Does Wing Chun have Knee Strikes?

[Lee Chiang Po]

I was taught that a knee kick was just a short legged kick. Every point of your body that can be used defensively or offensively is a weapon. I always liked to kick because it was many times more powerful than the hand. I can kick in really tight situations, but there is a limit, and when that happens you shorten the kicking weapon by using the knee. If you can get any part of the upper body close enough you can kick it or slam it with a knee. The knee is like an elbow. It is not as proficient as a fist or foot, but it can be used with good effect if it is what you have. You can hold on to someone and still pound him in the head with an elbow. The knee or elbow is simply not a primary weapon and any techniques that apply it like a primary weapon is a waste. It is a secondary weapon that is applied when nothing else is workable or if an opportunity actually presents itself.

[EternalSpring]

most definitely

[mjw]

And he was criticized by some WC peeps because "WC has no knees" or some silliness like that.

Yes thats what it said in his book by david peterson the combat philosophy of WSL I think it's called. But his take on it (WSL) made the most sense.

[GlennR]

Glenn-Good faith sharing answers to good faith questions. I assume you are referring to an application or applications. Application requires development first.Development comes from doing the forms well and doing the relevant drills well and purposefully.

Thanks for that Joy. But id ask, where is the knees in the form and what drills do you folks do

1.For development the forms that I do- empty hand, dummy, and weapons all have motions for knee development. In the dummy alone- there are movements where a lifting knee or footwork knees are involved. A knee can go up. dip down, go right or go left. Power comes from the main axis and the motion however slight of the standing leg. Wing chun knee work is very very close quarters work.

Could you explain foot work knees to me?

2. On applications- applications depend on the structural inter-relationships of you and your opponent(s). In certain situations if you have not completely moved in you can jam someone's kick BEFORE it picks up full power. If you have some control over the opponent's structure via the head, neck, shoulder, elbow or hand level, you can knee- gut, groin,or head- if he is bending down. You can knee someone's thigh from 4 directions. If you are close but to the side of the opponent and you have both hands at work you can knee a kidney. Many other applications are possible in different situations when practice has been regular.. Proper distance and balance are important keys- not memorized techniques and time wasted on decision making.Hands and legs work together.

So from that id assume youre preferably looking for some kind of control before the knee is applied?

[WC1277]

".....where is the knees in the form and what drills do you folks do"

-----knee development in Fong Sifu's 108 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwHcGImEDnY ------

----- knees in chi sau, watch the whole thing, they're in there somewhere - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2chOzs-2Xg -----

"Could you explain foot work knees to me?"

------ easier to show -----



"So from that id assume youre preferably looking for some kind of control before the knee is applied?"

----- Yes -----

[EternalSpring]

Thanks for that Joy. But id ask, where is the knees in the form and what drills do you folks do



Could you explain foot work knees to me?



So from that id assume youre preferably looking for some kind of control before the knee is applied?

I know you weren't asking me, but just to give my own experience/insight on these questions. For the record, this is just the way I was taught and may not be anything like what Vajramusti was talking about and perhaps no one will agree with it lol.

The first knee I learned that was in a form is in the last section of Chum Kiu. Some may have different views, but I was taught that the "side kick/vaan chan gerk" at the end of the form was really two moves that flow together. It's a knee striking up that flows smoothing into a strong "side kick" In basic application, it's a similar energy to checking/blocking a kick and immediately following with your own kick.

knees footwork to me is just a more involved usage of the huen ma and stepping. At first, the footwork requires closing in, but later on, if one closes in enough, the steps can apply pressure through the knees. So if our distance is close enough that your knee is close to the side of my knee, you can somewhat "pop out/hit" with knee to strike the side of my knee.

[Vajramusti]

Thanks for that Joy. But id ask, where is the knees in the form and what drills do you folks do
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Glenn- check out Brian Tufts mok yang jong form om You tube. I could not open the link provided by wc1277. My computer skills are not very good. But you can watch it on Youtube by googling Brian Tufts.Early on, one can observe with care - the tan/Pak with the hands and a raised knee against the middle arm from the side of the dummy.Then in a section towards the end there is knee work on the middle arm of the dummy.


Could you explain foot work knees to me?
Glenn- there is elaborate footwork in our line and the knees work together and support each other/. And single leg standing work strengthens both knees for wing chun motions.And the knees control attack and defense lines of the bottom part of the structure.
Cooperating knees allow a well structured wc body to cut through resistance with good footwork..



So from that id assume youre preferably looking for some kind of control before the knee is applied?

(Yes unless you are bullying a hopeless drunk. )joy

(Some form of hand or body control is preferable for knee work.But you never say never.
What I am saying is not just theory.It works to the satisfaction of people who have done it.

Just discussing and NOT debating.)

joy chaudhuri

[GlennR]

".....where is the knees in the form and what drills do you folks do"

-----knee development in Fong Sifu's 108 - http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iwHcGImEDnY ------

----- knees in chi sau, watch the whole thing, they're in there somewhere - http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h2chOzs-2Xg -----

"Could you explain foot work knees to me?"

------ easier to show -----



"So from that id assume youre preferably looking for some kind of control before the knee is applied?"

----- Yes -----

Great, appreciate the clips but i cant open them????

Can you copy the specific link to each clip??

[WC1277]

Great, appreciate the clips but i cant open them????

Can you copy the specific link to each clip??

Try copying and pasting them, then take away the "m." for mobile. I posted them from my phone so that might be why

[WC1277]

Never mind, fixed the links....

[lance]

Does Wing Chun have knee Strikes?

I mean of course you have raising knee to maintain the centerline when a opponent attacks or kicks. You lift the knee up to cover your vital areas. But can Lifting knee be also utilize as an attack?

In my WC every attack is a defense and every defense is an attack...

In the second set chum Kiu and 3rd set Bil Jee anytime you see the sifu picking up his knee and kicking , it represents a knee strike and kicking only when you need to kick . Same thing with bil jee too . Or a stomp kick to the knee area .

I ' m going off topic like gung gee fook fu one of the set in Hung ga regardless of lineages , you see the sifu or student picking up his knee and kicking . Anything time you see the practitioner picking up his knee and kicking it represents a knee strike or stomp kick to the knee area .

[lance]

Does Wing Chun have knee Strikes?

I mean of course you have raising knee to maintain the centerline when a opponent attacks or kicks. You lift the knee up to cover your vital areas. But can Lifting knee be also utilize as an attack?

In my WC every attack is a defense and every defense is an attack...

Another thing in WC , if the WC practitioner were to catch the kicking leg of the opponent , the WC practitioner can smash the opponents leg over his own knee ,
in the bil jee set there is a technique where the WC grab hold of the opponents ' arm or leg and redirects in a way that the WC can do the smashing against the knee . This type of move can be seen in gung gee fook fu too .

[k gledhill]

I am "your master"... what we do is the right way... We dont use the knees and we dont use this and that...
Do only this and that... What others think and do is wrong...

Hi Gled, no offence..., but I think that your mentality is in a way, as my joke above.
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My opinion is that in different situations we use different parts of our body.
So practice and use all the body parts as a weapon...
When there is moment for the knee, we use it instinctively... So simple...


Jox,

The joke is people have to ask if its okay goes over heads sometimes....
technically there are no knees. Where and when you do it ?

VT is not my invention.

I have had many real fights, some where I could only knee at the time, so I have ...I have knocked out with elbows in fights ...on reflection it was not the best choice but its all a gamble.

A knee is not in the distances we try to maintain. Like BG It would be from a bad position. Raising your leg also offers it to be grabbed if applied incorrectly.

I teach escapes from Muay Thai neckgrabs to avoid being knee'd ; ) so its not just knees but avoiding them too...I know several , how about you ?

[GlennR]

Never mind, fixed the links....

Ok, help me out with a time on one of the clips

[GlennR]

I teach escapes from Muay Thai neckgrabs to avoid being knee'd ; ) so its not just knees but avoiding them too...I know several , how about you ?

Cool, tell us one Kev