This website says that these are Pictures of Leung Jan , Leung Bik ?

[Firehawk4]

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=is...20jan#imgdii=_

[KPM]

Did you mean this website?

https://kwansao.wordpress.com/tag/leung-jan/

https://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/0...-bik-released/

https://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/0...-of-leung-bik/

You posted a google search.

Not being a speaker/reader of Chinese I'm not sure what to believe. I would want to know the source of these photos and what the accompanying text says. For all we know someone found a newspaper that had a story about a local town official doing something and the person just happened to be named Leung Jan or Leung Bik. He wouldn't necessarily be the same Leung Jan or Leung Bik of Wing Chun fame.

[Firehawk4]

Hi yeah those are the same pictures there was one of Chan Wah Shun to . So these pictures are fakes then like that Wong Fei Hung picture from Hung Gar floating around on the internet .

[aaronh_sf]

My name is Aaron Hee, i'm a 2nd Generation Sifu in Ip Man lineage, under Chris Chan (陳成, Chan Shing) in San Francisco

First I'd like to point out i'm not making any claims about the photos, i am merely presenting the information i have found in my research. This website was originally intended for me to share information with my hing dai.

I was first given a picture of Leung Jan from Chan Sifu, it is a snapshot of Chinese television. I sat on this for over a year and finally decided it was time to release it on the web:
http://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/03...-of-leung-jan/
As for what the text reads, as I'm mostly illiterate in Chinese, I can't read all the text, but what i can read is,
from the second line:
Leung Jan, (梁贊)
and from the tagline:
Grandmaster of Ip Man. (他就是葉問的師公)
The image is cropped, watermarked and had it's color changed so the full tagline is not present on the image i have posted.

Not long after, I then noticed a post on facebook from a Tsung Xi (from Wing Chun Masters)
http://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/04...-of-leung-bik/
It's supposed to be Leung Bik. The controversy over whether or not he truly existed aside, there is a strong resemblance between the two photos.

Soon after I saw a post by Sam Kwok on Facebook with this image of an Elderly Leung Bik:
http://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/06...-bik-released/
Again, there is more than a passing resemblance between all three photos.

Years later, I noticed that my photo had started to circulate around the internet, without being attributed to me or my teacher, and after doing some research, I happened to find one more photo of a younger Leung Jan, (original source unknown, but found on Adam Willis' site) and also a painted portrait of Leung Jan found on Aaron Cantrell's website.
http://kwansao.wordpress.com/2014/03...jan-leung-bik/

I believe that all this anecdotal evidence is compelling enough to warrant further investigation and I see no reason to doubt them. Firehawk, I see you are from Dayton Ohio, are you a student of Benny Meng? What evidence do you have to suggest that these photographs are fake? Considering all of the images come from different sources and they all look very similar, I cannot dismiss them so easily. And can you explain your claim about the pictures of WFH being fake? I have also heard this before, but visiting the Ip Man Tong & Wong Fei Hung museum in Foshan, their representations of WFH were of a man who looked the same.. (please see attachment)

Regards,
Sifu Aaron Hee
許师父
http://kwansao.wordpress.com
aaron@uswingchun.com



the photo of WFH in question


WFH statue in foshan

[LFJ]

http://kwansao.wordpress.com/2012/03...-of-leung-jan/
As for what the text reads, as I'm mostly illiterate in Chinese, I can't read all the text, but what i can read is,
from the second line:
Leung Jan, (梁贊)
and from the tagline:
Grandmaster of Ip Man. (他就是葉問的師公)

The main line says it's the only picture of Leung Jan.

Comparing the young and old "Leung Bik" photos, they don't look the same to me. The old man has features that I think would be recognizable in his youth, such as the narrow eyes. The young man appears to have a different facial structure. I don't think they are the same person.

[aaronh_sf]

The main line says it's the only picture of Leung Jan.

Yes, you noticed. i tried to address that here:

The image is cropped, watermarked and had it's color changed so the full tagline is not present on the image i have posted.

and as for your second point,

Comparing the young and old "Leung Bik" photos, they don't look the same to me. The old man has features that I think would be recognizable in his youth, such as the narrow eyes. The young man appears to have a different facial structure. I don't think they are the same person.

When I look at both photos of leung jan, as well as the portrait of leung jan, seems like this could be the same man.
the leung bik photo is more of a stretch, but i do think they look similar to the 'leung jan' photo. thing is with these pictures of 'leung bik' they can be attributed to well known wing chun sifus that live in the west, speak english and use the internet, so it's only a matter of time before they weigh in on the subject.

Be well,

Aaron

[Firehawk4]

Hi i am not a student of Sifu Mengs hes a nice man though . I was asuming that these photos might be fake as there is alot of things on the internet these days that claim this or that and people makeing lots of money off people i thought the Wong Fei Hung photo might not be Wong Fei Hung because some Hung Gar people have said that the Wong Fei Hung photo is one of his sons and not Wong Fei Hung .

[LFJ]

Well, that picture certainly appears to be what the statue was based on. It's clearly supposed to be the same person.

[aaronh_sf]

OK i see, well i'd like to find out the truth myself. hopefully we will one day.

-Aaron

[Jim Roselando]

Fraud Alert!

***

#1:Leung Jan photo

Leung Jan was NOT a Qing official!! (The person in the photo is a Qing official)

I have translated the original work, plus the public info, the stories have more holes than Swiss Cheese.

This is an obvious fraud!

#2: Leung Bik photo

They claim it came from the Gulao government but the Gulao government told me;

We don't have any photos of the Leung family other than a great great nephew which is hanging in Leung Jan's home.

I asked 2 Gulao gov officials and the Minister of Defense for Hoksan. All stated the same to me!

IMO. It's another fraud!

***

Caveat Emptor...

[aaronh_sf]

Fraud Alert!

***

#1:Leung Jan photo

Leung Jan was NOT a Qing official!! (The person in the photo is a Qing official)

I have translated the original work, plus the public info, the stories have more holes than Swiss Cheese.

This is an obvious fraud!

#2: Leung Bik photo

They claim it came from the Gulao government but the Gulao government told me;

We don't have any photos of the Leung family other than a great great nephew which is hanging in Leung Jan's home.

I asked 2 Gulao gov officials and the Minister of Defense for Hoksan. All stated the same to me!

IMO. It's another fraud!

***

Caveat Emptor...

You have done the legwork.. Thats great. Can you release your translation?
Supposedly these LB pictures came from individuals, not gov. Workers.
Do you have an image of this nephew?

Thanks,
-Aaron

[kung fu fighter]

They claim it came from the Gulao government but the Gulao government told me;

We don't have any photos of the Leung family other than a great great nephew which is hanging in Leung Jan's home.

Leung Jan's grandson is currently living in Hong Kong, I know his name, but he does not want to be known publicly, so I will not reveal it here. If he mentions certain things it would destroy the reputation of certain linages as well as certain grandmasters causing a lot of feud and disruption within the wing chun community. so it is probably best that he remains unknown.

[aaronh_sf]

I saw this earlier, it reminded me of what you said about a Qing official. do you have the source documents or translation you referred to earlier?

Fraud Alert!

***

#1:Leung Jan photo

Leung Jan was NOT a Qing official!! (The person in the photo is a Qing official)

I have translated the original work, plus the public info, the stories have more holes than Swiss Cheese.

This is an obvious fraud!

#2: Leung Bik photo

They claim it came from the Gulao government but the Gulao government told me;

We don't have any photos of the Leung family other than a great great nephew which is hanging in Leung Jan's home.

I asked 2 Gulao gov officials and the Minister of Defense for Hoksan. All stated the same to me!

IMO. It's another fraud!

***

Caveat Emptor...

Leung Jan's grandson is currently living in Hong Kong, I know his name, but he does not want to be known, so I will not reveal it here.

well I'll take you at your word.

[aaronh_sf]

#2: Leung Bik photo

They claim it came from the Gulao government but the Gulao government told me;

We don't have any photos of the Leung family other than a great great nephew which is hanging in Leung Jan's home.

I asked 2 Gulao gov officials and the Minister of Defense for Hoksan. All stated the same to me!

***
link alert
I found the source.. sorry for not writing it down the first time.

it doesn't appear to be attributed to a gov. member, but rather, the Foshan Jing Wu ass'n chairman, and Leung Yuk Fai, second photo is attributed to Leung Man Lok

Apparently the Foshan Jing Wu Ass'n President published this image:


As for the "older" picture i got that from Sam Kwok's facebook page he originally wrote:
"“詠春宗師梁贊長子_詠春高手.陳華順(找錢華的大師兄)梁璧,八十多歲高齡時在中國廣東省.鶴山.古勞 .西邊村留下的照片
Wing Chun Grandmaster Leung Jan’s eldest son, Leung Bik, a legendary Wing Chun master,which is also Grandmaster Chan Wah Shun’s Siheng/Kungfu elder Brother. This is Grandmaster Leung Bik’s photo during his eighties. Photo sourced from Kulo Village, China “"

Sifu Silvano names his source as Leung Man Lok:



***

[aaronh_sf]

Is this photo (on the wall) the one you were referring to of the nephew?