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Thread: Link to the wc ancestors

  1. #46

    An honest post for Moshe..

    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    I DIDNT WRITE WHO ARE THE ANCESTORS BUT WHAT IS THE LINK ?

    yes others lineages can share their experience and perhaps have the same answer to the question
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    An answer to your question Moshe. The link to Ip man's wing chun is very clear to me. Good sifus are not robots but the conceptual and operational links to Ip man must be there for it to be a version of Ip man wing chun. And it has to be tried out satisfactorily in practice. Given those criteria Sigung
    Ho Kam Ming;'s wing chun and Augustine Fong sifu's wing chun have those conceptual and operational links.
    I respect Ng Chan(and WSL too) but he is not the only one to learn in depth from Ip Man.

    Ho Kam Ming was taught privately by Ip Man for about seven years with daily contact- then they stayed in close touch. Ho took Ip Man to the hospital once on his shoulders down the street because a vehicle was not easily available- attended to him from time to time and was with him the day he died.He went back to Macao before IM died and Ip Ching called him from HK when his father died. Operationally HKM was taught all the forms in great detail and is one of the very few who
    were taught the BJD in complete detail. Fong sifu is one of HKM's best students conceptually and operationally and he has been corrected by Ip man as well during the latter's visits to Macao.And he has fought including for HKM. AF was asked by IM to show one of IM's students who was teaching in Canada- moving chi sao with extensive ma po footwork.

    HKM hada school in Macao, AF has a school in Tucson- neither have opened chain stores and franchises.


    I respect Ng Chan's hand work from what I see in videos but I am not impressed with his footwork
    nor with your chor ma in one video. I respect your short punch though.

    Me- I am just one of Fong sfu's student and wont do any chest beating here. I too have applied what I have learned to my satisfaction, including some folks from other styles pf martial arts and sports. I hope not to add more to the thread..or to debate non IM folks.

    Good fraternal wishes.

  2. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by JPinAZ View Post

    The link is the system itself."this is what the system teaches us"

    The certified link is the transmision of the system as a whole from generation to generation.

    f you are interpretting the concepts/principles differently then your sifu or his sifu, then IMO, the link is already broken -
    yes and for sure ,i already explained this in the ng chan thread

    i explained as well the difference between mainland wing chun and leung chan/leung bik wing chun and why such a difference ,(this difference is not due to the kind of distortion you mentioned but was just the will of leung chan or other ancestors to adapt a new version more democratic and less complicated )

    but its not the answer that im expecting, there is something else
    Last edited by MOSHE; 08-29-2012 at 01:09 AM.

  3. #48
    [QUOTE=Buddha_Fist;1185218]
    Ving Tsun was developed by evolving over time,
    [QUOTE=Buddha_Fist;1185218]


    no ,the foundation should not move and nobody after them had their knoledge to build this system

    to finish to practice something like JKD or to use basic movements of WC like a self defense has nothing to do with what i call wing chun
    Last edited by MOSHE; 08-29-2012 at 01:10 AM.

  4. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
    Moshe seems to be interested in the inter-related questions of how we are linked to a fairly complete version of Ip Man's wing chun other than name dropping and how do we know that what we do is "efficient".


    .The occasional seminar was not the method of learning for Moshe, his sifu or sigung.


    and receive some answers without the common sarcastic overtones that are common at KFo.
    One hopes for something resembling a dialog..

    yes

    so , regarding the first part ,what should be achieved between the sifu and his student

  5. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    An answer to your question Moshe. The link to Ip man's wing chun is very clear to me. Good sifus are not robots but the conceptual and operational links to Ip man must be there for it to be a version of Ip man wing chun. And it has to be tried out satisfactorily in practice. Given those criteria Sigung
    Ho Kam Ming;'s wing chun and Augustine Fong sifu's wing chun have those conceptual and operational links.
    I respect Ng Chan(and WSL too) but he is not the only one to learn in depth from Ip Man.
    Ho Kam Ming was taught privately by Ip Man for about seven years with daily contact- then they stayed in close touch. Ho took Ip Man to the hospital once on his shoulders down the street because a vehicle was not easily available- attended to him from time to time and was with him the day he died.He went back to Macao before IM died and Ip Ching called him from HK when his father died. Operationally HKM was taught all the forms in great detail and is one of the very few who
    were taught the BJD in complete detail. Fong sifu is one of HKM's best students conceptually and operationally and he has been corrected by Ip man as well during the latter's visits to Macao.And he has fought including for HKM. AF was asked by IM to show one of IM's students who was teaching in Canada- moving chi sao with extensive ma po footwork.

    .
    ok ,we spent time with sifu and being good friends, this is important

    but there is a fact that i experienced myself and my sifu before me and so ...
    pehaps ask your sifu about my question

    Best regards Joy

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    yes and for sure ,i already explained this in the ng chan thread

    i explained as well the difference between mainland wing chun and leung chan/leung bik wing chun and why such a difference ,(this difference is not due to the kind of distortion you mentioned but was just the will of leung chan or other ancestors to adapt a new version more democratic and less complicated )

    but its not the answer that im expecting, there is something else
    Moshe when you refer to "Leung Chan" are you referring to Leung Jan or Leung Chun, his other son?

  7. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Moshe when you refer to "Leung Chan" are you referring to Leung Jan
    Yes the father

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    Yes the father
    Thanks for that

  9. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Thanks for that
    Nothing, does it help for something special

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    Nothing, does it help for something special
    My lineage is actually Leung Chun, Biks brother

  11. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    My lineage is actually Leung Chun, Biks brother
    Did you speak before about Chen cen

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    Did you speak before about Chen cen
    Chen cen?

    What do you mean?

  13. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Chen cen?

    What do you mean?
    Don't remember the spelling
    The sifu in quandong
    With some roots in peruvia

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOSHE View Post
    Don't remember the spelling
    The sifu in quandong
    With some roots in peruvia
    No, not familiar with him, im in Australia.

    Here's the family tree if youre interested

    http://users.tpg.com.au/davidrea/kungfu/tree.html

  15. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    No, not familiar with him, im in Australia.

    Here's the family tree if youre interested

    http://users.tpg.com.au/davidrea/kungfu/tree.html
    Sorry
    This one
    Le Shennong bencao jing (ou WG Shen nung pen ts´ao king, Pinyin: ... Sum Nung (Cen Neng) was born in Peru in 1926 but was brought to ... Sum Nung Wing Chun Kuen Articles: Grandmaster Sum Nung ...

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