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Thread: Coaching/teaching is the death of your personal skills

  1. #1

    Coaching/teaching is the death of your personal skills

    You start teaching and before you know it every time you go to class you are running it. In the past every time you went to class you had a workout and learned something new. Now you have to come up with lesson plans and you have to watch people. You hold the pads, fix posture, show takedowns, etc and then spend the rest of class watching everyone fuk it up.

    You hold a stop watch and yell at everyone to keep doing jumping jacks, push ups...and stop doing them on your own. Now you have to teach and find separate days to work out. Then the wife complains that you are doing your Kung foo/mma/boxing every night and ignoring the family. Meanwhile with all this training you are getting fatter. Meanwhile your already fat coach is telling you how much you will learn through teaching. Then I tell him, "Too bad learning new things does not translate into skills".

    Anyone here who teaches classes(not private one person at a time) have a different experience than what I described above?

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    One-your fault that you didn't choose a mate that is supportive of your passion.
    If this is a major part of who you are, then you should have made that clear from the git-go, and she should be on board. If not, you made your choices. Deal with it.

    Two-instead of finding excuses why you can't train, find reasons why you can.
    My first class is at 11am-this gives me the entire morning to do whatever I want.
    I run in the mornings, then teach the tao yoga class to stretch out, drill with my senior students, do my own training after hours,(just finished weight training and iron palm) and fri mornings BJJ, Sat after classes, SPM from 12:30 to 4:00, and if I want, open mat on Sun.(I used to do SJ Sundays from 9am to 1pm as well)

    If it's important to you, you will find the time.
    If it's important to you, she will understand.
    "My Gung-Fu may not be Your Gung-Fu.
    Gwok-Si, Gwok-Faht"

    "I will not be part of the generation
    that killed Kung-Fu."

    ....step.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    I train 3-4 hours throughout the day Mon-Sat, run my own school and still have quality time with the wife and kids.

    I can do all of this easily because of structure and organization.

    First off it depends and who/where you are at your school. Are you an assistant, a black belt instructor or the head instructor?

    All of my instructors under me (black or colored belt) are still students 1st and attend their appropriate level class. They also receive a private lesson each week and we have an instructors meeting/get together once per week at the studio. My instructors are only required to teach 2 days per week but are welcome to help more (which they usually do). They are given a mandatory 1 week off from the studio as an instructor and as a student every 6 months. This keeps my instructors happy and loyal and because of this it allows me to be able to go and train with my coaches throughout the day and night.

    If you are the head instructor you need to put together a structured instructors program and delegate the work. If you are a black belt instructor or an assistant you need to talk to your coach and inform him/her you are getting burnt out.

    From your post it also sounds like you're taking the instructor side too serious. Have fun with it, joke with the students, enjoy them for their mistakes and use it as an opportunity to better them whether it's their first day or they've been there for years. Don't just hold pads and the timer, get in there and train with them. Set up your drills in a round robin and have the students holding the timer as well. Work the mitts and shields with them, have them hold for you. It's in their benefit to learn how to hold mitts, it trains their timing and coordination, lets them see how it should be done and gives them a better understanding of the drill.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by RWilson View Post
    Then I tell him, "Too bad learning new things does not translate into skills".

    Anyone here who teaches classes(not private one person at a time) have a different experience than what I described above?
    I did exactly what you are doing. One guy watched my group class and said, "You are not teaching. You are training for yourself." My class was by semester. Any student drops out, he won't get refund.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 07-03-2012 at 10:16 PM.

  5. #5

    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by TenTigers View Post
    One-your fault that you didn't choose a mate that is supportive of your passion.
    If this is a major part of who you are, then you should have made that clear from the git-go, and she should be on board. If not, you made your choices. Deal with it.

    Two-instead of finding excuses why you can't train, find reasons why you can.
    My first class is at 11am-this gives me the entire morning to do whatever I want.
    I run in the mornings, then teach the tao yoga class to stretch out, drill with my senior students, do my own training after hours,(just finished weight training and iron palm) and fri mornings BJJ, Sat after classes, SPM from 12:30 to 4:00, and if I want, open mat on Sun.(I used to do SJ Sundays from 9am to 1pm as well)

    If it's important to you, you will find the time.
    If it's important to you, she will understand.
    Everyone has their own lot in life I guess. Your plan falls apart though if your mate all of a sudden cannot take the kid to school in the morning. Or if you had to rush home to get him off the bus at 3pm and then rush back to teach at 3:30...but then the school is two towns over. It is team work in the kid department.

    As to your other points:

    1.I am glad you found time to run and do yoga in the mornings. Send a picture of your washboard abs to show the fruit of your supposed labors.
    2. This thread is about skills as in fighting skills. I did not say anything about finding time to do the dreaded iron palm. I can watch porno and fantasize plenty on my own. I do not need to hit bags filled with rocks to feel tough and also to avoid being hit back. It may impress the kids but skills impress me.

    People who train real fighting skills need focused and dedicated coaches. Not alone time in the corner to practice bullsh!t...I mean iron palm. I am glad you are finding time to lift weights(stare at women in the gym) and do iron palm(fantasy) but I was talking about fighting.


    This is what you do from 12:30-4 everyday? I would not brag about it if I were you.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0wRq...e_gdata_player
    Last edited by RWilson; 07-03-2012 at 11:52 PM.

  6. #6
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    So not being funny why are you asking on a kung fu forum, if you feel this way about aspects of kung fu training? why not go ask on the MMA sub forum or another board?
    Ten tigers posted how he keeps HIS class running, if its not what you are looking for then why not go ask at sherdog or MMA.tv?
    Oh and stop b&tching and moaning no one said you had to teach ita a free country, and frankly after your last message I suspect no one gives two sh*ts about anything you have to say

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Bottom line is this:

    Nobody is the same.
    Your shit is yours alone.
    If you don't make the time, you won't have the time.
    Balance is what living a decent life is about.
    If you haven't got it, work on it.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by RWilson View Post
    You start teaching and before you know it every time you go to class you are running it. In the past every time you went to class you had a workout and learned something new. Now you have to come up with lesson plans and you have to watch people. You hold the pads, fix posture, show takedowns, etc and then spend the rest of class watching everyone fuk it up.

    You hold a stop watch and yell at everyone to keep doing jumping jacks, push ups...and stop doing them on your own. Now you have to teach and find separate days to work out. Then the wife complains that you are doing your Kung foo/mma/boxing every night and ignoring the family. Meanwhile with all this training you are getting fatter. Meanwhile your already fat coach is telling you how much you will learn through teaching. Then I tell him, "Too bad learning new things does not translate into skills".

    Anyone here who teaches classes(not private one person at a time) have a different experience than what I described above?
    Yes, Me

    Teaching is a platform that can take your kung fu skills to the next level (if you do it right).

    1. Teaching a form or drills over and over will ingrain them in your muscle memory better. There are form and drills that I will never forget (even if I wanted to forget them).

    2. Drilling with beginners is a great way to improve your skills. Beginners are always unpredictable and force you to keep on your toes. (example I told a beginner to throw a front toe kick and they lauched a left jab to my head... had to react quick).

    3. Working with children will improve your patients and understanding of how all people learn and absorb kung fu skills. I observed some kids learn thru visual seeing it. Some kids learn thru doing it. some kids learn only if I help them move their arms for them etc etc.

    I am almost 50 now and I still fight / spar with my students, I still wrestle / Shuai Chiao with them... there is no excuse really.

    I can go on and on with more examples but it is up to you to make it work.

    Running a school and practicing on your own can be a challenge. I get up before the kids in the am and do a Iron Palm hitting. Then take the kids to school. and head off to the kung fu school. Then I do my own lin gung / cardio workout for myself. (Some summer morning I teach a bunch of kids at their summer camps). Then teach a morning adult kung fu class. Afternoon I do a 2nd Iron Palm hitting and work my forms / drills. Then teach classes from 4-9PM.

    You can do it if you work it right.

    ginosifu
    Last edited by ginosifu; 07-04-2012 at 05:47 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ginosifu View Post
    Yes, Me

    Teaching is a platform that can take your kung fu skills to the next level (if you do it right).

    1. Teaching a form or drills over and over will ingrain them in your muscle memory better. There are form and drills that I will never forget (even if I wanted to forget them).

    2. Drilling with beginners is a great way to improve your skills. Beginners are always unpredictable and force you to keep on your toes. (example I told a beginner to throw a front toe kick and they lauched a left jab to my head... had to react quick).

    3. Working with children will improve your patients and understanding of how all people learn and absorb kung fu skills. I observed some kids learn thru visual seeing it. Some kids learn thru doing it. some kids learn only if I help them move their arms for them etc etc.

    I am almost 50 now and I still fight / spar with my students, I still wrestle / Shuai Chiao with them... there is no excuse really.

    I can go on and on with more examples but it is up to you to make it work.

    Running a school and practicing on your own can be a challenge. I get up before the kids in the am and do a Iron Palm hitting. Then take the kids to school. and head off to the kung fu school. Then I do my own lin gung / cardio workout for myself. (Some summer morning I teach a bunch of kids at their summer camps). Then teach a morning adult kung fu class. Afternoon I do a 2nd Iron Palm hitting and work my forms / drills. Then teach classes from 4-9PM.

    You can do it if you work it right.

    ginosifu
    Nice post. Ginosifu did not Bette me like the other a-hole.

  10. #10
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by RWilson View Post
    Nice post. Ginosifu did not Bette me like the other a-hole.
    To be upfront with you, your style and come on is belittling.

    I mean it's great that you like to be treated with some respect.
    I like it too. In fact, I like it so much I am reciprocal with it.

    No need to put on airs or cause trouble with written snideness and demanding pics of abs and such.

    Own your own stuff. Post your own pics. Prove your own points.
    It can get good.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by ginosifu View Post
    Yes, Me

    Teaching is a platform that can take your kung fu skills to the next level (if you do it right).

    1. Teaching a form or drills over and over will ingrain them in your muscle memory better. There are form and drills that I will never forget (even if I wanted to forget them).

    2. Drilling with beginners is a great way to improve your skills. Beginners are always unpredictable and force you to keep on your toes. (example I told a beginner to throw a front toe kick and they lauched a left jab to my head... had to react quick).

    3. Working with children will improve your patients and understanding of how all people learn and absorb kung fu skills. I observed some kids learn thru visual seeing it. Some kids learn thru doing it. some kids learn only if I help them move their arms for them etc etc.

    I am almost 50 now and I still fight / spar with my students, I still wrestle / Shuai Chiao with them... there is no excuse really.

    I can go on and on with more examples but it is up to you to make it work.

    Running a school and practicing on your own can be a challenge. I get up before the kids in the am and do a Iron Palm hitting. Then take the kids to school. and head off to the kung fu school. Then I do my own lin gung / cardio workout for myself. (Some summer morning I teach a bunch of kids at their summer camps). Then teach a morning adult kung fu class. Afternoon I do a 2nd Iron Palm hitting and work my forms / drills. Then teach classes from 4-9PM.

    You can do it if you work it right.

    ginosifu
    Well said.
    When I teached I always found time to work out and, like Gino said, teaching makes you a better MA because you learn by teaching also, especially kids.
    It is far easier for the full time teacher to maintain their skills of course and that is why I stopped teaching.
    I simply did not have the time to teach AND progress.
    Besides, teaching is NOT for everyone.
    Most of us, myself included, still have FAR TOO Much to learn before it should be "passed on".
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  12. #12
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    I would say it's not really the death of personal skills but the teacher should be there for his students, paying attention to them and not just glorying in what he has to offer them. That means you have to work out on your own time. Class time belongs to the students.

    As previously pointed out, you do learn more and soving problems for others can clarify your thinking about your own training.

    Eventually you may find students good enough to be training partners. That's when you set aside time not for teaching, but for mutual learning. It pays off in the end.
    "Look, I'm only doing me job. I have to show you how to defend yourself against fresh fruit."

    For it breeds great perfection, if the practise be harder then the use. Sir Francis Bacon

    the world has a surplus of self centered sh1twh0res, so anyone who extends compassion to a stranger with sincerity is alright in my book. also people who fondle road kill. those guys is ok too. GunnedDownAtrocity

  13. #13
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    Texas
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    Quote Originally Posted by RWilson View Post
    You start teaching and before you know it every time you go to class you are running it. In the past every time you went to class you had a workout and learned something new. Now you have to come up with lesson plans and you have to watch people. You hold the pads, fix posture, show takedowns, etc and then spend the rest of class watching everyone fuk it up.

    You hold a stop watch and yell at everyone to keep doing jumping jacks, push ups...and stop doing them on your own. Now you have to teach and find separate days to work out. Then the wife complains that you are doing your Kung foo/mma/boxing every night and ignoring the family. Meanwhile with all this training you are getting fatter. Meanwhile your already fat coach is telling you how much you will learn through teaching. Then I tell him, "Too bad learning new things does not translate into skills".

    Anyone here who teaches classes(not private one person at a time) have a different experience than what I described above?

    If you are paying, then you are being screwed. You are providing a service, performing a job of work for the owner of the kwoon or gym. Don't do it. If you do, insist on being paid for it. Your sifu gets lazy and lets you take up his slack.
    Working out and exercising is not training. It is just developing physical fitness for the task. Training is learning martial arts in you case. I would not waste my time doing all that physical stuff as it can be done at home. All this does is take away from your learning experience, which you are paying for. Learning just a tad now and then will take you years to learn. You should be able to master an entire system in under 2 years. After that it is just maintainence.
    Jackie Lee

  14. #14
    Rwilson, it seems you really aren't enjoying teaching, and i'm sure your students are able to sense this in your poor attitude. My advice is to quit teaching since it's not fair to your students or yourself. Go back to being a student somewhere and maybe that will improve your disposition. BTW if you feel that iron palm is fantasy and a waste of time you probably shouldnt be studying chinese martial arts which has many styles that train it with excellent results. It's a basic skill like most training. Saying that iron palm is fantasy is a fantasy in your own head.
    Last edited by Nei-Jia-Quan; 07-04-2012 at 08:05 PM. Reason: Fixed error

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Nei-Jia-Quan View Post
    Rwilson, it seems you really aren't enjoying teaching, and i'm sure your students are able to sense this in your poor attitude. My advice is to quit teaching since it's not fair to your students or yourself. Go back to being a student somewhere and maybe that will improve your disposition. BTW if you feel that iron palm is fantasy and a waste of time you probably shouldnt be studying chinese martial arts which has many styles that train it with excellent results. It's a basic skill like most training. Saying that iron palm is fantasy is a fantasy in your own head.
    I do not teach anymore. I have stepped away from the world of tcma. Iron palm is considered advanced training. Hand conditioning is basic. Iron palm is supposed to be something different from hand conditioning or they woild just call it hand conditioning. So what if you can break a coconut? You cannot do to someone that is actually moving.

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