Post Flow Drills Por Favor

[Michael Dasargo]

Hey Guys, in Mantis Boxing we have a flow drill called Slap and Press
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL5z3K63fTA

I'm curious about flow drill across the board of fighting arts, and where the concepts are embedded within the drill.

While some might argue that flow drills aren't an accurate reflection of how people fight, I find that it develops attributes that are specific the characteristics of the system.

Mike D.

[taai gihk yahn]

Hey Guys, in Mantis Boxing we have a flow drill called Slap and Press
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL5z3K63fTA

I'm curious about flow drill across the board of fighting arts, and where the concepts are embedded within the drill.

While some might argue that flow drills aren't an accurate reflection of how people fight, I find that it develops attributes that are specific the characteristics of the system.

Mike D.

that was VERY nicely done; while I think flow drills have inherent limitations, frankly the way u do them minimizes the pitfalls and maximizes the benefits!

[YouKnowWho]

This kind drill is more useful than the Taiji push hand or WC Chi Shou. If you can add head lock, reverse head lock (guillotine), underhook, overhook, bear hug, ... it will be even better.

[Shaolin]

I'm curious about flow drill across the board of fighting arts, and where the concepts are embedded within the drill.

I think the main concept of any flow drill is to develop smooth transitions between techniques. The art forms and the execution of the drills may vary; and yes there are other benefits to them, but the underlining concept is still the same.

Here's an example of two high level jiu jitsu practitioners flow rolling.

http://youtu.be/hmY8t9L7dRU

[-N-]

I'm curious about flow drill across the board of fighting arts, and where the concepts are embedded within the drill.

Even for a given sequence, there are multiple ways to execute, depending on what concept you choose to emphasize.

The video showed letting the person complete his motion. An alternate way is to intercept his technique early.

Another is to draw his intent and intercept that.

Another sequence - you guys have done the black tiger steals heart, with the running jumping footwork, right?

[Subitai]

haha -N-, You beat me to it....

I was going to say the same thing, The left guy was allowed to enter and strike first. He did say it could be a push, that's true.

But 1/2 the time (when it was a strike)the right guy did "Check" the neck chopping hand.

That's the only thing i'd change...i'd make sure to always check that hand.

As for waiting for him to initiate a push 1st...well that's easy. Act surprised and let it happen. haha

But they could also do it so that the left guy works an intercept 1st for example and then while his right hand is closer...it could steal in for the push. That would make sense.

Also if left guy altered mid drill and block punched the guys rt shoulder instead...it would take allot from his structure. It would totally throw off the drill.
One of many possibilities.

I like it over-all it's GOOD and can appreciate the timing and skill. But i'd change that one piece.


Lastly IMO, No it's not better than 2 WC dudes Loosely and freely applying WC Chi Sao. Reason being, when it's fee and spontaneous that's where humans truely trick eachother. In other words it would be totally random.


These dudes are only following a set group of techniques in their flow drill. It's GOOD for what it is...but i'm sure if it was more random, there would be much more timing breaks. I'm sure they probably do have a more random method. Most good schools do.

"O"

Oh and lastly that dude looks Pinoy...if he is, he's even better skilled and also good looking.

[-N-]

Lastly IMO, No it's not better than 2 WC dudes Loosely and freely applying WC Chi Sao. Reason being, when it's fee and spontaneous that's where humans truely trick eachother. In other words it would be totally random.

These dudes are only following a set group of techniques in their flow drill. It's GOOD for what it is...but i'm sure if it was more random, there would be much more timing breaks. I'm sure they probably do have a more random method.

This exercise is one of the standard ones trained by Mantis.

Sometimes people look at it as individual action and reaction per each movement of the sequence.

If that's the case, then someone might want to randomize it for spontaneity at that level.

It is useful to look at the sequence as 2 groups of 3 move combinations. Each group is a variation on the other, but with the same starting entry point.

This is a deeper level concept of the routine.

It is purposely designed to give the student ability to spontaneously throw either of the 2 combo sequences.

The key is the transition move. At that point, either of the 2 combos can emerge.

This transition is supposed to become reflex. Then it carries over to other classical Mantis setups and combos.

[-N-]

While some might argue that flow drills aren't an accurate reflection of how people fight, I find that it develops attributes that are specific the characteristics of the system.

Mike D.

The grouping and transitions of 2 x 3 combo movements is an accurate reflection of how Mantis fights.

I know Mike knows this.

Just putting it out there for those that might be wondering.

[Syn7]

that was VERY nicely done; while I think flow drills have inherent limitations, frankly the way u do them minimizes the pitfalls and maximizes the benefits!

No doubt, I liked it too.

[-N-]

This kind drill is more useful than the Taiji push hand or WC Chi Shou. If you can add head lock, reverse head lock (guillotine), underhook, overhook, bear hug, ... it will be even better.

Haha, so what's the bear hug guy's move after you dump him on his head?

[YouKnowWho]

Haha, so what's the bear hug guy's move after you dump him on his head?

He can stand on his opponent's dead body and perform "white crane flips wings" to prove that he is a Taiji guy, or perform "Bong Shou" to prove that he is a WC guy.

[-N-]

He can stand on his opponent's dead body and perform "white crane flips wings" to prove that he is a Taiji guy, or perform "Bong Shou" to prove that he is a WC guy.

You made me spit tea on my ipad...

[taai gihk yahn]

He can stand on his opponent's dead body and perform "white crane flips wings" to prove that he is a Taiji guy, or perform "Bong Shou" to prove that he is a WC guy.

just some advice John, when u win the Int3rn3tz like that, if u don't kno what to do w it, just ask bawang, as he's won it many times

[Michael Dasargo]

that was VERY nicely done; while I think flow drills have inherent limitations, frankly the way u do them minimizes the pitfalls and maximizes the benefits!

Thanks bro! FYI,

-N- taught me the drill.

Mike D.

[Michael Dasargo]

If you can add head lock, reverse head lock (guillotine), underhook, overhook, bear hug, ... it will be even better.

Yes! I know there are grappling flow drills like pummeling neck ties, under over clinch etc, but there's not any that develops the indicator for a striking opportunity, or a striking flow drill that transitions into clinch controls.

Great idea...gonna have to look outside of mantis and find the common threads.

Mike D.