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Thread: Sabatoge at the Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships

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  1. #1
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    Sabatoge at the Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships

    First off I would like to say that our Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships was a great success and I had a lot of fun judging SC. However, there was some attempts at sabatoging our event.

    A couple of weeks ago my teacher was contacted by the Ohio Athletic Commision. This group usually runs all the boxing events and normally groups would have to go thru them to hire judges / Doctors / rules and regulation etc etc. Lately this group has been now trying to take over San Shou and the Martial Arts events.

    One of their representatives contacted my teacher wanting him to use them.... blah blah bla. My teacher asked how did they know about us he replied with an email sent by a fellow kung fu teacher. The Shifu is Nick Scrima and here is the email he sent.

    ----- Forwarded Message ----
    From: "Profato, Bernie" <Bernie.Profato@aco.ohio.gov>
    To: "jervinsifu@att.net" <jervinsifu@att.net>
    Sent: Wed, April 4, 2012 9:31:29 AM
    Subject: FW: San Shou full contact in Ohio

    Bernie Profato
    Ohio Athletic Commission
    Office: 330-797-2556
    Fax- 330-7972559

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: Nick Scrima [nick.scrima@worldsandaleague.com]
    Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 3:41 PM
    To: Profato, Bernie
    Subject: San Shou full contact in Ohio


    Is the below event supervised or sanctioned by the Ohio Athletic Commission?


    04-14-2012 (2 days)
    Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships and Shaui Chiao San Shou Nationals
    All the Kung Fu Forms and Weapons Divisions you want, Internal Forms and Weapons Continuous Light Contact Sparring, Shuai Chiao, San Shou Full Contact
    For more information, contact: Sifu John Ervin
    Phone: 216.431.4991
    Event Address: 6401 St. Clair Ave
    Cleveland, OH, 44103 USA
    Online: jervinsifu@att.net -


    We ended up having to shut down our San Shou divisions. Coincidentally Nick Scrima had a tournament in Pittsburg on the Same day?

    My question to you is...

    Do you think this was unethical approach to tournaments held on the same day?

    Why did not Nick Just call and ask my teacher? (we have known each other for over 20 years).

    Morally was this good kung fu?

    Your thoughts

    ginosifu

  2. #2
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    Well...what are the rules for having a full contact event in Ohio ?

    It's not good to read into the motives of others without speaking to them first.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  3. #3
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    Recently there has been no governing body controlling San Shou. Just with in the last year or so the Ohio Athletic Commission has been trying to stick the foot in the door and gain control.

    If Nick Scrima wanted to know what we were doing.. and if we were connected to the OAC, why didnt he just call? I have known him for 20 years... and my teacher even more?

    ginosifu

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by ginosifu View Post
    Recently there have been no governing body controlling San Shou. Just with in the last year or so the Ohio Athletic Commission has been trying to stick the foot in the door and gain control.

    If Nick Scrima wanted to know what we were doing.. and if we were connected to the OAC, why didnt he just call? I have known him for 20 years... and my teacher even more?

    ginosifu
    Benefit of the doubt dude, you may be right or you may be wrong.
    Best to give the benefit of the doubt, no?
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  5. #5
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    Cleveland, Ohio
    Posts
    888
    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Benefit of the doubt dude, you may be right or you may be wrong.
    Best to give the benefit of the doubt, no?
    Yes, I understand, Nick Scrima is a well respected Eagle Claw and Mi Tsung Shifu. And yes you have to give some benefit of the doubt. I did train with Nick for a bit here in Cleveland until left for Florida and he is a nice guy.

    However, he was sponsoring a tournament the same day in Pittsburg. We also had a fellow Shifu call him and speak with about this and he stated that Nick was possibly sending some fighters and that he was concerned about our safety protocals?

    Fisrt off.... No Promoter of an event in Pittsburg is going to send any fighters to a different event in another city. That is is stupid, I know I would never do that. Secondly.... since we have known each other for over 20 years.... shouldn't he give us the benefit and call us and ask what we have going on?

    Sounds kinda underhanded to me.

    ginosifu

  6. #6
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    Aug 2010
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    Western MA
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    I knew that name sounded familiar...Eagle Claw guy, different family, but I think friendly with at least one of my sihings (I've watched youtube vids of my sihing performing at one of Scrima's school's grand openings).

    Guess I'll keep my mouth shut.

    Anyway, sorry to hear about that Gino, that's a bummer.

  7. #7
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    i dont care about your old lady drama.

    Honorary African American
    grandmaster instructor of Wombat Combat The Lost Art of Anal Destruction™®LLC .
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  8. #8
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    The Boxing Commission SHOULD regulate San Shou to protect the fighters.

    It's ridiculous holding full contact fights WITHOUT the boxing commission overseeing it. I refuse to take any fighters to Taiji Legacy (Legends of Kung FU) because the boxing commission is not involved.

    With the boxing commission,

    all fighters are tested for HIV and HEP B and C.
    an insurance bond is posted by the promoter
    medical staffing is ENFORCED
    Fighters have to have a physical before fighting
    Weight limites are enforced
    taping and gloves are inspected
    fighters are escorted to and from the arena for their protection
    suspensions/bans are allotted/upheld for bad conduct (for coaches and fighters)
    fight records are legitimate to prevent sand bagging opponents

    Without the boxing commission, it's a crap shoot.

    Basically, Kung Fu tournaments want you to pay $80 to $100 to fight without offering you any benefits or insurance.

    Any other event, you get PAID and all the perks are included.
    Last edited by MasterKiller; 04-16-2012 at 12:19 PM.
    He most honors my style who learns under it to destroy the teacher. -- Walt Whitman

    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    As a mod, I don't have to explain myself to you.

  9. #9

    Sabotage at the Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships

    Quote Originally Posted by ginosifu View Post
    First off I would like to say that our Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships was a great success and I had a lot of fun judging SC. However, there was some attempts at sabatoging our event.

    A couple of weeks ago my teacher was contacted by the Ohio Athletic Commision. This group usually runs all the boxing events and normally groups would have to go thru them to hire judges / Doctors / rules and regulation etc etc. Lately this group has been now trying to take over San Shou and the Martial Arts events.

    One of their representatives contacted my teacher wanting him to use them.... blah blah bla. My teacher asked how did they know about us he replied with an email sent by a fellow kung fu teacher. The Shifu is Nick Scrima and here is the email he sent.

    ----- Forwarded Message ----
    From: "Profato, Bernie" <Bernie.Profato@aco.ohio.gov>
    To: "jervinsifu@att.net" <jervinsifu@att.net>
    Sent: Wed, April 4, 2012 9:31:29 AM
    Subject: FW: San Shou full contact in Ohio

    Bernie Profato
    Ohio Athletic Commission
    Office: 330-797-2556
    Fax- 330-7972559

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: Nick Scrima [nick.scrima@worldsandaleague.com]
    Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 3:41 PM
    To: Profato, Bernie
    Subject: San Shou full contact in Ohio


    Is the below event supervised or sanctioned by the Ohio Athletic Commission?


    04-14-2012 (2 days)
    Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships and Shaui Chiao San Shou Nationals
    All the Kung Fu Forms and Weapons Divisions you want, Internal Forms and Weapons Continuous Light Contact Sparring, Shuai Chiao, San Shou Full Contact
    For more information, contact: Sifu John Ervin
    Phone: 216.431.4991
    Event Address: 6401 St. Clair Ave
    Cleveland, OH, 44103 USA
    Online: jervinsifu@att.net -


    We ended up having to shut down our San Shou divisions. Coincidentally Nick Scrima had a tournament in Pittsburg on the Same day?

    My question to you is...

    Do you think this was unethical approach to tournaments held on the same day?

    Why did not Nick Just call and ask my teacher? (we have known each other for over 20 years).

    Morally was this good kung fu?

    Your thoughts

    ginosifu

    ginosifu , I agree with you the guy Nick should ' ve just called and talked to you about what he really wanted to do , instead of just sending you that email . Well ,
    I maybe wrong but , the guy nick maybe he ' s hiding something which is something to do with that tournament sabotage . Because , why does he send you an email , when he could ' ve just you call up ?

    And you said that the guy nick had his own share of tournament involvement in pittsburg . Well , maybe he ' s just trying to kill 2 - birds with one stone . And to get recognition and credit too for the tournmant .
    There are times when mo matter how long you know eachother , they can still try to sabotage whatever you 2 were involved in or backstab you . In other words people change for the worse . He probably just wanted to show you that he can be involved with 2 - tournaments at one time .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Boulder, CO
    Posts
    1,508
    Quote Originally Posted by ginosifu View Post
    First off I would like to say that our Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships was a great success and I had a lot of fun judging SC. However, there was some attempts at sabatoging our event.

    A couple of weeks ago my teacher was contacted by the Ohio Athletic Commision. This group usually runs all the boxing events and normally groups would have to go thru them to hire judges / Doctors / rules and regulation etc etc. Lately this group has been now trying to take over San Shou and the Martial Arts events.

    One of their representatives contacted my teacher wanting him to use them.... blah blah bla. My teacher asked how did they know about us he replied with an email sent by a fellow kung fu teacher. The Shifu is Nick Scrima and here is the email he sent.

    ----- Forwarded Message ----
    From: "Profato, Bernie" <Bernie.Profato@aco.ohio.gov>
    To: "jervinsifu@att.net" <jervinsifu@att.net>
    Sent: Wed, April 4, 2012 9:31:29 AM
    Subject: FW: San Shou full contact in Ohio

    Bernie Profato
    Ohio Athletic Commission
    Office: 330-797-2556
    Fax- 330-7972559

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: Nick Scrima [nick.scrima@worldsandaleague.com]
    Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 3:41 PM
    To: Profato, Bernie
    Subject: San Shou full contact in Ohio


    Is the below event supervised or sanctioned by the Ohio Athletic Commission?


    04-14-2012 (2 days)
    Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships and Shaui Chiao San Shou Nationals
    All the Kung Fu Forms and Weapons Divisions you want, Internal Forms and Weapons Continuous Light Contact Sparring, Shuai Chiao, San Shou Full Contact
    For more information, contact: Sifu John Ervin
    Phone: 216.431.4991
    Event Address: 6401 St. Clair Ave
    Cleveland, OH, 44103 USA
    Online: jervinsifu@att.net -


    We ended up having to shut down our San Shou divisions. Coincidentally Nick Scrima had a tournament in Pittsburg on the Same day?

    My question to you is...

    Do you think this was unethical approach to tournaments held on the same day?

    Why did not Nick Just call and ask my teacher? (we have known each other for over 20 years).

    Morally was this good kung fu?

    Your thoughts

    ginosifu
    People perform interesting acts under the guise of "just doing business".
    To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders.
    -Patanjali Samadhi


    "Not engaging in ignorance is wisdom."
    ~ Bodhi


    Never miss a good chance to shut up

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