellent, thanks very much. that's exactly what i was looking for. do you know of other writings of his from different times or other books where this list might be different?

neil

Not that I have yet translated.

[ninjaboy]

and so, technically, i guess it's actually only 11 keywords since one of them is repeated...very interesting.

also very interesting is that when i look up the character that is repeated " 刁 " on google translate, 'hook' is not the meaning given, rather, they suggest 'deceptive or wicked or tricky' as a translation. mooying, may i ask how u arrived at 'hook' for the meaning of this character?

that's why i'm also wondering if he wrote any other lists later or earlier in his career. do u know when the flying goose palm book was published?

[xiao yao]

could it be this diao, which means a fishing hook


钓

[mooyingmantis]

could it be this diao, which means a fishing hook


钓

Will,
No, the character in the Wong Hon Fan's various quanpu and in the 十 二 字 訣 - shí èr zì jué - Twelve Word Secrets is 刁.

Neil,
You are correct, 刁 literally means; "perverse, tricky, sneaky, etc." However, the commonly accepted inference among mantis practitioners is that 刁 is used because of its use in techniques. It is tricky, a grab not is not necessarily a grab. A redirect that attaches.

Most practitioners I know substitute "hook hand" when the character 刁 is found in the text.

Sorry, but I do not know the year that the Flying Goose Palm book was written.

However, I can tell you that the form is not listed in the Praying Mantis Fist Method Explanation of Secrets of 1946. Yet, it is listed in the Praying Mantis Fist Manual of 1953.

[alextse4]

In LKY's manuscript it was written as[ 吊打] not [刁打].

[mooyingmantis]

In LKY's manuscript it was written as[ 吊打] not [刁打].

Alex,

Thanks for clearing that up!

They must have made a mistake when they printed the WHF book. Apparently, diāo was confused with diào.

[alextse4]

Alex,

Thanks for clearing that up!

They must have made a mistake when they printed the WHF book. Apparently, diāo was confused with diào.

[吊]means hang,so[吊打]means hang/lift up and strike.To lift up opponent's hand and then strike;or lift up opponent body in order to move his centre weight and then strike.

[ninjaboy]

hi alex, thanks very much for the interesting information. if you find the time could you post all of the characters from lky's manuscript?

sorry to be so greedy : )

thanking you in advance,

neil

[alextse4]

hi alex, thanks very much for the interesting information. if you find the time could you post all of the characters from lky's manuscript?

sorry to be so greedy : )

thanking you in advance,

neil

Just one word revised by WHF,the others all the same.