Alan Orr Chi Sao to Gor Sao clip.

[Alan Orr]

Of course it wouldn't be a learning experience. The best we could hope for is a sparring session. Could we exchange anything through chi sau? No! Because my whole method is totally different than yours. I don't even roll like you.

I am well within my rights to pass judgement on your videos be it positive or negative.

So we may exchange something and I may have the better of you. Does that mean you are going to totally change your thinking on VT or should I change mine If you we're to tie me up in knots.

If I was interested in coming to your school I would have done it years ago. I chose the WSL method instead as I felt that Robert Chu's ideas on VT were not for me.

You could have a stable of world champions, be one yourself and have mcdojos all over the UK and I still wouldn't be interested in your ideas.

"Standing in front of you" would not change that Alan no matter how many cheap shots or bruises were exchanged.

I understand. You think I don't know anything about wing chun but you can't show me either. No problem.

Anyway the reason I offer an exchange is you that keep posting the same backwards BS on every thread I start so you must have some reason to be repeating the same tried message each time. It be make sense if you had first hand experience rather that what you 'think' is is rather limited.

[GlennR]

Because he says -

Ultimately, in the end, it is not his words talking, he walks the walk. It might not fit the type of wing chun training you do, and that is fine. I myself have trained in a different "type" of wing chun, (often angling away from the opponent etc) and I learn and take what I can take from his videos. If something I not going to use I not going to use.

SO wise to me as he knows how to learn and what he is looking for or at.

So when Graham does the same thing, looks at what he sees in a clip, doesnt like it and moves on, he is less wise??

Both ways?? For me if I like something I will say so. If I don't like it then I mostly have nothing to say- if I think my comment is helpful. Also only when I have first hand experience will I make a comment.

Im think fairly much the same, and when i suggest that your man looks up when he is doing some gor sau with you, im only being helpful as well

[Alan Orr]

So when Graham does the same thing, looks at what he sees in a clip, doesnt like it and moves on, he is less wise??



Im think fairly much the same, and when i suggest that your man looks up when he is doing some gor sau with you, im only being helpful as well

Graham does not do the same thing. If you ever read his posts on my threads - he mostly tries to tell me I don't know wing chun. Also he often says just because it works so well under real pressure just shows its not wing chun lol

Yes Glen you are very helpful. In the clip I am putting him under a lot of pressure so he is doing his best to keep it together. Watching a clip of sparring or chi sao with good pressure is much like watching football in your arm chair. Of course everyone will see openings or better counters and so on. It's not so easy. That is the point of my clips. They are just normal training days. You will see lots of different flowing movements - as the pressure is not a demo clip. Which is mostly what you see.

[Graham H]

Graham does not do the same thing. If you ever read his posts on my threads - he mostly tries to tell me I don't know wing chun. Also he often says just because it works so well under real pressure just shows its not wing chun lol

Uh hum! Lets have it right Alan! I didn't say you don't know Wing Chun! What I am saying is that your "version" totally contradicts what I know of Wing Chun so as this is a forum I make some comments with that in mind.

Regardless of any chest beating that may take place if you are prepared to post videos of yourself you must be prepared to take negative comments about them as it seems you do from more people than just me.

I can only give my opinion on what I see and what you say and I don't like any of it! Thats not say its complete rubbish and ineffective. I just don't like it.

I expect to see beginners exchange chi sau like you do and I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that.

What does it matter anyway? I practice the WSLPB method and you practice the Chu method. From your videos I can see that the two systems couldn't be more different. The only thing they have in common is the names and in my system that is not important.

If I was doing goh sau like what you have shown in that clip I would hope that my Teacher would tell me that I had rather a lot of work to do and correct as he did when I first went to him for advice. In fact the first 3 major problems he picked me up on you are showing perfectly in your video. Thats what I would tell a student of mine so why should I say any different to you? It's an honest observation and not a challenge.

You carry on training your champeeens and I'll keep practicing. That will not change and this conversation isn't getting us anywhere is it?

Best wishes

[Alan Orr]

Uh hum! Lets have it right Alan! I didn't say you don't know Wing Chun! What I am saying is that your "version" totally contradicts what I know of Wing Chun so as this is a forum I make some comments with that in mind.

Regardless of any chest beating that may take place if you are prepared to post videos of yourself you must be prepared to take negative comments about them as it seems you do from more people than just me.

I can only give my opinion on what I see and what you say and I don't like any of it! Thats not say its complete rubbish and ineffective. I just don't like it.

I expect to see beginners exchange chi sau like you do and I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that.

What does it matter anyway? I practice the WSLPB method and you practice the Chu method. From your videos I can see that the two systems couldn't be more different. The only thing they have in common is the names and in my system that is not important.

If I was doing goh sau like what you have shown in that clip I would hope that my Teacher would tell me that I had rather a lot of work to do and correct as he did when I first went to him for advice. In fact the first 3 major problems he picked me up on you are showing perfectly in your video. Thats what I would tell a student of mine so why should I say any different to you? It's an honest observation and not a challenge.

You carry on training your champeeens and I'll keep practicing. That will not change and this conversation isn't getting us anywhere is it?

Best wishes

Your post is very funny. You have jumped on every post I have written and have on other threads told me I have no idea in terms of wing chun. Maybe you forget as it is so retarded to say that in the first place.

The other reason you are back on this thread is because someone posted they liked my clip. Why do you keep coming back if you have no interest what I am doing and your style is so different. Weird.


Then you post your little digs at the success of my guys and system. You are just wasting peoples time. Yes we have different ideas on what Chi Sao is - we train Chi Sao to develop skills for fighting. Which we have proved. Your point is nothing.

[Bacon]

Graham as much as I don't think what Alan does is wing chun his fighting method works for him and sometimes you have to take the high road and just leave it alone. Just do what you do. Leave what he does alone, take anything you can from it, and take anything you don't like as an example of what not to do.

[Graham H]

Your post is very funny. You have jumped on every post I have written and have on other threads told me I have no idea in terms of wing chun. Maybe you forget as it is so retarded to say that in the first place.

The other reason you are back on this thread is because someone posted they liked my clip. Why do you keep coming back if you have no interest what I am doing and your style is so different. Weird.


Then you post your little digs at the success of my guys and system. You are just wasting peoples time. Yes we have different ideas on what Chi Sao is - we train Chi Sao to develop skills for fighting. Which we have proved. Your point is nothing.

Whatever girlfriend!

[Alan Orr]

Whatever girlfriend!

Nothing intelligent to say as always

[Alan Orr]

Graham as much as I don't think what Alan does is wing chun his fighting method works for him and sometimes you have to take the high road and just leave it alone. Just do what you do. Leave what he does alone, take anything you can from it, and take anything you don't like as an example of what not to do.

Why would it not be wing chun? I been training wing chun for 25 years. I think I would have known I was doing the wrong style by now.

The reason I post to to show the wing chun system I train in as I know it is different to many others, but that does not mean its not wing chun.

What is the sign of true wing chun? The CSL Wing Chun works so it's not Wing Chun - If it does not work it must be wing chun was Graham's words of wisdom.

This whole thing is so funny. Why do people have to come on to say it's not wing chun. What does that add?

[Bacon]

Why would it not be wing chun? I been training wing chun for 25 years. I think I would have known I was doing the wrong style by now.

The reason I post to to show the wing chun system I train in as I know it is different to many others, but that does not mean its not wing chun.

What is the sign of true wing chun? The CSL Wing Chun works so it's not Wing Chun - If it does not work it must be wing chun was Graham's words of wisdom.

This whole thing is so funny. Why do people have to come on to say it's not wing chun. What does that add?

To be completely honest Alan I have my reasons for thinking what you do isn't wing chun but that's where I'll leave it. I'd rather take anything and everything I can from the way you do things than quibble over minutiae. You enjoy what you do and it works for you. To me that's what's important whether I think it wing chun or not.

[LFJ]

Why would it not be wing chun? I been training wing chun for 25 years. I think I would have known I was doing the wrong style by now.

The reason I post to to show the wing chun system I train in as I know it is different to many others, but that does not mean its not wing chun.

What is the sign of true wing chun? The CSL Wing Chun works so it's not Wing Chun - If it does not work it must be wing chun was Graham's words of wisdom.

This whole thing is so funny. Why do people have to come on to say it's not wing chun. What does that add?

It looks to me like Wing Chun mixed with other stuff, because a lot of it appears to operate outside of WC principles common to all lineages, that would be the "other stuff".

Whether or not it is purely WC though has no bearing on whether or not it works, but that's not what people seem to be taking issue with... or is it?

[Graham H]

Nothing intelligent to say as always

Intelligent. I gave that up with you when I first read your posts and viewed your videos. You may be an ok guy in real life but intelligent wing chun?? Nah!

[anerlich]

It looks to me like Wing Chun mixed with other stuff, because a lot of it appears to operate outside of WC principles common to all lineages, that would be the "other stuff".

I'm far more interested in whether something works than whether it operates within somebody's, perhaps some dead guy's, idea of WC principles, but ...

Wouldn't seeking "WC principles common to all lineages" lead you to the lowest common denominator?

They're guidelines, not constraints.

[LFJ]

Sure, I don't necessarily take issue with Alan's stuff. If it works, it works. WC has clear principles though. If something works outside of that, like roundhouse kicks and hook punches, it simply becomes something different, like JKD.

[Jake104]

Sure, I don't necessarily take issue with Alan's stuff. If it works, it works. WC has clear principles though. If something works outside of that, like roundhouse kicks and hook punches, it simply becomes something different, like JKD.

That's just your opIon of what Wing Chun is or isnt. Some lineages have a hook punch . I know Leung Ting lineage has a hook because i know someone who learned directly from LT and he said they do. So does that mean they don't do WC or WT? Do they do JKd? How do you really know what's what? Were you there when it was created? You know what opinions are like right? Everybody has one.