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Thread: Thoughts on Pak Sau

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    It's just a movie guys. It's scripted and has nothing as far as real combative value. Now cut out the Bruce Lee circle jerk and discuss something worthwhile.
    I believe we are discussing a Wing Chun X pak sau that was done by a famous Wing Chun practitioner in a martial arts movie on a Wing Chun forum. I don't believe we're out of bounds here.
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
    In that crossing hands with Wall in Enter the Dragon-it was a beautiful move.He adapted wing chun for the requirements of the movie- nothing wrong with that.
    Wish I could have said this first. Beat me to it, Joy.
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    I believe we are discussing a Wing Chun X pak sau that was done by a famous Wing Chun practitioner in a martial arts movie on a Wing Chun forum. I don't believe we're out of bounds here.
    It's on the exact same level as discussing the application of things Jet Li does in his movies. It's a film. There's nothing of actual combat in it. If you want to look to things for technique and application look at trained fighters against other trained fighters not some guy who did movies, looked cool, and had no fight record beyond unverifiable stories tossed around.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    It's on the exact same level as discussing the application of things Jet Li does in his movies. It's a film. There's nothing of actual combat in it. If you want to look to things for technique and application look at trained fighters against other trained fighters not some guy who did movies, looked cool, and had no fight record beyond unverifiable stories tossed around.
    We are not talking about a Wu Shu champion who made it into movies.

    We are talking about a famous martial artist, who studied under a very famous Wing Chun instructor, who taught and created his own art, and inspired millions with his kung fu movies (we have all watched a hundred times) on a Wing Chun forum. I think it's pretty legit conversation.

    So what's your fighting record like?
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    We are not talking about a Wu Shu champion who made it into movies.
    You're talking about an actor who has no legitimate fight record. The two are equivalent.

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    We are talking about a famous martial artist,
    Martial artists means nothing if you don't fight skilled opponents.

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    who studied under a very famous Wing Chun instructor
    Who cares. That doesn't mean a thing. There are guys who studied from videotapes and went to fight in the UFC with good success while people who trained under very legitimate instructors failed to measure up.

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    who taught and created his own art
    Again who cares. I could create my own art, it doesn't mean a thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    and inspired millions with his kung fu movies
    Just like Sylvester Stallone in Rocky....

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    I think it's pretty legit conversation.
    I think there's no reason to take his fighting abilities seriously since he never fought anyone worthwhile and because of that there's no reason to look to him for any kind of fighting application when there are plenty of other worthwhile idols who actually fought skilled opponents. I can name tons off the top of my head who were from or before his era. Masahiko Kimura, The Great Gama, Karl Gotch, Muhammed Ali, Jack Dempsey, Sonny Liston... The list goes on, and those aren't even counting the more modern Vale Tudo matches and MMA. Even the guys who stepped up in the early UFC and got their butts handed to them by Royce Gracie had more balls than Bruce.

    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    So what's your fighting record like?
    Don't try to change to an irrelevant subject. If you want we can discuss that on another thread but it has no relevance to the fact that Bruce Lee has nothing really to do with fighting compared to others who could be used as examples.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  6. #21
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    "I think there's no reason to take his fighting abilities seriously since he never fought anyone worthwhile"

    With this logic, I guess you could say YM,WSL,PB,LT,Emin, William Cheung, and every other Master of ANY MA shouldn't be taken seriously because none of them have "fought anybody worthwhile". Your argument is stupid. Unless you knew BL,or sparred BL, or fought BL, you really don't know. So to argue about something you don't know, is silly and stupid.

  7. #22
    Let's put it this way Jake, I'd be far more afraid of Kimura than of Kano and more inclined to listen to anything he had to say because he put his money where his mouth was.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jake104 View Post
    "I think there's no reason to take his fighting abilities seriously since he never fought anyone worthwhile"

    With this logic, I guess you could say YM,WSL,PB,LT,Emin, William Cheung, and every other Master of ANY MA shouldn't be taken seriously because none of them have "fought anybody worthwhile". Your argument is stupid. Unless you knew BL,or sparred BL, or fought BL, you really don't know. So to argue about something you don't know, is silly and stupid.
    Totally agree with you.

    Bacon - no sense in debating this with you. You believe what you believe, and it certainly isn't my job to try and change that. Besides, I really don't care. I don't take anything on this forum too seriously anyway. 90% of it is laughable fantasy. I'm just killing a liitle time cause I'm laid up with the flu. Peace...
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by thedreamer7 View Post
    I'd say it was a fun movie scene, but has little to do with Wing Chun unless we over simplify Wing Chun and strip it down to the barest of technique level, but that isn't really what Wing Chun is.

    Looking at it from principle level, I'd say he was giving up most of the WC concept/principles in preference of speed. Look at his narrow fencing stance at the setup. And then when he 'pak das' he is hopping up out of his root and shifting most all his weight to the front leg, his hands have a long/short problem, does not even address the bridge, etc. This tells me he is ignoring WC self centerline & A-to-B centerline theories, duei ying facing & gate theories, opponent's gravity, etc to execute a 'technique' as fast as possible in a lucky strike manner.

    But then really, it IS a movie and it does LOOK cool (whcih is most important in a film), so not really sure why it's being discussed
    What chi sau is, or isn't, or is, or wait, what is it..: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...2&postcount=90

  10. #25
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    Oh FFS..... its a movie scene!

    It may look flash, buts its as relevant to fighting as a good cake recipe.

    If you want to see someone that is magic to watch AND can fight.... watch this chap

    Bruce wouldnt know last a round.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VLWBVpL23k

  11. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Oh FFS..... its a movie scene!

    It may look flash, buts its as relevant to fighting as a good cake recipe.

    If you want to see someone that is magic to watch AND can fight.... watch this chap

    Bruce wouldnt know last a round.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VLWBVpL23k
    Yeah some people just don't understand that it's better to take fighting advice from a fighter than from an actor
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  12. #27
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    JPinAZ - this is off topic. Are you a part of HFY in Arizona? If so, who is your SiFu?
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
    Oh FFS..... its a movie scene!

    It may look flash, buts its as relevant to fighting as a good cake recipe.

    If you want to see someone that is magic to watch AND can fight.... watch this chap

    Bruce wouldnt know last a round.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VLWBVpL23k
    Are we comparing martial arts to boxing now? Boxing is a sport. With rules, gloves, mouthpieces, breaks. You're on the wrong forum.
    Your journey ends at my feet.

    *It takes effort to learn to do something without*

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    JPinAZ - this is off topic. Are you a part of HFY in Arizona? If so, who is your SiFu?
    Yes, I run a small HFY club here in Tempe/Mesa, as well as help out at the AZ Kwoon on occasion. My first HFY sifu was Richard Loewenhagen and my current HFY sifu is GM Garrett Gee, why do you ask?
    Last edited by JPinAZ; 12-05-2012 at 02:18 PM.
    What chi sau is, or isn't, or is, or wait, what is it..: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...2&postcount=90

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by mun hung View Post
    Are we comparing martial arts to boxing now? Boxing is a sport. With rules, gloves, mouthpieces, breaks. You're on the wrong forum.
    Oh, sorry for introducing actual fighting...... ill leave you to your movie reviews

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